Bianconero_Aus

Beppe Marotta Is My God
May 26, 2009
81,117
I'm inclined to think the same.

Alto my version is that he could have attempted this year, but with the coach change he decided not to take the financial risk and bought the understudy's +bench options instead.

Next season, especially if Allegri succeeds here (wich i hope, cause it means juve doing well, wich we ALL most hope), then we kinda need a starting winger.
Possibly thats the reason why we didn't go for a "top player" in this window. It would sort of make sense too. But yeah, would be nice to finally sign a game changing winger/Am whatever next season and signal our intent as a top club in Europe again.
 

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Bianconero81

Ageing Veteran
Jan 26, 2009
40,177
Next year: "So? We offloaded our dead bodies (Evra, Pereyra, Bonucci, Romulo, Marotta, Pepe, Padoin, Allegri, Motta, Marrone) and added quality to the squad in Bonaventura, Del Grosso, Pinzi, Mazzari and Diego Forlan."

10/10 would do again
:lol: :tup: I'm not saying the mercato is horrible, but it certainly isn't as glamorous or magnificent as some are proclaiming it to be.

Talks of a dream mercato, and the perfect 10 are beyond delusional and retarded.
 

Scottish

Zebrastreifenpferd
Mar 13, 2011
10,289
If these players we've bought turn out to be useful and usable it will have been a good mercato. We did next to no rotation last season because our bench options sucked hard. Having the option to rest our first team before big games could make the difference in The Champions League.

I would obviously have preferred to see us sign top class players and have some of our current starters as our bench, but then there's the whole money thing. Evra has allowed us to play a back 4, but I don't see how the rest of the team will line up and look dangerous.
 

Suns

Release clause?
May 22, 2009
22,089
The Juve cycle

May: Juve win scudetto, people pinpoint weaknesses and set expectations for the summer
June: Massive names linked to Juve, we're all going crazy. We're loving it.
July: We sign some random out of the blue, people wonder wtf but still have hope cuz there is time left
August: Panic mode, we start looking for any half decent declining star. Cardozo? Lisandro Lopez?
 

PedroFlu

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2011
7,166
Marotta: 57yrs old.

1986-89 - worked as a board member of Monza.
1989 - 1995 - board member of Como and Ravenna.
1995-2000 - Venezia general manager - in 98-99 Venezia reaches promotion to Serie A; 99-2000 Venezia manages to remain at Serie A.
2000-2002 - Atalanta general sportive director. Reaches Atalanta's historic record of points in Serie A so far in one of these 2 seasons.
2002-2010 - Sampdoria's general manager.
- 2002-2003 - reorganizes Sampdoria's staff, hierarchy, players; reaches promotion to Serie A.
- 2004 -2010 - becomes both general manager and delegated manager (same position as with Juve)
- 2007-2008 - brings Cassando back to Sampdoria from Real Madrid; Sampdoria has a great season at Serie A.
- also bought Pazzini to Sampdoria in that spell.
-2009-2010 - best performance by Sampdoria in the last 15 yrs, reaching 4th post at Serie A - qualified to play pre-CL
- may 2010 -hired by Agnelli as Juve's general manager and delegated manager.

Main transfers at Sampdoria from 2005:
2005: (-0.5M) nothing very relevant
2006: (-15M) signs Bonazzolli 5M; Maggio 3M; Bonanni and Accardi 2M; Quagliarella 1.5M; sells Kutuzov 2M
2007: (+9.5M) signs Caracciolo 4.5M; Ziegler 2M; Cassano on loan; sells Quagliarella 7M; Caracciollo 7M
2008: (-27M) signs Pazzini 9M; Dessena 7M; Cassano 3.3M; Bottinelli 3M; Stankevicius 3M; sells Maggio 8M
2009: (+6M) signs Semioli 5M; Mannini 3.5M; sells Campagnaro 7M
2010: (+4M) signs Biabiany 7M; Pozzi 5M; sells Pazzini 18M; Marilungo 5M

Highlights from 2005-2010: Spends a total of 23M in 5 years, considering signings and sales; Sampdoria has great results at Serie A; discovers Italian players like Quagliarella, Maggio, Pazzini, buying from a low cost (except Pazzini) and then selling them for good profit; brings Cassano back. Look always into Italy to make his signings.

Sabatini: 59 yrs old - former professional footballer

1986-1990 - Perugia - trained youth teams
1990 - Perugia - became responsible for the entire youth setup
1990-92 - Perugia - becomes both main assistant manager of the coach and remains responsible for the youth setup
1992-94 - Lazio - responsible for youth setup. Nest and Di Vaio start for professionals.
1994-98 - Triestina - general manager
1998-2000 - Arezzo - general manager - saves from relegation to Serie C in first year; achieves promotion to A in next year, working with Serse Cosmi
2000-2005 - FIGC suspends him from his functions for 5 years, due to problems related to young players (maybe he was also managing some of them, or trying to abuse some of them - not sure about that).
2005-2008 - Lazio's general sporting director. Qualifies to CL in 2007.

- players main transactions while working at Lazio:

2005: (-1M) signs Behrami for 3M from Genoa; Handanovic loaned in; gets rid of old expensive washed up players like Claudio Lopez, etc.
2006: (-13.5M) signs Makinwa from Palermo for 6M; Cristian Ledesma from Lecce for 5M; Mauri and Cribari for 3M; sells Oddo for 8M.
2007: (-6M) signs Muslera for 3M; Radu on loan for 0.9M; Kolarov signed for 0.8M
2008: (-12M) signs Carrizo for 7.5M; Radu for 4.5M; Rozehnal for 3.5M; Mauro Zarate on loan for 3.5M; Kozak for 1.2M; Licht for 1.2M; sells Behrami and Mudingayi for 6M each.

2008-2010 (november) - Palermo - General Sportive Director (in 2008 worked till 30th june for Lazio; from July on for Palermo)
Main transactions for Palermo:

2008: (+12M) signed Bovo 8M; Nocerino 7.5M; Raggi 7M; Amelia 6M; Budan 5M; Kjaer 4M; Lanzafame 2.5M; sells Amauri 23M; Barzagli 14M; Zaccardo 7M; Rinaudo 5M; Tulio de Melo 4M.
2009: (-9.5M) signs Pastore 7M; Rubinho 5M; Bertolo 4M; Sells Amelia 5M
2010: (-7M) signs Pinilla 5M; Ezequiel Munoz 5M; Pablo Gonzalez 5M; Ilicic 2.3M; Bacinovic 1.3M; Kurtic 0.8M; Matteo Darmian; Sells Kjaer 12M; loan Cavani out 5M

Highlights from 2005-2010, working for Lazio and Palermo:spends a total of 37M, considering signings and sales; Lazio achieved 4th place; Palermo had probably the best string of its history in Serie A.
Main transactions: overpaid 6M for Makinwa, when at Lazio; paid 5M for Ledesma; signed Radu for 5.5M; Kolarov for 0.8M; Overpaid 7.5M for Carrizo; signed Licht for 1.2M; overpaid 8M for Bovo, 7.5M for Nocerino, 7M for Raggi, 5M for Budan; Oversold Amauri 23M; sold Barzagli 14M; found Pastore for 7M; Ezequiel Munoz for 5M; Ilicic for 2.3M; Kurtic for 0.8M; sold Kjaer for 12M; agreed to loan Cavani out for 5M.


So this is their resume before Agnelli decided to go for Marotta in 2011, instead of Sabatini, who went to Roma. Don't know if Agnelli considered Sabatini then.

Marotta clearly had less money to work with, and aimed at Italian players. Sabatini always looked more for youth, having been a youth ranks coach and responsible for many years. Sabatini clearly always worked with a much more broad scouting network.

- - - Updated - - -

Now Sabatini's job at Roma:

2011: (-64M) signs Lamela 17M; Osvaldo 16M; Bojan 12M; Pjanic 11M; Borriello 10M; Borini 9M; Stekelenburg 7M; Jose Angel 4.5M; Kjaer 3M loan; Gago loan 0.5M; Marquinho loan 0.25M; sold Vucinic 15M; Menez (8M);
2012: (-22M) signs Destro 16.5M; Marquinhos 7M; Castan 5M; Balzaretti 4.5M; Bradley 3.75M; Marquinho 3.5M; Tachtidisidis 2.5M; sells Borini 13.5M
2013: (+45M) signs Rudi Garcia coach; signs Strootman 16.5M; Benatia 13.5M; Ljacic 11M; Gervinho 8M; Jedvaj 5M; Leandro Paredes 4M; Nainggolan (15M); Sells Marquinhos 31M; Lamela 30M; Osvaldo 15M; Bojan 13M; Bradley 7.5M; Stekelenburg 5.5M; Nico Lopez 4M; Tachtidisids 3M.
2014: (-37M): signs Iturbe 22M; Sanabria 5M; Ucan 5M; Astori 7M; Emanuelson, Cole, Keita, free. Sold Dodo, Jedvaj on loan (1M for each).

Total spent in 4 years: 78M (19.5M per season).

Worst deals: bought Borriello 10M; overpaid for Destro (16.5M). Iturbe also overpaid, yet to see the return on performances; signed Bojan, Borini, Osvaldo, none of them good enough performances-wise, even though financially wise it was OK, no losses;
OK deals: overpaid and oversold Osvaldo (15-16M = -1M); Borini (13M - 9.5M = + 4.5M); Bojan (13M -12M = +1M); Ljajic 11M; sold Vucinic for 15M;
Best deals: found Lamela - profit of 13M; found Marquinhos - profit of 23M; Pjanic for 11M; Benatia for 13.5M; Castan 5M; Strootman 16.5M; Nainggolan 15M; sold Bradley 7.5M; invested in youth like Sanabria and Paredes.



Marotta 2010-2014:

2010: (-22.5M) Signed Del Neri as a coach; Bonucci (15.5M); Krasic (15M); Quagliarella (15M); Martinez (12M); Storari (4.5M); Barzagli 0.3M; sold Diego (15M); Poulsen (5.5M)
2011: (-80M) signed Matri (18M); Vucinic (15M); Vidal (12.5M); Licht (11M); Pepe (10M); Caceres (9.5M); Elia (9M); Giaccherini (7.2M); Padoin (5M); Motta (5M); Pirlo (free); Ziegler (free); sold Sissoko (8M); Giovinco (3M); Sorensen 2.5M; Melo loan (1.5M)
2012: (-50M) signed Asamoah (18M); Isla (15M); Giovinco half (11M); Gabbiadini half 5.5M; Boakye half (exchange for Immobile); Leali (4M); Peluso (6M); Anelka (free); Pogba (free); sold Krasic (7M); Elia 5.5M
2013: (+12M) signed Ogbonna 15M; Tevez 15M; Zaza half 3.5M; Berardi half (exchange for Marrone); Llorente (free); sold Matri (11M); Giacherinni (7.5M); Melo (5M)
2014: (-33M) signed Morata 20M; Pereyra 17M; Romulo 8M; Sturaro 5.5M; Marrone 5M; Evra 1.5M; Coman (free); sold Immobile 8M half; Vucinic 6.3M; Peluso 4.5M; Quagliarella 3.5M.

Total spent in 5 years: around 173M (around 35M per season)

Best deals: Pirlo (free); Pogba (free); Llorente (free); Berardi half exchaged for full Marrone; Barzagli (0.3k); Caceres (9.5M); Licht (11M); Vidal (12.5M); Tevez (15M); Asamoah (18M); Sold Matri for 11M.
OK deals: Bonucci (15M) - overpaid, but it is near his actual worth; Vucinic 15M; Quagliarella 15M (overpaid, but was a useful player); Pepe (10M -also overpaid, but was important in 1 season);
Worst deals: signed Del Neri in 2010; Martinez for 12M; Matri for 18M; Isla 15M; Giovinco half 11M; Elia 9M; Motta 5M; Ogbonna 15M; Pereyra overpaid 17M; Morata overpaid.


- - - Updated - - -

All in all... I think that given Marotta had more money to play with, he had more room to make mistakes.

I think the biggest difference is that when Sabatini overpaid, Borriello apart, he managed to sell the guys for even more money. This is mostly due to the profile of players he likes - international youngsters.

Also Marotta overpaid a lot, while this almost didn't happen to Sabatini.

The difference in approach is very clear: Marotta when arrived at Juve, basically only knew the Italian market. Sabatini had a history of finding great international players at Lazio and Palermo.

But Marotta is improving. I definitely don't see any great advantage of one before the other, but I really hope Marotta extends his scouting network and continue to look for international talent everywhere. I like this thinking.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
If you think Morata was overpaid, then you quite frankly need a reality check. You can complain about the buy back clausule, but the fee was normal.


The difference between Marotta and Sabatini, is that Marotta kept his stars by good management, where Sabatini is quite clearly a seller

- - - Updated - - -

And seriously, stop calling players overpaid when they havent played a single competitive minute here yet
 

Suns

Release clause?
May 22, 2009
22,089
If you think Morata was overpaid, then you quite frankly need a reality check. You can complain about the buy back clausule, but the fee was normal.


The difference between Marotta and Sabatini, is that Marotta kept his stars by good management, where Sabatini is quite clearly a seller

- - - Updated - - -

And seriously, stop calling players overpaid when they havent played a single competitive minute here yet
Difference between Marotta and Sabatini is that Marotta is backed up by a much richer club in Juventus while Sabatini is backed up by Roma. Sabatini is forced to sell because he's so good at finding great talents that teams rich teams want throw money at. And is working for a club who doesn't have the same revenues as Juventus has.
 

Suns

Release clause?
May 22, 2009
22,089
Yet Marotta finds better players then Sabatini, for prices Sabatini could also afford
Sabatini has consistently replaced departing talent with new talent that turns out to have the top clubs chasing after them. Marotta on the other hand I'm pretty scared about how he'll replace all the aging talent talent once they leave.

Plain and simple, I do not like Marotta. I do not like his strategy on the market and the way he operates. I don't like the massive personnel changes that happens every summer, the constant 'wtf signings' and I don't like his provincial mentality. Sabatini impresses me and I'm sure we'd have an even better team with him running this team.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
We wouldnt. Marotta signed several better players then Sabatini for lower fee's.

The trophee's and records are clear evidence of the team marotta build on a tight budged
 

The Curr

Senior Member
Feb 3, 2007
33,705
Sabatini has consistently replaced departing talent with new talent that turns out to have the top clubs chasing after them. Marotta on the other hand I'm pretty scared about how he'll replace all the aging talent talent once they leave.

Plain and simple, I do not like Marotta. I do not like his strategy on the market and the way he operates. I don't like the massive personnel changes that happens every summer, the constant 'wtf signings' and I don't like his provincial mentality. Sabatini impresses me and I'm sure we'd have an even better team with him running this team.
I'm concerned that he hasn't started already. I'd love to know his plans for when Barzagli, Buffon, Pirlo and probably Vidal aren't in the team any more.
 

GordoDeCentral

Diez
Moderator
Apr 14, 2005
70,837
At least Marotta runs juve in a way he doesnt have to sell ;)

you mean thankfully? marotta cant sell for shit

- - - Updated - - -

We wouldnt. Marotta signed several better players then Sabatini for lower fee's.
collectively? no, also sabatini doesnt have the juve appeal or the wage bill, just look up the young players he got for roma. The only youngin marotta got was pogba, and raiola had a lot to do with him coming to juve anyway.
 

MikeM

Footballing Hipster celebrating 4th place with Tuz
Sep 21, 2008
12,850
Sabatini has consistently replaced departing talent with new talent that turns out to have the top clubs chasing after them. Marotta on the other hand I'm pretty scared about how he'll replace all the aging talent talent once they leave.

Plain and simple, I do not like Marotta. I do not like his strategy on the market and the way he operates. I don't like the massive personnel changes that happens every summer, the constant 'wtf signings' and I don't like his provincial mentality. Sabatini impresses me and I'm sure we'd have an even better team with him running this team.
I think the problem is that you don't fully recognize how good his best signings are. Signing Vidal alone is a net profit to the club of like 50M+. It negates all his bad signings at once. The magnitude of Marotta's best signings are simply much higher than Sabatini's.

Ok, Sabatini pays 13M for Benatia. He comes good. 11M for Pjanic, he comes good. That's 24M. Great job. But then you have instances where Marotta finds Pirlo, Llorente, and Barzagli for 300K. :howler: And they are better players (at least they were).

Roma can sell all their best players and if you go and add up their profit it might add up to Vidal and Pogba alone in their best case scenario.

In other words, Marotta's best signings are like 100/100 home runs and Sabatini's are like 85/100.

But then you have to figure out that most of Marotta's worst signings come when he tries to add depth so that we can play 3 competitions. This is the first year that Sabatini has had to deal with that added pressure on his mercato movements and you see him coming up with Keita, Emanuelson, Ashley Cole, Astori, Borriello and 30+M for Iturbe. De Sanctis still the keeper? FFS, Storari is 10x better and he's our 2nd choice.

I think it's more fair to evaluate their transfer dealings and philosophy when they both get to the same stage, which they are at now. I mean, would anyone be surprised if Borriello was starting for them in some CL matches? I wouldn't. This board would implode if Borriello was starting CL matches for us this year.
 

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