Bardock said:
From The meaning of life, innit(
)?
)?
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In the category 'redundant': Catholicism (8 Viewers)
- Thread starter Slagathor
- Start date
Yes, not their best work though. Considering I am a fan of Flying Circus and their masterpiece Life of Brian along with their on stage performances precisely Live on the Hollywood Bowl, I consider Meaning of Life a flop somehow.
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I have a question for those more well-versed in the subject...
Being Catholic means following the beliefs set down by the Pope who acts as the Vicar of Christ and God's voice, no? Where would that put the ordinary priests of Christian churches then? Do they disagree with the Pope? And are they not themselves preachers of their faith just as the Pope is, albeit with some differences?
Not trying to make a point or anything.
Being Catholic means following the beliefs set down by the Pope who acts as the Vicar of Christ and God's voice, no? Where would that put the ordinary priests of Christian churches then? Do they disagree with the Pope? And are they not themselves preachers of their faith just as the Pope is, albeit with some differences?
Not trying to make a point or anything.
Boy, did I find a great time to get sucked into meetings all day at work...
What an amusing little thread here.
First we have:
As someone who was originally raised Catholic, from several generations of Catholics, I can definitely relate to the reality of what mikhail wrote here.
Then we get:
Sounds like a definition concocted by non-Catholics to me.
And added to that:
Now it's getting interesting. But, errr... following Pope Urban VI in the late 14th century, you almost have to ask which pope for a while there.
I grew up in an environment as Catholic as they come, and most every "self-proclaimed" (if that adjective suits you better) Catholic I knew growing up never subscribed to that model of belief. Of course, I grew up in the fairly liberal Catholicism of Chicago (as opposed to the orthodoxy the Spanish missions seem to have brought out in California, for example). But the Pope's will being the definition of Catholicism? If I may borrow another's coin of phrase here, sell that sh*t to the Vatican City tourists.
What next? Non-Muslims telling other Muslims that they are not really Muslims because of their beliefs towards a given fatwa? This is shadier than Andy denouncing Americans for not supporting the USA NT in WC 2006 above all others, otherwise they aren't really Americans.
Although I really haven't considered myself a tride and true Catholic for almost 20 years, I still draw upon those roots a little more than the other faiths and religious teachings I have also drawn from since then. But let me tell you a story that, to me, was the ultimate, definitive Catholic experience in my entire life. And it will be telling about my perspective on this.
It's the fall of 1995, and I'm standing in the Sistine Chapel in Vatican City. Everyone is staring at the ceiling to admire Michelangelo's masterpiece. Up along the walls and along the rafters, the voice of authority is loud and clear. There's almost a military-like presence of clergy out to basically intimidate everyone into reverence and obedience. The rules that these thugs of the cloth are out to impose?
1. No photography. Hey, papa needs some new shoes from the postcard proceeds down at the gift shop.
2. Silence!!!
The last is the best, most telling one. Because people are gathered and packed into this relatively small chapel, staring at some of the most legendary art in the world ... images of divinity that have arguably defined the Church, in part. And people are awestruck. Their mouths are half open. And with arms outstretched, they spin in circles pointing things out to the marvels with the family or friends next to them.
And encountering such legendary beauty, what do people naturally want to do? Talk! That's what they do. To do otherwise would be akin to seeing Schindler's List at the theater and then leave with your friends or family, saying, "Nice flick. Hey, who's up for a burger?" So people are compelled to talk. They make noise. And it builds and builds ... until the voice of authority from on high suddenly says once again, "Silence!!!"
And everyone recognizes the voice of authority. And they pay respects and understand why it is there -- the importance of respect and reverence in their lives, the foundation it provides to their faith. But to keep silent is simply impossible. So the noise level continues to slowly rise again, minute-by-minute, until.... The cycle just continues.
The whole experience to me was the definitive metaphor for Catholicism -- and for the dichotomy many Catholics experience. On the one hand, you have the voice of moral authority... the foundation and history of the faith represented in the Pope, in the clergy, in the requests for respect and reverence. And the followers of the Church recognized their spiritual need for that bedrock, and thereby heeded its call.
But there are times where the situation is terribly impractical. The imperfect Catholic says, "I understand the premarital sex thing ... the contraception thing. I respect that. But then also hey, I'm 17, full of hormones, she's hot, we've had a lot of beer, and I'm not ready to be a dad." Wink wink. Look the other way. The crowd makes noise again to speak amongst each other of the beauty they are beholding.
That, to me, was the definition of being Catholic.
What an amusing little thread here.
First we have:
As someone who was originally raised Catholic, from several generations of Catholics, I can definitely relate to the reality of what mikhail wrote here.
Then we get:
Sounds like a definition concocted by non-Catholics to me.
And added to that:
Now it's getting interesting. But, errr... following Pope Urban VI in the late 14th century, you almost have to ask which pope for a while there.
I grew up in an environment as Catholic as they come, and most every "self-proclaimed" (if that adjective suits you better) Catholic I knew growing up never subscribed to that model of belief. Of course, I grew up in the fairly liberal Catholicism of Chicago (as opposed to the orthodoxy the Spanish missions seem to have brought out in California, for example). But the Pope's will being the definition of Catholicism? If I may borrow another's coin of phrase here, sell that sh*t to the Vatican City tourists.
What next? Non-Muslims telling other Muslims that they are not really Muslims because of their beliefs towards a given fatwa? This is shadier than Andy denouncing Americans for not supporting the USA NT in WC 2006 above all others, otherwise they aren't really Americans.
Although I really haven't considered myself a tride and true Catholic for almost 20 years, I still draw upon those roots a little more than the other faiths and religious teachings I have also drawn from since then. But let me tell you a story that, to me, was the ultimate, definitive Catholic experience in my entire life. And it will be telling about my perspective on this.
It's the fall of 1995, and I'm standing in the Sistine Chapel in Vatican City. Everyone is staring at the ceiling to admire Michelangelo's masterpiece. Up along the walls and along the rafters, the voice of authority is loud and clear. There's almost a military-like presence of clergy out to basically intimidate everyone into reverence and obedience. The rules that these thugs of the cloth are out to impose?
1. No photography. Hey, papa needs some new shoes from the postcard proceeds down at the gift shop.
2. Silence!!!
The last is the best, most telling one. Because people are gathered and packed into this relatively small chapel, staring at some of the most legendary art in the world ... images of divinity that have arguably defined the Church, in part. And people are awestruck. Their mouths are half open. And with arms outstretched, they spin in circles pointing things out to the marvels with the family or friends next to them.
And encountering such legendary beauty, what do people naturally want to do? Talk! That's what they do. To do otherwise would be akin to seeing Schindler's List at the theater and then leave with your friends or family, saying, "Nice flick. Hey, who's up for a burger?" So people are compelled to talk. They make noise. And it builds and builds ... until the voice of authority from on high suddenly says once again, "Silence!!!"
And everyone recognizes the voice of authority. And they pay respects and understand why it is there -- the importance of respect and reverence in their lives, the foundation it provides to their faith. But to keep silent is simply impossible. So the noise level continues to slowly rise again, minute-by-minute, until.... The cycle just continues.
The whole experience to me was the definitive metaphor for Catholicism -- and for the dichotomy many Catholics experience. On the one hand, you have the voice of moral authority... the foundation and history of the faith represented in the Pope, in the clergy, in the requests for respect and reverence. And the followers of the Church recognized their spiritual need for that bedrock, and thereby heeded its call.
But there are times where the situation is terribly impractical. The imperfect Catholic says, "I understand the premarital sex thing ... the contraception thing. I respect that. But then also hey, I'm 17, full of hormones, she's hot, we've had a lot of beer, and I'm not ready to be a dad." Wink wink. Look the other way. The crowd makes noise again to speak amongst each other of the beauty they are beholding.
That, to me, was the definition of being Catholic.
swag said:
Boy, did I find a great time to get sucked into meetings all day at work...
What an amusing little thread here.
First we have:
As someone who was originally raised Catholic, from several generations of Catholics, I can definitely relate to the reality of what mikhail wrote here.
Then we get:
Sounds like a definition concocted by non-Catholics to me.
And added to that:
Now it's getting interesting. But, errr... following Pope Urban VI in the late 14th century, you almost have to ask which pope for a while there.
I grew up in an environment as Catholic as they come, and most every "self-proclaimed" (if that adjective suits you better) Catholic I knew growing up never subscribed to that model of belief. Of course, I grew up in the fairly liberal Catholicism of Chicago (as opposed to the orthodoxy the Spanish missions seem to have brought out in California, for example). But the Pope's will being the definition of Catholicism? If I may borrow another's coin of phrase here, sell that sh*t to the Vatican City tourists.
What next? Non-Muslims telling other Muslims that they are not really Muslims because of their beliefs towards a given fatwa? This is shadier than Andy denouncing Americans for not supporting the USA NT in WC 2006 above all others, otherwise they aren't really Americans.
Although I really haven't considered myself a tride and true Catholic for almost 20 years, I still draw upon those roots a little more than the other faiths and religious teachings I have also drawn from since then. But let me tell you a story that, to me, was the ultimate, definitive Catholic experience in my entire life. And it will be telling about my perspective on this.
It's the fall of 1995, and I'm standing in the Sistine Chapel in Vatican City. Everyone is staring at the ceiling to admire Michelangelo's masterpiece. Up along the walls and along the rafters, the voice of authority is loud and clear. There's almost a military-like presence of clergy out to basically intimidate everyone into reverence and obedience. The rules that these thugs of the cloth are out to impose?
1. No photography. Hey, papa needs some new shoes from the postcard proceeds down at the gift shop.
2. Silence!!!
The last is the best, most telling one. Because people are gathered and packed into this relatively small chapel, staring at some of the most legendary art in the world ... images of divinity that have arguably defined the Church, in part. And people are awestruck. Their mouths are half open. And with arms outstretched, they spin in circles pointing things out to the marvels with the family or friends next to them.
And encountering such legendary beauty, what do people naturally want to do? Talk! That's what they do. To do otherwise would be akin to seeing Schindler's List at the theater and then leave with your friends or family, saying, "Nice flick. Hey, who's up for a burger?" So people are compelled to talk. They make noise. And it builds and builds ... until the voice of authority from on high suddenly says once again, "Silence!!!"
And everyone recognizes the voice of authority. And they pay respects and understand why it is there -- the importance of respect and reverence in their lives, the foundation it provides to their faith. But to keep silent is simply impossible. So the noise level continues to slowly rise again, minute-by-minute, until.... The cycle just continues.
The whole experience to me was the definitive metaphor for Catholicism -- and for the dichotomy many Catholics experience. On the one hand, you have the voice of moral authority... the foundation and history of the faith represented in the Pope, in the clergy, in the requests for respect and reverence. And the followers of the Church recognized their spiritual need for that bedrock, and thereby heeded its call.
But there are times where the situation is terribly impractical. The imperfect Catholic says, "I understand the premarital sex thing ... the contraception thing. I respect that. But then also hey, I'm 17, full of hormones, she's hot, we've had a lot of beer, and I'm not ready to be a dad." Wink wink. Look the other way. The crowd makes noise again to speak amongst each other of the beauty they are beholding.
That, to me, was the definition of being Catholic.
What an amusing little thread here.
First we have:
As someone who was originally raised Catholic, from several generations of Catholics, I can definitely relate to the reality of what mikhail wrote here.
Then we get:
Sounds like a definition concocted by non-Catholics to me.
And added to that:
Now it's getting interesting. But, errr... following Pope Urban VI in the late 14th century, you almost have to ask which pope for a while there.
I grew up in an environment as Catholic as they come, and most every "self-proclaimed" (if that adjective suits you better) Catholic I knew growing up never subscribed to that model of belief. Of course, I grew up in the fairly liberal Catholicism of Chicago (as opposed to the orthodoxy the Spanish missions seem to have brought out in California, for example). But the Pope's will being the definition of Catholicism? If I may borrow another's coin of phrase here, sell that sh*t to the Vatican City tourists.
What next? Non-Muslims telling other Muslims that they are not really Muslims because of their beliefs towards a given fatwa? This is shadier than Andy denouncing Americans for not supporting the USA NT in WC 2006 above all others, otherwise they aren't really Americans.
Although I really haven't considered myself a tride and true Catholic for almost 20 years, I still draw upon those roots a little more than the other faiths and religious teachings I have also drawn from since then. But let me tell you a story that, to me, was the ultimate, definitive Catholic experience in my entire life. And it will be telling about my perspective on this.
It's the fall of 1995, and I'm standing in the Sistine Chapel in Vatican City. Everyone is staring at the ceiling to admire Michelangelo's masterpiece. Up along the walls and along the rafters, the voice of authority is loud and clear. There's almost a military-like presence of clergy out to basically intimidate everyone into reverence and obedience. The rules that these thugs of the cloth are out to impose?
1. No photography. Hey, papa needs some new shoes from the postcard proceeds down at the gift shop.
2. Silence!!!
The last is the best, most telling one. Because people are gathered and packed into this relatively small chapel, staring at some of the most legendary art in the world ... images of divinity that have arguably defined the Church, in part. And people are awestruck. Their mouths are half open. And with arms outstretched, they spin in circles pointing things out to the marvels with the family or friends next to them.
And encountering such legendary beauty, what do people naturally want to do? Talk! That's what they do. To do otherwise would be akin to seeing Schindler's List at the theater and then leave with your friends or family, saying, "Nice flick. Hey, who's up for a burger?" So people are compelled to talk. They make noise. And it builds and builds ... until the voice of authority from on high suddenly says once again, "Silence!!!"
And everyone recognizes the voice of authority. And they pay respects and understand why it is there -- the importance of respect and reverence in their lives, the foundation it provides to their faith. But to keep silent is simply impossible. So the noise level continues to slowly rise again, minute-by-minute, until.... The cycle just continues.
The whole experience to me was the definitive metaphor for Catholicism -- and for the dichotomy many Catholics experience. On the one hand, you have the voice of moral authority... the foundation and history of the faith represented in the Pope, in the clergy, in the requests for respect and reverence. And the followers of the Church recognized their spiritual need for that bedrock, and thereby heeded its call.
But there are times where the situation is terribly impractical. The imperfect Catholic says, "I understand the premarital sex thing ... the contraception thing. I respect that. But then also hey, I'm 17, full of hormones, she's hot, we've had a lot of beer, and I'm not ready to be a dad." Wink wink. Look the other way. The crowd makes noise again to speak amongst each other of the beauty they are beholding.
That, to me, was the definition of being Catholic.
No good; that's so close to my house you're socially obliging me to come to the meeting as well
So you don't hate us? Great!
Italy tried to create some laws allowing gays to sign parternship contracts (not marriage, mind you) earlier this year and since Italy is a nation known for its numerous referenda, it held a referendum on it. Most people are so sick of the referenda due to overkill that they were reluctant to vote and knowing this; the Catholic Church urged its members to vote against the law so it wouldn't get passed. It worked; all the Catholics in the nation voted no and gay couples were left without many freedoms they do possess in other Western nations.
So you discriminate us, oppress us, but...
...you don't hate us.
Goodie!
So you don't hate us? Great!
Italy tried to create some laws allowing gays to sign parternship contracts (not marriage, mind you) earlier this year and since Italy is a nation known for its numerous referenda, it held a referendum on it. Most people are so sick of the referenda due to overkill that they were reluctant to vote and knowing this; the Catholic Church urged its members to vote against the law so it wouldn't get passed. It worked; all the Catholics in the nation voted no and gay couples were left without many freedoms they do possess in other Western nations.
So you discriminate us, oppress us, but...
...you don't hate us.
Goodie!
@ Erik-I don't believe in imposing my beliefs on others. what other Catholics did does not necessarily mean that all Catholics think that way. In fact, at least in the US most Catholics would never ever do anything like that.
@ Swag: I have no problem with what you wrote, but in this case the comparison between Islamic Fatwas and Catolic authority is not a good one, as the Catholic church IS based on the structure of authority within the church, while Islam is NOT based on any religious power structure in the same sense
@ Swag: I have no problem with what you wrote, but in this case the comparison between Islamic Fatwas and Catolic authority is not a good one, as the Catholic church IS based on the structure of authority within the church, while Islam is NOT based on any religious power structure in the same sense
Understood... which is why I used the "what's next?" line, basically extending upon the theme to illustrate a point.
For example, there are many, many Catholics who have a deep reverence and respect for the Pope, but don't buy into absolutely everything from the guy's pen. This is why there's so much public dissent within the Church about the current papacy and even the previous -- and vocal preferences for a more liberal pontiff. People already believe what they believe; they are hoping to have a Pope who can support those beliefs.
I grew up with my mother literally telling me when I was in grade school that it's OK to disagree with the Church and the Pope for that matter.
For example, there are many, many Catholics who have a deep reverence and respect for the Pope, but don't buy into absolutely everything from the guy's pen. This is why there's so much public dissent within the Church about the current papacy and even the previous -- and vocal preferences for a more liberal pontiff. People already believe what they believe; they are hoping to have a Pope who can support those beliefs.
I grew up with my mother literally telling me when I was in grade school that it's OK to disagree with the Church and the Pope for that matter.
TonyMontana said:
Ok. Ahh, Its tough for me to continue this conversation and still be polite, but ill take a risk and ask anyway. Do you think that you have had a hard life or an easy one? If u dont mind me asking
Edit- Changed discussion to conversation.
Edit- Changed discussion to conversation.
My daughter almost died at birth. I would say average.