Israeli-Palestinian conflict (23 Viewers)

[Omair]

Why do they deserve a nation more than Israel? And the UN Charter did not TAKE their country away, they never had one. It GRANTED them a nation in the West Bank, etc. Heck, Jerusalem was a part of their land grant, but they did not accept it. They would only accept pushing the Jews into the sea. Well they failed and they will continue to fail. When they want to accept a free nation, they will have it. As long as they want war they will have it.

Because basically the Palestinians lived there for thousands of years while, on the other hand, most of the Jews currently in Israel came from around the world to establish their nation on the expense of the locals. Just check the number of Jews in Palestine before 1900 and after 1900. No one can deny that some Jews lived, as a minority, there for ages but at least they lived side by side with Muslims and Christians, more importantly peacefully! That's for one.

Two, Why Palestine? Ask the British Mandate and Balfour they are the one responsible of that. It's their "promised land". I'm not sure though who promised it to them but surely they make it sound that it's their right by blood no matter what. To most Arabs (not governments, but people), a two state solution is not an option, not even if Israel admits the atrocities they've done in those massacres and readmit natives to their lands. Governments, on the other hand, might accept that solution under those two conditions. We might argue forever about how Arabs promised those natives and how they didn't keep that promise but you know it's their land and saying that Jews came over and found no one there so they took it isn't gonna change that fact because, again, it's the same Jews who ran those massacres which made those lands "empty".

three, please read my previous post and response to it. Although it's covered with sarcasm, It is a serious post and I would really like to know how would you response to that point of view..

PS. I'm calling the land "Palestine" because that's the official name for it in all history books I have read. Palestine the holy land. whether Israel, Palestinian Government or any other body governed that land I will still call it Palestine.

 

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[Italia Todd]

To most Arabs (not governments, but people), a two state solution is not an option, not even if Israel admits the atrocities they've done in those massacres and readmit natives to their lands. Governments, on the other hand, might accept that solution under those two conditions.

Well, if a two state sollution is not an option, then the war and misery we have now is the only option. Because there is no third alternative. So the question is, do you want peace and a nation or do you want constant war and suffering?

it's the same Jews who ran those massacres which made those lands "empty".

I don't deny the wrongs the Jews perpetrated, but there were plenty of Arab massacres as well, my friend. It was a two-way street, and neither side has ANY moral high ground on this one.

three, please read my previous post and response to it. Although it's covered with sarcasm, It is a serious post and I would really like to know how would you response to that point of view..

I'm not sure the post you are talking about, but I'll search for it. It will be a little while before I'm back on here though, give me a couple of hours, I'm about to have to run out.

PS. I'm calling the land "Palestine" because that's the official name for it in all history books I have read. Palestine the holy land. whether Israel, Palestinian Government or any other body governed that land I will still call it Palestine.

If you look in Arab history books perhaps. The name Palestine did not exist before the second century when the Romans named it that. If you want the name of the land from antiquity you can call it either Israel or Canaan.

 

[Italia Todd]

Ok, since Palestine were never a self-governing region how about we band together and go to some region of the world and occupy it. It's just a suggestion .. maybe someone fantasizes some spanish territory, Indian territory, anyone? I know for sure that the Eastern region of Saudi Arabia were never a self governing region! Either under Saudi Arabia, Ottomans, Caliphate, Persians or just tribes! they're just parts of a nation. they have no right to live there. while we're at we should terrorize the hell out of them and make them run for their lives and then deny their right to come back, saying that they were never a self governing nation!! I like it!! as a bonus we can take all the oil in there!! All we need is approval form the UN!

Italia Todd, see how absurd this sounds? that's exactly how we're reading what you're saying ..

If this is the post you talk about then it is stupid. Houston is a self-governing region. We have a local government, with local government officials. We are a part of Texas and we have governing officials who we send to the state capital in Austin and thereby help to run the state. Often the "ruler" (i.e. governor) of the entire state has been a man from Houston. We are also (by choice) a part of the United States of America, and we elect and send representatives and senators (often some of the most influential in the country) to D.C. to run the nation, and 4 of the last 7 presidential terms for this country have been served by men from the great state of Texas.

No I don't think my argument is silly at all, I think yours is irrational, emotional and poorly thought out.

 

[ReBeL]

If this is the post you talk about then it is stupid. Houston is a self-governing region. We have a local government, with local government officials. We are a part of Texas and we have governing officials who we send to the state capital in Austin and thereby help to run the state. Often the "ruler" (i.e. governor) of the entire state has been a man from Houston. We are also (by choice) a part of the United States of America, and we elect and send representatives and senators (often some of the most influential in the country) to D.C. to run the nation, and 4 of the last 7 presidential terms for this country have been served by men from the great state of Texas.

No I don't think my argument is silly at all, I think yours is irrational, emotional and poorly thought out.

You're talking about Houston with pride as if it is the centre of the universe, And you don't rate Palestine as a country.

Go play with a nice kite, my dear...

 

[Italia Todd]

You're talking about Houston with pride as if it is the centre of the universe, And you don't rate Palestine as a country.

Go play with a nice kite, my dear...

Actually, I would move out of Houston in a heartbeat if I could. For the time I have left in the US I would rather live in Dallas or San Antonio. And within 10 years I'll be living in either Italy (most likely) or possibly even Galilee. I was merely stating facts.

 

[Omair]

If this is the post you talk about then it is stupid. Houston is a self-governing region. We have a local government, with local government officials. We are a part of Texas and we have governing officials who we send to the state capital in Austin and thereby help to run the state. Often the "ruler" (i.e. governor) of the entire state has been a man from Houston. We are also (by choice) a part of the United States of America, and we elect and send representatives and senators (often some of the most influential in the country) to D.C. to run the nation, and 4 of the last 7 presidential terms for this country have been served by men from the great state of Texas.

No I don't think my argument is silly at all, I think yours is irrational, emotional and poorly thought out.

no not Houston, the eastern province of Saudi Arabia, Houston was Ahmed's joke to get back at you ..

 

[Ahmed]

no not Houston, the eastern province of Saudi Arabia, Houston was Ahmed's joke to get back at you ..

I wasn't kidding...Texas was promised to my people

 

[GordoDeCentral]

you gotta love new born christian who regurgitate what their happy pill popping limbaugh shits in their ears. oh and btw i believe the correct spelling is tejas

 

[Omair]

I wasn't kidding...Texas was promised to my people

you weren't? well then I'd like to hear an interesting story!

 

[IrishZebra]

We were promised Northern Ireland :depressed

 

[Omair]

Seems only Jews get what they were promised. I wonder why?

 

[Fred]

Well, if a two state sollution is not an option, then the war and misery we have now is the only option. Because there is no third alternative. So the question is, do you want peace and a nation or do you want constant war and suffering?



I don't deny the wrongs the Jews perpetrated, but there were plenty of Arab massacres as well, my friend. It was a two-way street, and neither side has ANY moral high ground on this one.



I'm not sure the post you are talking about, but I'll search for it. It will be a little while before I'm back on here though, give me a couple of hours, I'm about to have to run out.



If you look in Arab history books perhaps. The name Palestine did not exist before the second century when the Romans named it that. If you want the name of the land from antiquity you can call it either Israel or Canaan.

Peace will only come when Palestinians get their land back.

Until then, yes the only option is war, but it should be our(Arabs) war not only Palestinian people.

 

[Italia Todd]

you gotta love new born christian who regurgitate what their happy pill popping limbaugh shits in their ears. oh and btw i believe the correct spelling is tejas

Hey, idiot, I don't listen to fat Limbaugh, as I said, I am a socialist and a pacifist, so if you want to attack me you have to drop your stereotypes, thank you very much.

Peace will only come when Palestinians get their land back.

Until then, yes the only option is war, but it should be our(Arabs) war not only Palestinian people.

Fine. Israel has been kicking your @sses for 62 years, by all means continue to have your sons and daughters killed in a needless bloodbath when instead you could achieve peace and statehood.

 

[Fred]

Hey, idiot, I don't listen to fat Limbaugh, as I said, I am a socialist and a pacifist, so if you want to attack me you have to drop your stereotypes, thank you very much.



Fine. Israel has been kicking your @sses for 62 years, by all means continue to have your sons and daughters killed in a needless bloodbath when instead you could achieve peace and statehood.

Corrupt governments that do not give a shit for anything other than staying in power can be blamed for that.

I always say, no occupation stays forever, history has taught us that. You can spin it whatever way you like, but in the end Israel is the very definition of a military occupation. Someday they will be kicked the fuck out.

 

[Fred]

Moral of the story:

Live in the city, its safer?

 

[ReBeL]

Fine. Israel has been kicking your @sses for 62 years, by all means continue to have your sons and daughters killed in a needless bloodbath when instead you could achieve peace and statehood.

Kicking our asses?

How old are you?

Let's say I have a beautiful cottage in the countryside. I really really like the cottage. One day a tall man shows up. In fact it's the tallest man I've ever seen. He breaks both arms of my daughter and says that if I don't move, he'll break her legs too. Now I have several options:

a) I go to the police and see if they can help me.
b) I stick around, my daughter gets hurt.
c) I move.

Obviously I go for option a. After all in a just world the police would give me a hand, the tall man would be thrown in jail and all would be swell. Only this is not a just world. The police do not step in and leave me hanging. I still refuse to move. The tall man breaks the legs of my daughter. She may never walk again.

You are totally right, but you can not control the behaviour of thousands of scared people in a sudden war...

Unfortunately, our grandfathers and grandmothers have run away carrying nothing but their houses keys thinking they would be back soon. The keys are still there but people have passed away and houses were demolished or used by aliens...

His profile says he was born in 1967.

I doubt that a guy more than 40 years old will say in a political debate that these people kicked those people's asses.

 

[Italia Todd]

I'm born in 75, i.e. 34 years old. And the level of my arguments will match the level of my opposition. With the stupidity being spewed in this thread there is reall no room for sound reasoning and argumentation because it is being/has been ignored.

 

[ReBeL]

But I think some people are focussing too much on what is right. Was it right to produce the state of Israel? Probably not. Was it because some of us felt morally obliged? Maybe.

But that was a long time ago. If we're going to hold on to these moral ideas of justice and crime, we're not going to get a practical solution. So why focus on getting Palestina back? Why focus on destroying Isreal? Why not think about the lives of those people instead of using all these big words and grand ideas?

Ok. Let's not think about destroying Israel. We will talk just about people...

Give the people in Gaza any hope of living without siege.
Give the refugees, especially those in Lebanon a hope to end their suffering.
Give more than 10000 prisoners a hope that they will be free ever.
Give the people in the West Bank a guarantee that no more lands will be stolen of them to build settlements for aliens.
Give the Arabs inside Israel another guarnatee that their lands won't be taken from them to give to extremists jews.

And the list continues..

It was a joke. You know what happend in 1967.

I was too lazy to check his profile, so I thought that it is just maybe a coincidence

 

[Ahmed]

Pretty much yeah. It's a barren wasteland. Just move. The biggest problem I have with Israel is not allowing people to move. That's the real tragedy. I don't care about the land, but you can't keep people locked up and then complain when they get all nervous.

it might be a barren wasteland, but it's their barren wasteland...not some fake Russian Jews

 

[Ahmed]

doesn't mean they can't fight for it