He's omnipotent. What would be the point? I mean, if he was going to make us and "leave us on our own", why bother making us at all. He certainly doesn't "need" us.
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In the category 'redundant': Catholicism (18 Viewers)
- Thread starter Slagathor
- Start date
He's omnipotent. What would be the point? I mean, if he was going to make us and "leave us on our own", why bother making us at all. He certainly doesn't "need" us.
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Me personally? I'm a Cafeteria Everything. I haven't considered myself exclusively Catholic since the 80s.
But I'm guessing you're directing this question in the general case...
At one extreme, what really makes one a Methodist, Calvinist, Presbyterian or Baptist? There is an element of religious self-determination here: you are what you say or think you are. And within any religion, you have opposing factions that prefer bend versus break or vice versa.
Religious purists and conservatives ("break") lament the impurity that the "believers on the fence" bring. Yet they are often outnumbered by many who participate in religions like Catholicism or Bhuddism or Shintoism as a construct upon which to facilitate the self-discovery of their own personal metaphysical beliefs ("bend"). There are many people in the "bend" category that appreciate the foundation their choice of religion offers, plus the social aspects, and yet don't feel that their beliefs can simply be "mandated" by another authority and yet remain genuine.
This is a conflict that is playing itself out in Islam to a very public degree (though the conflict doesn't have a singular authoritarian voice, which exacerbates matters). But it's also true in Catholicism (I have inkings that American bishops may break off into a separate Catholicm if truly forced to by the Vatican, btw), Presbyterians and their position on gays, etc.
I don't think a dictionary definition of religious faith does it any justice, because, as George W Bush proves, religious faith isn't something that can be handled with clinical precision.
So what are we left with? Anglicans connect and identify with the Church of England, Catholics connect and identify with the Vatican, etc. There are so many gray areas of "how practicing do you need to be to be a member of x faith?", and so many different people who interpret those boundaries, that all we're left with is generalizations and rules of thumb.
But I'm guessing you're directing this question in the general case...
At one extreme, what really makes one a Methodist, Calvinist, Presbyterian or Baptist? There is an element of religious self-determination here: you are what you say or think you are. And within any religion, you have opposing factions that prefer bend versus break or vice versa.
Religious purists and conservatives ("break") lament the impurity that the "believers on the fence" bring. Yet they are often outnumbered by many who participate in religions like Catholicism or Bhuddism or Shintoism as a construct upon which to facilitate the self-discovery of their own personal metaphysical beliefs ("bend"). There are many people in the "bend" category that appreciate the foundation their choice of religion offers, plus the social aspects, and yet don't feel that their beliefs can simply be "mandated" by another authority and yet remain genuine.
This is a conflict that is playing itself out in Islam to a very public degree (though the conflict doesn't have a singular authoritarian voice, which exacerbates matters). But it's also true in Catholicism (I have inkings that American bishops may break off into a separate Catholicm if truly forced to by the Vatican, btw), Presbyterians and their position on gays, etc.
I don't think a dictionary definition of religious faith does it any justice, because, as George W Bush proves, religious faith isn't something that can be handled with clinical precision.
So what are we left with? Anglicans connect and identify with the Church of England, Catholics connect and identify with the Vatican, etc. There are so many gray areas of "how practicing do you need to be to be a member of x faith?", and so many different people who interpret those boundaries, that all we're left with is generalizations and rules of thumb.
Not aimed at anyone, OK?
but
The Church has no power whatsoever (in the earthly sense)--apart from the Message. When was the last time someone was excommunicated?
The Church's mission is as witness. Period. Faith and morals have been clarified (tweaked, if you prefer that term) through the centuries, but that is the amazing attractiveness of the Catholic Church: it stays the course, proclaiming essentially the same message as to Faith and Morals (yes, the "housekeeping" can change: does the priest face the people or the Crucifix, for example; can priests be married?--essentially yes before around 1100, no for the Roman Catholic rite since then)...
but Faith and Morals have not changed, and will not change. Which, to me, is conforting.
but
The Church has no power whatsoever (in the earthly sense)--apart from the Message. When was the last time someone was excommunicated?
The Church's mission is as witness. Period. Faith and morals have been clarified (tweaked, if you prefer that term) through the centuries, but that is the amazing attractiveness of the Catholic Church: it stays the course, proclaiming essentially the same message as to Faith and Morals (yes, the "housekeeping" can change: does the priest face the people or the Crucifix, for example; can priests be married?--essentially yes before around 1100, no for the Roman Catholic rite since then)...
but Faith and Morals have not changed, and will not change. Which, to me, is conforting.
TonyMontana said:
Sorry to hear:frown: , you dont have to go personal man. A simple yes or no will do
Avarege huh. Have you been religious for the better part of your life? and Were you raised in a religious upbringing?.
Sorry for the 20 questions, that one up there is the last one, thx for answering them.
Avarege huh. Have you been religious for the better part of your life? and Were you raised in a religious upbringing?.Sorry for the 20 questions, that one up there is the last one, thx for answering them.
Been fairly religious all my life, but really felt called closer to God in the last 10-15 years.
Yes, I was raised RC.
I agree with you to an extent. But there have been popes in the past where you could argue that "protection" might include progressivism. The Second Vatican Council, for an obvious example. But even then I think that was less about protectionism than an attempt to get the followers to better engage the Church and integrate it more into their daily lives.
And it's easy to be myopic about the RC too. It has a long lineage and draws a lot from its adherence to a supposed singular and constant traditional faith. But the Pope was at least as much of a political figure in the early centuries as opposed to today.
And the whole thing about priests taking a vow of chastity seems like it harkons back to the Church's foundations, but it was only instituted as late as the 11th century (and cynically, primarily so that the Church wouldn't owe a dowry to any widows). So when the American bishops suggest married priests to partially address the shortage and to modernize the faith, and the Vatican comes back with, "No way, José", it's not on the basis of protecting Church tradition that the Vatican big wigs make it out to be.
And it's easy to be myopic about the RC too. It has a long lineage and draws a lot from its adherence to a supposed singular and constant traditional faith. But the Pope was at least as much of a political figure in the early centuries as opposed to today.
And the whole thing about priests taking a vow of chastity seems like it harkons back to the Church's foundations, but it was only instituted as late as the 11th century (and cynically, primarily so that the Church wouldn't owe a dowry to any widows). So when the American bishops suggest married priests to partially address the shortage and to modernize the faith, and the Vatican comes back with, "No way, José", it's not on the basis of protecting Church tradition that the Vatican big wigs make it out to be.
He loves Man. Leaving us on our own? He is always there. It is just some never put in the effort to communicate with God. They cannot blame Him for not being there when they chose not to communicate with Him.
Have you heard the story of the footprints on the sand?
Man was walking along the beach with the Lord. There were two sets of footprints as they walk along the journey of Life. However, when Man was going through a suffering and crisis, he only sees one set of deep and heavy footprints. He thought the Lord had forsaken him when he was down and at his lowest point. He cired: "My Lord, why have you forsaken me at the lowest period of my life??"
The Lord then replied: "My Son, I was carrying you during that time.."
We need a personal relationship with God. And Christians believe that Jesus is the One that brings us closer to God/builds the bridge between Man and God. Therefore we pray through Jesus.
But how to achieve the personal relationship with God and Jesus? Prayer is one of them. Reading His Word is also one method. Most importantly, we have to put God first in our hearts and do His will; to spread the Word of God and the Truth.
It is up to every single soul and their discretion to make this decision to believe in Him and have a personal relationship with God. He is putting us all to a test. That's why there's a Judgement Day at the end of the Endtimes (which I believe is now or very soon).
However, it is sad that people choose to ignore and don't believe in any single thing and turing away. Sometimes some of the believers got too extreme and it might turn people even more away from salvation.
The reason why Christians and maybe Catholics(I'm not sure) ask others to believe in their religion is because it is God's will and it is our purpose. The end times is approaching and people want their fellow mates and families and other men to join them in heaven through salvation.
Just sharing His Word..hope i do not offend anyone with this post. God bless you all
Have you heard the story of the footprints on the sand?
Man was walking along the beach with the Lord. There were two sets of footprints as they walk along the journey of Life. However, when Man was going through a suffering and crisis, he only sees one set of deep and heavy footprints. He thought the Lord had forsaken him when he was down and at his lowest point. He cired: "My Lord, why have you forsaken me at the lowest period of my life??"
The Lord then replied: "My Son, I was carrying you during that time.."
We need a personal relationship with God. And Christians believe that Jesus is the One that brings us closer to God/builds the bridge between Man and God. Therefore we pray through Jesus.
But how to achieve the personal relationship with God and Jesus? Prayer is one of them. Reading His Word is also one method. Most importantly, we have to put God first in our hearts and do His will; to spread the Word of God and the Truth.
It is up to every single soul and their discretion to make this decision to believe in Him and have a personal relationship with God. He is putting us all to a test. That's why there's a Judgement Day at the end of the Endtimes (which I believe is now or very soon).
However, it is sad that people choose to ignore and don't believe in any single thing and turing away. Sometimes some of the believers got too extreme and it might turn people even more away from salvation.
The reason why Christians and maybe Catholics(I'm not sure) ask others to believe in their religion is because it is God's will and it is our purpose. The end times is approaching and people want their fellow mates and families and other men to join them in heaven through salvation.
Just sharing His Word..hope i do not offend anyone with this post. God bless you all
Tom said:
detail
I believe that non-believers are missing out, sure. (That is NOT a judgemental statement--it is certainly not my place to judge someone's beliefs or lack thereof).
I want to share the joy that I have as a believer, sure--but, following the example of the RC faith (at least in modern times--John Paul II leaps to mind) I won't be "in your face about it". I believe we are here to proclaim by example.
Does that answer you, amico mio?
