Does God exist? (William Lane Craig vs Peter Atkins debate) (5 Viewers)

Well, did...

  • Man make God?

  • God make Man?

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Sheik Yerbouti

Sheik Yerbouti

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#2,286
Apr 15, 2006
56,618
#2,286
Raz said:
No I mean if there is no god and you die, you wont get dissapointed or exposed, because you will never know.

In this scenario if you lived believing and happy life whats the harm in that?
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Let's take the natural explanation first. Of what we think happens after we die right now, you will not even be in a state to comprehend whether you're alive or dead, let alone whether there is a god and if any of the religious texts are true. When you die, you cannot get a glimpse of the darkness before saying to yourself "oh fuck, there is no god", and then die for good. Considering that, you only have this one life to see, hear, feel, touch, admire, appreciate and comprehend everything, it's best that you do all of this while you can rather than do it in an afterlife that you'll possibly never experience.

Also, what guarantee do you have that this god is gonna reward your faith or your belief in him? What if this god, who has an identity, is not satisfied with people(like you) believing in an abstract definition/concept of a god? What if those people are going to hell because they did not worship a particular identity of god as described in some religious text you never studied?

Even if you do believe in the concept of a god, there are just too many unknowns which make it impossible to do so just in the hope that there is an afterlife.
 
jussr

jussr

Senior Member
#2,289
Jan 26, 2011
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#2,289
Who's to say that faith alone doesn't have positive utility? Maybe the reward is just in the belief itself.

It's not given that atheists will experience life more fully than religious people. And they have a possibility of a bonus at the end.
 
Raz

Raz

Senior Member
#2,291
Nov 20, 2005
12,218
#2,291
Sheik Yerbouti said:
Let's take the natural explanation first. Of what we think happens after we die right now, you will not even be in a state to comprehend whether you're alive or dead, let alone whether there is a god and if any of the religious texts are true. When you die, you cannot get a glimpse of the darkness before saying to yourself "oh fuck, there is no god", and then die for good. Considering that, you only have this one life to see, hear, feel, touch, admire, appreciate and comprehend everything, it's best that you do all of this while you can rather than do it in an afterlife that you'll possibly never experience.

Also, what guarantee do you have that this god is gonna reward your faith or your belief in him? What if this god, who has an identity, is not satisfied with people(like you) believing in an abstract definition/concept of a god? What if those people are going to hell because they did not worship a particular identity of god as described in some religious text you never studied?

Even if you do believe in the concept of a god, there are just too many unknowns which make it impossible to do so just in the hope that there is an afterlife.
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I agree with you here. I don't think there is afterlife, at least as it painted in bible for eg. And hell is a big hoax if too you ask me.
 
Sheik Yerbouti

Sheik Yerbouti

★★★
#2,292
Apr 15, 2006
56,618
#2,292
jussr said:
Who's to say that faith alone doesn't have positive utility? Maybe the reward is just in the belief itself.

It's not given that atheists will experience life more fully than religious people. And they have a possibility of a bonus at the end.
Click to expand...
If all god cared about is faith and belief in him, then he wouldn't bother with morality or ANYTHING else these religious books speak of. Besides, there is no proof that faith is a good thing in real life. I doubt it would be any good in the afterlife.

I don't live for the bonus, I live for what life has to offer. Bonus is exactly that: a bonus. It's nice to have it in the end, but it ain't a deal-breaker.
 
Sheik Yerbouti

Sheik Yerbouti

★★★
#2,293
Apr 15, 2006
56,618
#2,293
Raz said:
I agree with you here. I don't think there is afterlife, at least as it painted in bible for eg. And hell is a big hoax if too you ask me.
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Forget the Bible. There are other religious texts that give their own account of the afterlife or what happens after death. It's lunacy to believe any of them are true, let alone one of them.
 
jussr

jussr

Senior Member
#2,294
Jan 26, 2011
975
#2,294
Moral laws can improve utility. If you have no morals then sooner or later you'll become a degenerate gambler, drug addict, murderer, ...

But everybody have morals even atheists so they are no different from religious people. Maybe there is an advantage im basing your morals in a belief in a higher being.
 
Raz

Raz

Senior Member
#2,295
Nov 20, 2005
12,218
#2,295
Sheik Yerbouti said:
Forget the Bible. There are other religious texts that give their own account of the afterlife or what happens after death. It's lunacy to believe any of them are true, let alone one of them.
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True. I have no idea if there is anything after life but to believe it literaly what is written there is certainly a bit crazy.
 
Raz

Raz

Senior Member
#2,296
Nov 20, 2005
12,218
#2,296
Sheik Yerbouti said:
If all god cared about is faith and belief in him, then he wouldn't bother with morality or ANYTHING else these religious books speak of. Besides, there is no proof that faith is a good thing in real life. I doubt it would be any good in the afterlife.

I don't live for the bonus, I live for what life has to offer. Bonus is exactly that: a bonus. It's nice to have it in the end, but it ain't a deal-breaker.
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Well don't just write it down as a bonus if it's true, because most of the time afterlife supposed to be better/bigger or whatever but certainly not smaller to be called just a bonus.
 
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