And Marchisio doesn't even count because he already played several games for us in Serie B. He already had a spot in the team, yet they loaned him out anyway. 
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Iago Falqué (73 Viewers)
- Thread starter Marceℓℓo
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And Marchisio doesn't even count because he already played several games for us in Serie B. He already had a spot in the team, yet they loaned him out anyway.
This is true.I wonder where the pro-abortion members will come chiming in to protest our pro-life
:edit: I added Criscito to the list after you replied to it.
I'm not a big fan of the endless loans we go through, even less of the co-owning crap (should be illegal), but that's a bit harsh if you ask me.
There's no denying that this Iago loan has been a disaster. But do you really think that Bari as a club (be it coach or management) would keep a player out of the team if he could be helpful to them? That just doesn't add up to me.
Furthermore, there was an interview with Iago a while back which was posted here, in which the kid himself admitted to not being ready (not strong enough physically) for Serie A football.
Just look at our own situation. We have a loaned player in our team ourselves. The people in charge seem to think that he's better than our other options at RB, so he gets the nod. Even though it's far from certain that he will be here next season.
There's no denying that this Iago loan has been a disaster. But do you really think that Bari as a club (be it coach or management) would keep a player out of the team if he could be helpful to them? That just doesn't add up to me.
Furthermore, there was an interview with Iago a while back which was posted here, in which the kid himself admitted to not being ready (not strong enough physically) for Serie A football.
Just look at our own situation. We have a loaned player in our team ourselves. The people in charge seem to think that he's better than our other options at RB, so he gets the nod. Even though it's far from certain that he will be here next season.
It's not harsh, is rather accurate. Who knows, maybe Bari's formation with the majority of players they had available did not suit Iago. Loans in general are a bad idea when you presume that he will play regularly. If you want a player to remain loyal, hardworking and successful for a club then the player needs to stay at that club. Look at Criscito for example, his loyalties lay elsewhere now because a club gave him an honest chance. We didn't yet some people have the gull to call him a traitor because he doesn't want to leave Genoa for Juve. how can you blame him?
Criscito would have benefited if Ranieri had give him an honest chance 2 years ago. Not to mention we would have benefited as well because we wouldn't but stuck with Grosso on the left.
Criscito would have benefited if Ranieri had give him an honest chance 2 years ago. Not to mention we would have benefited as well because we wouldn't but stuck with Grosso on the left.
No need to convince me about the dangers of loaning out players. I am very well aware of those. And like I said, we have way too much of those deals anyway (although that probably has more to due with the Italian system, rather than Juve's own persistence to send youngsters away).
But assuming a certain player doesn't get any chances just because he has to go back to his own club after a certain period of time is not accurate at all.
There are examples enough. Marchisio was loaned and got to play. Same for De Ceglie and many others.
I'm not saying these loans were necessary for us, but the fact remains that we loaned them and they did play.
But assuming a certain player doesn't get any chances just because he has to go back to his own club after a certain period of time is not accurate at all.
There are examples enough. Marchisio was loaned and got to play. Same for De Ceglie and many others.
I'm not saying these loans were necessary for us, but the fact remains that we loaned them and they did play.
The played yes when they were loaned. But did DCs loan serve us? Did Gio's loan serve us? Yago's didn't. Ariaudo's has yet to be determined. Marchisio? Just look at the posts andy and I sent to each other before u joined into the debate. We made some good points, I mean how have these loans (other than saving payroll) have served this club and the players involved simultaneously?
Yes, I have read all those posts (otherwise I would not have interfered).
Yes, you both made some good points.
Yes, most of these past loan deals haven't exactly served us well.
Like I said myself, I'm not to keen on the endless loaning & co-owning myself (which have a lot to do with the Italian system, no denying that).
But, I didn't think my point was that difficult to understand: If Iago would have been a useful player for Bari, he would have played. Regardless of whether he was their own player, a loaned one or a co-owned one.
So, seeing him return to us & immediately reading some opinions that we should try him makes me very skeptical. Because how exactly is a player that was barely good enough for Bari's primavera going to help us? I hope I'm wrong though, since I did like those few things I saw of him.
And to answer your question about the ones you mentioned:
Marchisio is debatable. I won't say that loan benefitted us a lot, but it didn't do any harm either.
De Ceglie: He was in no way ready back then to be a first team player. But as it turns out, he isn't good enough now either. So yeah, that loan didn't serve us, but we had no way of knowing that back then.
Gio: Not too sure what to make of that situation. He obviously improved in that season at Empoli, was recalled, but ended up sitting on the bench most of the time. Definitely not an ideal situation.
Yes, you both made some good points.
Yes, most of these past loan deals haven't exactly served us well.
Like I said myself, I'm not to keen on the endless loaning & co-owning myself (which have a lot to do with the Italian system, no denying that).
But, I didn't think my point was that difficult to understand: If Iago would have been a useful player for Bari, he would have played. Regardless of whether he was their own player, a loaned one or a co-owned one.
So, seeing him return to us & immediately reading some opinions that we should try him makes me very skeptical. Because how exactly is a player that was barely good enough for Bari's primavera going to help us? I hope I'm wrong though, since I did like those few things I saw of him.
And to answer your question about the ones you mentioned:
Marchisio is debatable. I won't say that loan benefitted us a lot, but it didn't do any harm either.
De Ceglie: He was in no way ready back then to be a first team player. But as it turns out, he isn't good enough now either. So yeah, that loan didn't serve us, but we had no way of knowing that back then.
Gio: Not too sure what to make of that situation. He obviously improved in that season at Empoli, was recalled, but ended up sitting on the bench most of the time. Definitely not an ideal situation.
And Marchisio doesn't even count because he already played several games for us in Serie B. He already had a spot in the team, yet they loaned him out anyway.
Giovinco, De Ceglie and Marchisio all benefitted from their loan deals, don't try to dress it up any other way. They did well for those clubs respectively and played games in the top division. What has happened to them afterwards is nothing to do with their loan deals, it is to do with their talent and how our coach uses them.
Marchisio had a spot on our team lol, a couple of games in Serie B means he has a spot in a Serie A team now, great stuff.
Why anybody would say all loan deals are bad in general is retarded, people get agendas on here and run with them, but then we have been over this a dozen times and will do a dozen more, every time there is a failed loan deal.
Whisper it quietly, but Albin Ekdal is doing well on loan. Let's focus on the likes of Daud and Iago though
I love the completely negative slant here. Great job you two, made me laugh anyway
Giovinco, De Ceglie and Marchisio all benefitted from their loan deals, don't try to dress it up any other way. They did well for those clubs respectively and played games in the top division. What has happened to them afterwards is nothing to do with their loan deals, it is to do with their talent and how our coach uses them.
Marchisio had a spot on our team lol, a couple of games in Serie B means he has a spot in a Serie A team now, great stuff.
Why anybody would say all loan deals are bad in general is retarded, people get agendas on here and run with them, but then we have been over this a dozen times and will do a dozen more, every time there is a failed loan deal.
Whisper it quietly, but Albin Ekdal is doing well on loan. Let's focus on the likes of Daud and Iago though
Giovinco, De Ceglie and Marchisio all benefitted from their loan deals, don't try to dress it up any other way. They did well for those clubs respectively and played games in the top division. What has happened to them afterwards is nothing to do with their loan deals, it is to do with their talent and how our coach uses them.
Marchisio had a spot on our team lol, a couple of games in Serie B means he has a spot in a Serie A team now, great stuff.
Why anybody would say all loan deals are bad in general is retarded, people get agendas on here and run with them, but then we have been over this a dozen times and will do a dozen more, every time there is a failed loan deal.
Whisper it quietly, but Albin Ekdal is doing well on loan. Let's focus on the likes of Daud and Iago though
Marchisio didn't need to go on loan, he already had a spot on the team, if you recall correctly.
Giovinco does not have a spot on the team, so you can't admit loaning him worked out well, but of course you don't want to admit that.
Whatever. Just agree to disagree. You can laugh all you want, but the majority of loan deals haven't worked out well for us in the long run.
Palladino had a spot there as well and look how that turned out. Nocerino was a gun in his Piacenza days, am not saying average the guy was their best player. Serie B can tell us shit about the players' real abilities imo.
But I agree he didn't need the loan because the guy is that good. Now whether he would've got the same amount of chances, that is a different case. I reckon he wouldn't have got a chance which would have lead to hampering his development.
But I agree he didn't need the loan because the guy is that good. Now whether he would've got the same amount of chances, that is a different case. I reckon he wouldn't have got a chance which would have lead to hampering his development.
Are you insane Iceman? 
If we shipped every player off for a mistake or two we would be without Melo, Sissoko(last game alone), Marchisio, Amauri, IQ, Chiellini, Grygera, Caceres, Grosso, DC, etc, etc, etc.............
Seriously though, its not fair that youngsters are held to this double standard then. Shipped out after a couple mistakes when you should be addressing the plethora of retards we have in our senior team.
If we shipped every player off for a mistake or two we would be without Melo, Sissoko(last game alone), Marchisio, Amauri, IQ, Chiellini, Grygera, Caceres, Grosso, DC, etc, etc, etc.............
Seriously though, its not fair that youngsters are held to this double standard then. Shipped out after a couple mistakes when you should be addressing the plethora of retards we have in our senior team.