Does God exist? (William Lane Craig vs Peter Atkins debate) (20 Viewers)

Well, did...

  • Man make God?

  • God make Man?


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Apr 15, 2006
56,640
Well I have seen many people which religiousness has contributed to their dumbness but I don't think there is ONE SINGLE religious person who thinks god approves of what the pic shows.
A brave generalization, Hoori. You don't think a deluded can rationalize such things? Especially when the god they so fervently believe in also believe that everything that happens is the will of god, and the will of god is always good?

I think there ARE people who approve of it. I just don't think even they are stupid enough to say the same in public.
 

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Raz

Senior Member
Nov 20, 2005
12,218
You apparently live in a bubble.
Nah, I just met a lot of religious people who are quite the opposite of what you preach here.

---------- Post added 18.03.2012 at 14:43 ----------

A brave generalization, Hoori. You don't think a deluded can rationalize such things? Especially when the god they so fervently believe in also believe that everything that happens is the will of god, and the will of god is always good?

I think there ARE people who approve of it. I just don't think even they are stupid enough to say the same in public.
Religious = deluded? Good point on not using brave generalizations.
 

king Ale

Senior Member
Oct 28, 2004
21,689
I don't know, do you? But they are still doing it in the name of worshiping a god instead of helping those in need. When I was battambang province in Cambodia an American group had spent $300 000 building a new church/cathedral in the province. Battambang is also the poorest province in Cambodia, an already poor country that depends on aid from China and Vietnam as it is still recovering from the Khmer Rouge and the civil war that was going on up until the end of the 90s. That was one of the most upsetting and offensive things I saw when I was travelling.
And why did you spend all that money on traveling while you could donate half of that amount to the poor?

I spend money on watching a meaningless football game while at the same time a kid is dying of starvation somewhere in the world.

I don't understand this logic. Judging by priorities, no money should be spent unless there is no hungry person left in the world. While I'd personally prefer that money to be spent on building a university/school/hospital or library instead of a church, bringing it up against religious people makes no sense imo.
 

Ford Prefect

Senior Member
May 28, 2009
10,557
Religious = deluded? Good point on not using brave generalizations.
Everyone uses generalizations, its natural and how humans make sense of the world around them. Containing a detailed understanding of the 200+ countries or thousands of cultures is an impossible task. The issue is when people refuse to challenge their generalizations/stereotypes, and before you say I don't - you know nothing about me or my ideologies and apparently can't see the difference between a bored person baiting an idiot and someone who genuinly holds opinions.
 

ZoSo

Senior Member
Jul 11, 2011
41,656
lol you are FUCKING RETARDED!!!!!!! how the fuck can you think god would approve of that? how is that anything? it's just another picture that just shows how fucking retarded athiests are. Did god make those buildings? no you fucking moron, people did and god gave people free choice.

That's the thing, you won't find many of those. Yet he is trying to put this image that all religious people are like that, dumb uneducated and just plain crazy.
:tup: He says religious people should be instiutionalised. wtf kind of logic is that? atheists are the minority because they are fucking retarded, just like jasper. I've never in my whole life met/talked anyone so fucking stupid. jasper's arguments against led zeppelin are better than this and they suck balls.
 

ZoSo

Senior Member
Jul 11, 2011
41,656
#1 Nice avoiding of the rest of my post as usual.

#2 Just want to say you are a fucking retard again.

#3 A moron etc.. yes clearly all religious people are morons and stupid. I'm sure Obama (just one famous decently smart religious person) is a complete moron. Del Piero must be a moron too by your definition.

#4 Nice how you bring in the child element after you know my age :tup: Invisible friends? All your arguments just try to belittle.

#5 No I don't use it to validate my existence, I believe in God because I do. There is no harm in believing and living your life in a mostly good way. 99% of the time I'm not one to say bad stuff to people but you are literally the biggest fucking moron I've ever met in my life. I've really never met someone with such a skewed and deluded view of reality as you. I geniunely think you are a retard. Not just on religious views but your whole persona is just a mess, you really need to sort your life out. Take a look in the mirror please and just think if you are happy with yourself.

wow omg you're right! That 17 second video proves religion is a mental illness and god is false!!!!!

Why is accepting God’s existence so painful for many atheists? I would like to propose the following reasons:

1. Accepting God’s existence means accepting a God that permits worldwide suffering to occur on a daily basis, whether caused by other humans or by natural disasters. To some such a God is too painful to fathom, as it is painful to fathom that one’s parent may have done heinous actions.

2. Many feel betrayed by a God who they feel should have protected them and who instead allowed them to come close to extermination. I am referring to the Jews in particular. (52 % of Jews are either atheists or agnostics.)

3. Some are afraid of God -- the God of the Bible in particular. They have read and heard terrifying descriptions of hell, and they are horrified that they may be deserving of it, because of their sinful ways. Rather than mend their ways, they block out God’s reality -- and consequently hell.

4. Some are angry with God by association. They are upset with fellow believers who may have hurt them. They may be angry at a minister, or a priest who may have hurt or betrayed them. They may also be angry at the hypocrisy of many religious people and transfer their anger at God for allowing it all. They finally punish Him for allowing their pain and disappointment, and they do so by negating His existence.
RATIONALIZATIONS: This is a favorite mechanism of atheists. It is simply the reliance on “logical-sounding” but false reasons to negate reality. Atheists will offer countless “logical-sounding” reasons why God does not exist, or why they cannot accept the existence of God. They are very creative at doing so, and they specialize in using “pedantic” language to sound convincing to others and to themselves. They fool themselves that they are of "superior" intelligence and that they must be correct in their conclusions. In reality, they are simply "rationalizers."
Atheism is a mental illness because it is nothing more than a cry for attention. The truth is atheism is a false idea because it is based on the false premise that orderliness does not require intelligent direction.

Every argument with an atheist ends with this point. They can not overcome this one point, no matter how hard they try.
 

Ford Prefect

Senior Member
May 28, 2009
10,557
Going to break this stupidity in to manageable chunks.

#1 Nice avoiding of the rest of my post as usual.

#2 Just want to say you are a fucking retard again.

#3 A moron etc.. yes clearly all religious people are morons and stupid. I'm sure Obama (just one famous decently smart religious person) is a complete moron. Del Piero must be a moron too by your definition.

#4 Nice how you bring in the child element after you know my age Invisible friends? All your arguments just try to belittle.

#5 No I don't use it to validate my existence, I believe in God because I do. There is no harm in believing and living your life in a mostly good way. 99% of the time I'm not one to say bad stuff to people but you are literally the biggest fucking moron I've ever met in my life. I've really never met someone with such a skewed and deluded view of reality as you. I geniunely think you are a retard. Not just on religious views but your whole persona is just a mess, you really need to sort your life out. Take a look in the mirror please and just think if you are happy with yourself.

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#1 The rest of your post was dirrected at someone else or i answered yesterday

#2 You're the Australian.

#3 How much celebrities believe in a faith or pretend due to public image is an interesting issue. The only openly atheist candidate we have had in the UK had one of the lowest vote counts and the UK is one of the most secular countries in the world.

#4 I disregard most things you say as I find more and more out about you and then use that stuff to wind you up when im bored. Just want to point this out AGAIN, I never had a problem with you - its you that started all of this bullshit with me and I still find it hillarious how wound up you get over nothing.

#5 You believe in god because you were told when you were young and now you've lived that lie, told to you by people who also believe that lie, for so long that for someone to challenge the logical falicy doesn't make sense to you.

Have you considered the followin - A, you don't get my sense of humour (Post modernism, Irony, Sarcasm), B, You don't understand my writing style - look up people like charlie brooker/ben goldacre (journalists i've read since I was about 16). C, I think exactly the same things about you?

I am really happy with my self, I look great, Im about to get my third degree, I have an amazing girlfriend etc. etc. And I got/achieved all of that because of work that I put in - not because an invisible force had a plan for me.

--------------------------------------------------

Why is accepting God’s existence so painful for many atheists? I would like to propose the following reasons:

1. Accepting God’s existence means accepting a God that permits worldwide suffering to occur on a daily basis, whether caused by other humans or by natural disasters. To some such a God is too painful to fathom, as it is painful to fathom that one’s parent may have done heinous actions.

2. Many feel betrayed by a God who they feel should have protected them and who instead allowed them to come close to extermination. I am referring to the Jews in particular. (52 % of Jews are either atheists or agnostics.)

3. Some are afraid of God -- the God of the Bible in particular. They have read and heard terrifying descriptions of hell, and they are horrified that they may be deserving of it, because of their sinful ways. Rather than mend their ways, they block out God’s reality -- and consequently hell.

4. Some are angry with God by association. They are upset with fellow believers who may have hurt them. They may be angry at a minister, or a priest who may have hurt or betrayed them. They may also be angry at the hypocrisy of many religious people and transfer their anger at God for allowing it all. They finally punish Him for allowing their pain and disappointment, and they do so by negating His existence.
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I don't need to reply to any part of that because its written by someone that doesn't understand atheism.

"That which can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof"

That why atheists don't believe in god - theres no proof and we demand proof.

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RATIONALIZATIONS: This is a favorite mechanism of atheists. It is simply the reliance on “logical-sounding” but false
reasons to negate reality. Atheists will offer countless “logical-sounding” reasons why God does not exist, or why they cannot accept the existence of God. They are very creative at doing so, and they specialize in using “pedantic” language to sound convincing to others and to themselves. They fool themselves that they are of "superior" intelligence and that they must be correct in their conclusions. In reality, they are simply

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What do you want me to say to that? Theres no point being made there, it means nothing...

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"rationalizers."
Atheism is a mental illness because it is nothing more than a cry for attention. The truth is atheism is a false idea because it is based on the false premise that orderliness does not require intelligent direction.

Every argument with an atheist ends with this point. They can not overcome this one point, no matter how hard they try.
--------------------------------

Atheism is a cry for attention?

Intelligent direction?

If you really think that your life is dictated by a higher power then you have really really really low self esteem. How is atheism a cry for attention?
 

ZoSo

Senior Member
Jul 11, 2011
41,656
#1 The rest of your post was dirrected at someone else or i answered yesterday

#2 You're the Australian.

#3 How much celebrities believe in a faith or pretend due to public image is an interesting issue. The only openly atheist candidate we have had in the UK had one of the lowest vote counts and the UK is one of the most secular countries in the world.

#4 I disregard most things you say as I find more and more out about you and then use that stuff to wind you up when im bored. Just want to point this out AGAIN, I never had a problem with you - its you that started all of this bullshit with me and I still find it hillarious how wound up you get over nothing.

#5 You believe in god because you were told when you were young and now you've lived that lie, told to you by people who also believe that lie, for so long that for someone to challenge the logical falicy doesn't make sense to you.

Have you considered the followin - A, you don't get my sense of humour (Post modernism, Irony, Sarcasm), B, You don't understand my writing style - look up people like charlie brooker/ben goldacre (journalists i've read since I was about 16). C, I think exactly the same things about you?

I am really happy with my self, I look great, Im about to get my third degree, I have an amazing girlfriend etc. etc. And I got/achieved all of that because of work that I put in - not because an invisible force had a plan for me.

#1 can't accept I'm right

#2 I'm just using Obama as an example. You claim all religious people are morons. What about Del Piero? See you can't answer again.

#3 Good if you wind me up, I don't really care. I'm only going to stop when you stop posting bullshit.

#4 cue: 'They fool themselves that they are of "superior" intelligence and that they must be correct in their conclusions.' No because I believe in God because religion is real. You don't understand the idea of faith and somehow think that ALL religious people are just looking for confirmation or guidance. That's definitely true for some people I'm sure but for me it's not.

Your sense of humour is just about non-existent. Ah 'your writing style' - the famous jasper writing style that everyone should know and recognize. C, well good for you, becuse I don't have those problems unlike you.

Yeah by your definition...so? I'll have 1 and a half degrees by the time I'm 20. Next year as part of my degree I'll have a proper job and be earning probably close to what you'll ever make as an 18-19 year old. They must be bullshit degrees that get you nowhere too because if you're 22 you wouldn't have 3 degrees in things like law, science, commerce, engineering etc. Yeah, virtual relationships and girlfriends in other countries ftw!!! You've never heard the quote: 'god helps those who help themselves'? Do you think that heligious people sit around all day waiting for stuff to happen? Clearly you don't understand religion then.

I don't need to reply to any part of that because its written by someone that doesn't understand atheism.

"That which can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof"

That why atheists don't believe in god - theres no proof and we demand proof.
As always you just don't/can't answer the question. Shows a lack of intelligence.

What do you want me to say to that? Theres no point being made there, it means nothing...
Same as above. You must be so fucking full of yourself if you think that doesn't apply to you.

Atheism is a cry for attention?

Intelligent direction?

If you really think that your life is dictated by a higher power then you have really really really low self esteem. How is atheism a cry for attention?
Yeah it does seem like a decent percentage of atheists are just attention seekers or if not they're really angry people. The people that I'm referring go out of their way anywhere, anytime and everywhere to promote atheism like their life depends on it, like it sociable and cool. That is how atheism is a cry for attention. It also usually seems like these are people that have low self esteem and try to validate their existence by being part of atheism.

Dicatated? No, not at all. I don't think any religious people (maybe some extremists) see God as a dictator. Dictatorship and other similar extremes are all concocted in the mind of atheists.

And once again it shows:

'Every argument with an atheist ends with this point. They can not overcome this one point, no matter how hard they try.'

No matter how hard you try you won't overcome. It's one of the key (retarded) ideas behind atheism.
 

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