Does God exist? (William Lane Craig vs Peter Atkins debate) (23 Viewers)

[Raz]

"If it makes you happy"? That has to be the poorest, weakest reason to believe in something.

Well it depends what you want from life. If happiness is what you are after, why not? Though that was not my reasoning to believe in it, I'm saying that believing in it gives you happiness or at least that is what I have seen from a lot of religious people.

Yes, I think reality is objective.

Reality: Reality is the state of things as they actually exist, rather than as they may appear or might be imagined. -Wikipedia

Depends on what's in my mind. There is no rule that it is real.

A thought itself is real. But what the thought defines or implies may or may not be real.

Ah, I have to go, will reply later if remember

 

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[Bianconero_Aus]

Having studied all 205 pages of this topic I am inclined to respond to the thread title with 'no'.

Close thread.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Well it depends what you want from life. If happiness is what you are after, why not? Though that was not my reasoning to believe in it, I'm saying that believing in it gives you happiness or at least that is what I have seen from a lot of religious people.

No. Belief depends only on what is real. That's it. If you believe in something because it makes you happy, then you're a coward who is afraid of facing reality. It means your beliefs are just wishful thinking, and have no basis in reality.

 

[Raz]

No. Belief depends only on what is real. That's it. If you believe in something because it makes you happy, then you're a coward who is afraid of facing reality. It means your beliefs are just wishful thinking, and have no basis in reality.

What I suggested is that people who believe are more happy in life, not that they choose to believe to become happy. And in any case if I was unhappy and talked to a lot of people who said that they found happines in life through believing in god or whatever I wouldn't consider applieng their expirience to my life to try to be happy a bad thing.

What do you think the purpose of our existense here is? To find out wether it is bing bang what created our universe or something else? To be productive and buy things so we contribute to our expanding ecomony to fund new reaserch?

 

[Fred]

I thought I was the only one who does that!

+rep

I've done that too. I read this thread whenever i come on Tuz, so i've never missed a post.


Oh and Jay, i'm inclined to answer to the thread title with a definite YES!!

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

What I suggested is that people who believe are more happy in life, not that they choose to believe to become happy. And in any case if I was unhappy and talked to a lot of people who said that they found happines in life through believing in god or whatever I wouldn't consider applieng their expirience to my life to try to be happy a bad thing.

Happiness is irrelevant when it comes to believing in something.

What do you think the purpose of our existense here is? To find out wether it is bing bang what created our universe or something else? To be productive and buy things so we contribute to our expanding ecomony to fund new reaserch?

I think that the primary purpose of all life on earth is to survive and reproduce. Any other purpose we give for ourselves is secondary and just to make us feel useful to society.

I've done that too. I read this thread whenever i come on Tuz, so i've never missed a post.

That's cool. I think the conversations and arguments that have taken place in this thread hold some value, and it's good to see people taking the time to read through it all.

 

[Raz]

Happiness is irrelevant when it comes to believing in something.

How you manage to live your everyday life is very relevant, since it's your life and you ain't gonna have any more soon. What managed to create big bang is irrelivant, since one will not change a thing in your life, and the other will lead you all the way through it.

I think that the primary purpose of all life on earth is to survive and reproduce. Any other purpose we give for ourselves is secondary and just to make us feel useful to society.

To survive, catch pray and reproduce for the primal animal is instincts of a primal animal. I think man has evolved from that. More and more we see that in the western world to reproduce is becoming less and less significant for people.

To survive is not worth discussing, because the option of not surviving is to die, not dying is certainly not our purpose here, it's inevitable, so there must be some purpose for not dying then. To live as long as possible to reproduce is not true, since the more the civilization is advanced the less it wants to reproduce. That drive wouldn't be so easily shrinked away by just 100 years if it was our only purpose here now. There must be something more to it then just that.

 

[JuveJay]

I've done that too. I read this thread whenever i come on Tuz, so i've never missed a post.


Oh and Jay, i'm inclined to answer to the thread title with a definite YES!!

Ah, Fred, you big kidder

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

How you manage to live your everyday life is very relevant, since it's your life and you ain't gonna have any more soon. What managed to create big bang is irrelivant, since one will not change a thing in your life, and the other will lead you all the way through it.

I agree with that. But your happiness has no bearing on the truth of your beliefs. This is the point I'm trying to make, yet you just don't seem to get it!!

To survive, catch pray and reproduce for the primal animal is instincts of a primal animal. I think man has evolved from that. More and more we see that in the western world to reproduce is becoming less and less significant for people.

To survive is not worth discussing, because the option of not surviving is to die, not dying is certainly not our purpose here, it's inevitable, so there must be some purpose for not dying then. To live as long as possible to reproduce is not true, since the more the civilization is advanced the less it wants to reproduce. That drive wouldn't be so easily shrinked away by just 100 years if it was our only purpose here now. There must be something more to it then just that.

We have evolved from primal animals, yes. But those instincts are still a big part of our life. We eat food so that we survive and not die out of hunger. The eastern world is still reproducing, and thus still hold it significant.

An honest assessment of all life on earth will only show that there is no higher purpose. Plants, animals, rodents, insects and fishes do not have any purpose other than survival and reproduction. They can neither contemplate their purpose in life, nor give one for themselves. If so, why are they here? And why are we here too?

The truth is that nature is without purpose. The earth, stars, planets, and the entire universe is without purpose. It's all just the result of physical and chemical laws. The idea of god putting us here for a purpose is absurd. A perfect, omniscient being would have no such desires. His perfection puts an end to all purposes he may have. Men created god and religion to give us a false sense of higher purpose. A higher purpose that never was, and never will be.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

PS: The universe does not owe you a purpose.

 

[AndreaCristiano]

Hey I do believe in a God, but I also believe Christianity is for mentally retarded.

not only is that offensive but its lame why not explain yourself with cogent thought

 

[suligodsilla]

I agree with that. But your happiness has no bearing on the truth of your beliefs. This is the point I'm trying to make, yet you just don't seem to get it!!



We have evolved from primal animals, yes. But those instincts are still a big part of our life. We eat food so that we survive and not die out of hunger. The eastern world is still reproducing, and thus still hold it significant.

An honest assessment of all life on earth will only show that there is no higher purpose. Plants, animals, rodents, insects and fishes do not have any purpose other than survival and reproduction. They can neither contemplate their purpose in life, nor give one for themselves. If so, why are they here? And why are we here too?

The truth is that nature is without purpose. The earth, stars, planets, and the entire universe is without purpose. It's all just the result of physical and chemical laws. The idea of god putting us here for a purpose is absurd. A perfect, omniscient being would have no such desires. His perfection puts an end to all purposes he may have. Men created god and religion to give us a false sense of higher purpose. A higher purpose that never was, and never will be.

nigga i think you should smoke a little bit ganja and think again about the world. your view of the world is a bit depressing

 

[AndreaCristiano]

$#@! i think you should smoke a little bit ganja and think again about the world. your view of the world is a bit depressing

yea hes a serious downer, how melancholy

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

I'm just being realistic.

 

[Nzoric]

I'm just being realistic.

realistic. elusive concept

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

realistic. elusive concept

It's the only way I can make sense of the world.

 

[Nzoric]

yeah but you can't patent your version of realism as something universally correct. if you've made sense of the world, i bow my head before you.

 

[AndreaCristiano]

I'm just being realistic.

nah thats downright abysmal

 

[Nzoric]

nah thats downright abysmal

and if reality is in fact abysmal? i don't really see why that should be a counterargument.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

yeah but you can't patent your version of realism as something universally correct. if you've made sense of the world, i bow my head before you.

I'll trying to make sense of it. I just don't expect to have got it right at my very first attempt.