Does God exist? (William Lane Craig vs Peter Atkins debate) (22 Viewers)

Well, did...

  • Man make God?

  • God make Man?


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Apr 15, 2006
56,640
I would like to vote for both options because while I think that the "Men made God" option is absolutely correct, "God made men" could be correct too, just that in this case God could very well be a group of scientists from some other planet to which we're an anthropology experiment or something.

I mean, we can create advanced artificial life forms, we can clone and what not. Imagine what we can do in some 100-200 years. Can we also make an experiment on some planet then if we want to? Will we be God to those new inhabitants of that planet?

Evolution is cool and all, but I still find it hard to explain how one single stem cell divides and differentiate into trillions of diverse specialized cell types. That's some advanced shit which was more likely to be produced in some lab. But then again, if we go back and back and back, something had to develop out of nothing :confused:

I don't understand time very well. If I'm 32 year old on earth I read that I'd be 52 year old on Venus. But would I look like a 52 year old and would my life span be the same as it is on earth? I have no idea. But lets say that it's not the same, so maybe those who started the experiment on our planet are just a year older than they were when they started it, while millions of years passed on our planet.

Too much star trek for me, I guess.
Don't. Let the scientists do that. :D

Remember that evolution and speciation happens very slowly over long periods of time. Perhaps humans don't believe it at first because they expect something dramatic. But evolution is an observable fact, regardless of whether we can explain it right now or not.
I know. That still leads to the same question. Who created our God(s)?

I'm just thinking here if we are the first creation. Since it's a big probability that in not too many centuries we can start life from zero on some planet, the question if something similar didn't happen with us should be asked. The chances that we were the first exist, but they are smaller than the chances that someone did with us what we can do with others tomorrow.
The question about the first creator and who created him still remains unanswered.
We are not.
Well, I did always used to get this feeling that I was in a experiment constantly being watched and judged, and everyone else was just acting and would go back to being whatever they are when I'm not looking.
Like The Truman Show. :D
 

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Ford Prefect

Senior Member
May 28, 2009
10,557


One of my favourite logical falicies that religious types try and argue - 'religion gives you morals' - The moral teachings of religion are so basic that to think that we need religion to understand them not only means that you are a nasty piece of work to begin with and the only thing stopping you from murdering is taking the book out of your hands, but that you also view humanity as a whole as a species that given the chance would freely murder, rape, cheap, steal etc. Without the moral "guidance" of your creed. Preposterous.

That isnt reductio ad absurdum, thats the argument religious types present when they say "religion gives you morals"

Fucking idiots, eurgh..I hate humanity sometimes.
 

Linebreak

Senior Member
Sep 18, 2009
16,022


One of my favourite logical falicies that religious types try and argue - 'religion gives you morals' - The moral teachings of religion are so basic that to think that we need religion to understand them not only means that you are a nasty piece of work to begin with and the only thing stopping you from murdering is taking the book out of your hands, but that you also view humanity as a whole as a species that given the chance would freely murder, rape, cheap, steal etc. Without the moral "guidance" of your creed. Preposterous.

That isnt reductio ad absurdum, thats the argument religious types present when they say "religion gives you morals"

Fucking idiots, eurgh..I hate humanity sometimes.
Looks like atheism did very well in teaching you morals then.

Don't. Let the scientists do that. :D

Remember that evolution and speciation happens very slowly over long periods of time. Perhaps humans don't believe it at first because they expect something dramatic. But evolution is an observable fact, regardless of whether we can explain it right now or not.

We are not.


Like The Truman Show. :D
Micro is, not macro.
 

Ford Prefect

Senior Member
May 28, 2009
10,557
Looks like atheism did very well in teaching you morals then.



Micro is, not macro.
Evolution is the answer to "how" and not "why" - it tells us how we can came to be, not why we came to be - other theories demonstrates the why part - we are a chance of a chance of a chance of a chance of a chance of a chance of a chance that evolved through millenia of trial and error and dumb luck. - but that is seperate to what evolution teaches us, and there is no reason why evolution can't fit in with your god, just view it as he created the first stage of our evolution.
 

Ford Prefect

Senior Member
May 28, 2009
10,557
So much of humanity is incapable of that just look around, so much amorality.
"With or without religion there would still be good people doing good things and bad people doing bad things. But for a good person to do a bad thing takes religion"

If someone is going to do something bad or is morally corrupt, religion wont solve it...its just putting a mask on the problem.
 

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