Do you believe in Human Rights? (3 Viewers)

Red

-------
Moderator
Nov 26, 2006
47,024
#21
I didn't say protecting human rights is not a good thing, but establishing such a charter without having the tools to apply it practically just shows how useless it is.
Would you be in favour of it if, like the European Convention, an individual was able to raise it against it's own government?

And, it is never going to be possible to force certain countries to enforce human rights. That doesn't mean the rest of the world shouldn't try to improve things for states that are willing to adhere to these things..
 

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Enron

Tickle Me
Moderator
Oct 11, 2005
75,659
#23
Amnesty International is a useless organization that does nothing but words, words, and more words. I can write hundreds of books about the severity of the regime ruling in North Korea and the violations in Guanatanamu. But will that change anything in the real world?? Of course, not. Because Amnesty is as effective as a guy without hands or legs and has nothing but a big mouth.
Are you sure you're not an American?
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,325
#26
The practical use and how to enforce the charter don't have anything to do with with the undisputable value of the charter as such. It was never meant to be some sort of law, but rather a collection of guidelines which say on which moral grounds laws should be based.

Saying that the Human Rights Charter is unimportant is saying that the fundamental ethical laws the public deems as good are unimportant. It is quite probably the single most ignorant post I have seen on this forum and by God, I've seen a lot of ignorant posts.
 

Ahmed

Principino
Sep 3, 2006
47,928
#27
The concept of Human Rights is of course a necessary tool, but the implementation of the UN charter has been so farcical and wrought with double standards, that its use has been made null and void
 

ReBeL

The Jackal
Jan 14, 2005
22,871
#28
There are lots of non political organizations around the world that strive for some particular cause without political backing. Clearly, they're never gonna be as effective as someone who can say "do this or we blow up your country", but on the other hand they're much less prone to corruption of the principles they're committed to. In fact, show me a political power that whose ideology and practice is the enforcement of human rights. There doesn't seem to be one, does there? So Amnesty International and the like (Greenpeace, the Red Cross etc) are pretty much the best we have. Really all they can do is write letters and hold campaigns whose aim is to raise an alarm about what's actually happening out there. Chances are without Amnesty International there would even more human rights abuse, cause we'd be less exposed to it and the political pressures against it would be weaker.

You think it would be a better world if they didn't exist?
It won't be a better world but it won't be worse in anyway.
 

Sadomin

Senior Member
Apr 5, 2005
7,327
#30
Amnesty International is a useless organization that does nothing but words, words, and more words. I can write hundreds of books about the severity of the regime ruling in North Korea and the violations in Guanatanamu. But will that change anything in the real world?? Of course, not. Because Amnesty is as effective as a guy without hands or legs and has nothing but a big mouth.
They helped my cousin get asylum in Sweden. There are many useless organisations, but they are not one of them. Sometimes a brain and mouth is all that is necessary.
 
Jan 7, 2004
29,704
#32
What about spreading freedom??
the funny thing is that you think the same way those people think, just switch christianity for islam and dictators for infidels. problem is you don't got no army. you representing the strongest group in your country push your beliefs on the weaker ones and get surprised when an even stronger group pulls the same shit. get over it
 

Nenz

Senior Member
Apr 17, 2008
10,472
#37
Universal laws are no different than domestic laws. They're there to provide a moral framework that all nations should abide by. Most will abide by them, but like in any city there are criminals who ignore the law.
So when there are breaches of international laws I wouldn't put that down to the uselessness of the UN or Amnesty International.
The problem with the Geneva convention is that it may have excluded some important cultural representatives and doesn't agree with many societies who respect these laws less than others.
 

Quetzalcoatl

It ain't hard to tell
Aug 22, 2007
66,757
#38
BRAVE NEW SCHOOLS
Expulsion threatened over prayer for sick teacher
Students' lawsuit against California college moves forward


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Posted: April 09, 2009
11:00 pm Eastern

© 2009 WorldNetDaily



College of Alameda

Attorneys representing two students who have been threatened with expulsion by a California college because of a prayer for a sick professor say a federal judge has refused the school's efforts to have the case dismissed.

"It's outrageous," said Brad Dacus, president of the Pacific Justice Institute, which is working on the case brought by students Kandy Kyriacou and Ojoma Omaga of the College of Alameda in Alameda, near Oakland.

"Since when does praying for a sick teacher to get well – with her consent – earn a suspension? This is not just a constitutional violation; it is a complete lack of common sense. These students were not looking for a fight, but since the school to this day insists that it can expel them if they pray again, we will have to resolve it in federal court," he said.

The public-interest legal group said the decision by a San Francisco federal judge means the lawsuit will move forward.

The case was prompted by an incident just before Christmas in 2007 in which the students went to deliver a Christmas gift to a professor.

"Kandy found the instructor alone in her shared office," according to Pacific Justice. "When the instructor indicated she was ill, Kandy offered to pray for her. The instructor bowed her head, and Kandy began to pray – until she was interrupted by another faculty member, Derek Piazza, who walked in and said, 'You can't be doing that in here!' Kandy quickly left and rejoined her friend and fellow student, Ojoma Omaga. Piazza followed Kandy outside and repeated his rebuke."

While the students reported they were surprised by the teacher's aggressive behavior, they were stunned when, days later, they both got letters notifying them of the college's retroactive "intent to suspend" plan.

The letters, however, provided no facts on which to make such a threat, listing only vague references to "disruptive or insulting behavior" and "willful disobedience."

School officials informed them during administrative hearings that Kyriacou was being disciplined for praying for the sick teacher. Omaga was not part of the prayer, and her offense apparently was that she was with Kyriacou a short time later.

The lawsuit was filed when the college refused to rescind the letters, leaving the students in peril of suspension or expulsion for any other offense, such as praying on campus. The decision from U.S. District Judge Susan Illston turned back college attempts to deny the students a hearing on their complaint.

"To this day, the College of Alameda has never provided a real explanation for its threats to expel these students," said Steven N.H. Wood of the Walnut Creek firm of Bergquist, Wood and Anderson, which is working with Pacific Justice on the case.

"But it has disciplined them for non-disruptive, private prayer between consenting adults. We will not stand by and let a college trample these fundamental rights," he said.

Said Dacus, "It is alarming that a publicly-funded college would seek to suspend and expel students for praying on campus, then dig in its heels to defend an untenable, unconstitutional position. We are encouraged that the federal court has given us the green light to pursue this case."
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So the school is threatening to expel the students for praying with a sick teacher... in America, the land of the free. To make it even worse, they were praying in the privacy of the teacher's office.

My country may be backward in so many ways but I am really grateful for the fact that we are actually a free country, where a country like U.S.A. just claim freedom of speech.
 

Elvin

Senior Member
Nov 25, 2005
36,923
#39
It's all bullshit, when it comes down to it, every man for himself.
There is no real freedom, only an illusion.

We're all full of shit. Sometimes I hate people.
 

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