Diego Ribas da Cunha (19 Viewers)

[El Santo]

Ferrara instead of wasting his time talking to Diego should instead go learn some tactics that this team can use. Props to Diego for saying something.

 

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[Red]

So what do you want Ferrara to do?

He started with the 4-3-1-2 this season, which is what most folk wanted.

He then changed to the 4-2-3-1, which most people then wanted.

What do you suggest now?


Personally, I don't think tactics are the major issue. I think the big problem is that all our systems are Diego dependent and he is inevitably taking some time to adjust to living and playing in a new country.

Once Del Piero is fit things will start to become clearly as to what Ferrara really wants the team doing and it will take some of the heat off Diego.


I think Ferrara has made very few mistakes so far this season, considering how inexperienced he is.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

but red, theres more to tactic than digit permutations his assignments are clearly off, and when you see someone like melo commit the same mistakes week in and week out its gotta be the coach.

 

[Bjerknes]

Melo's mistakes are with the ball though. I find it hard to believe Ferrara hasn't at least mentioned to Melo that he needs to be more careful passing the ball at our own end, keeping it simple instead of making risky passes.

In the case of Diego I think he just needs time. As I recall, the lad started out well at Bremen, scoring in his first few matches, but then went missing until the winter break. Diego was very good in his first starts at Juve, and there is no question the lad is sick.

Give it time, he will pull through.

 

[Stephan]

Red what are those mistakes you refer to?

One really has to question why was our performance in France so lackluster. It doesnt matter who was back or not. Add to that we cant really come out each week with a excuse DP is still warming up, or Diego is still finding his feet.

If DP wasnt ready, should not have started.

Almost everyone said yesterday that this really was the worst game by Juve. We still have a game left in CL and i am expecting us to go through but its def disappointing to see how the team never woke up in france.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Melo's mistakes are with the ball though. I find it hard to believe Ferrara hasn't at least mentioned to Melo that he needs to be more careful passing the ball at our own end, keeping it simple instead of making risky passes.

hes not his buddy hes not his wofe he doesnt just mention, he makes him stop! thats a coach.

 

[Red]

but red, theres more to tactic than digit permutations his assignments are clearly off, and when you see someone like melo commit the same mistakes week in and week out its gotta be the coach.

I'm aware there is a lot more to tactics than the formation (I had a rant not long ago about folk being over simplistic in that regard), but it is very tough to look at in more detailed stuff without knowing what instructions are being given.

I believe that most of the problems are being caused by individual errors (defenders giving away endless stupid fouls, midfielders failing to make simple passes, strikers missing open goals), rather than the shape of the team or the pattern of play.

The pattern of play is far from perfect, but I put a lot of that down to adjusting to various new systems and not being able to pick the same players regularly.

Take last nights game: Ferrara, after the game, said he was annoyed about the defenders giving away so many freekicks because he had specifically warned them about how good Bordeaux are at set pieces. The players (mostly Caceres) did not heed his advice and the team paid for it.

 

[Bjerknes]

hes not his buddy hes not his wofe he doesnt just mention, he makes him stop! thats a coach.

I find it hard to believe he hasn't tried not to; the problem is clear as day.

We don't know the truth so we can only speculate... but I wouldn't short Ferrara based on the rumor Ciro hasn't tried to knock some sense into him.

 

[Bjerknes]

Take last nights game: Ferrara, after the game, said he was annoyed about the defenders giving away so many freekicks because he had specifically warned them about how good Bordeaux are at set pieces. The players (mostly Caceres) did not heed his advice and the team paid for it.

Yes, exactly. That is very problematic and Caceres is to blame for the first goal.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

I'm aware there is a lot more to tactics than the formation (I had a rant not long ago about folk being over simplistic in that regard), but it is very tough to look at in more detailed stuff without knowing what instructions are being given.

I believe that most of the problems are being caused by individual errors (defenders giving away endless stupid fouls, midfielders failing to make simple passes, strikers missing open goals), rather than the shape of the team or the pattern of play.

The pattern of play is far from perfect, but I put a lot of that down to adjusting to various new systems and not being able to pick the same players regularly.

Take last nights game: Ferrara, after the game, said he was annoyed about the defenders giving away so many freekicks because he had specifically warned them about how good Bordeaux are at set pieces. The players (mostly Caceres) did not heed his advice and the team paid for it.

And i put all of that squarely on his shoulder, man management is exactly that getting to your players one way or another. And his after the game conference made him look even more clueless "i told them but they didnt listen"

 

[GordoDeCentral]

I find it hard to believe he hasn't tried not to; the problem is clear as day.

We don't know the truth so we can only speculate... but I wouldn't short Ferrara based on the rumor Ciro hasn't tried to knock some sense into him.

theres no speculation here, melo makes mistakes one week and the same exact one the week after do you think that would happen if a mourinho was in charge?

 

[Red]

Melo's mistakes are with the ball though. I find it hard to believe Ferrara hasn't at least mentioned to Melo that he needs to be more careful passing the ball at our own end, keeping it simple instead of making risky passes.

In the case of Diego I think he just needs time. As I recall, the lad started out well at Bremen, scoring in his first few matches, but then went missing until the winter break. Diego was very good in his first starts at Juve, and there is no question the lad is sick.

Give it time, he will pull through.

Exactly.

Red what are those mistakes you refer to?

One really has to question why was our performance in France so lackluster. It doesnt matter who was back or not. Add to that we cant really come out each week with a excuse DP is still warming up, or Diego is still finding his feet.

If DP wasnt ready, should not have started.

Almost everyone said yesterday that this really was the worst game by Juve. We still have a game left in CL and i am expecting us to go through but its def disappointing to see how the team never woke up in france.

I consider starting Del Piero last night a mistake, for one thing.

Why is it not an excuse to say Diego is adjusting? The system is based largely on Diego performing and if he doesn't the team is in trouble.

It's exactly why I don't like trequartista based systems.


Juve were very poor yesterday, but I'm not going to go overboard on one performance, as this team is still very much a work in progress and there inevitably going to be problems.

 

[Stephan]

Wrong timing for Mourinho reference Canardo.

 

[Red]

And i put all of that squarely on his shoulder, man management is exactly that getting to your players one way or another. And his after the game conference made him look even more clueless "i told them but they didnt listen"

So players playing badly is the coach's fault and them not doing what the coach tells them to do is also the coach's fault.

Are the players not expected to take any responsibility?

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Wrong timing for Mourinho reference Canardo.

by mourinho i mean a coach who gets his players to do what he wants, ferrara doesnt strike me as that.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

So players playing badly is the coach's fault and them not doing what the coach tells them to do is also the coach's fault.

Are the players not expected to take any responsibility?

yes i adhere to the idea, if a player doesnt play to his abilities its the coach's fault to a degree; and the degree ends with the coach benching that player until they figure it out. The player takes responsibility for failing miserably in one particular game, beyond the coach's control. But if mistakes keep occurring then you got on your hands a weak clueless coach.

 

[Red]

It depends on the player and the circumstances.

Sometimes it's best to bench them, sometimes it's best to work through the bad patch by playing them.

Ferrara wasn't exactly slow to drop Amauri when Trezeguet was available and Amauri was underperforming.

He is taking the other approach with Diego and Melo (though I would be dropping Melo in favour of Poulsen just now).

 

[GordoDeCentral]

It depends on the player and the circumstances.

Sometimes it's best to bench them, sometimes it's best to work through the bad patch by playing them.

Ferrara wasn't exactly slow to drop Amauri when Trezeguet was available and Amauri was underperforming.

He is taking the other approach with Diego and Melo (though I would be dropping Melo in favour of Poulsen just now).

i am not even talking about dips in form, i am talking about blatant blown assignments

 

[Bjerknes]

theres no speculation here, melo makes mistakes one week and the same exact one the week after do you think that would happen if a mourinho was in charge?

Yes, I do. Just take a look at Inter's CL matches this season. It's not only one guy making the same mistakes, but the whole team.

 

[Stephan]

You see Deneb