[CL] Juventus - Bayern München (12 Viewers)

[Martin]

++ [ originally posted by Jeeks ] ++
Actually I would agree with you. In addition to that is the wrong positioning of the player. Either way, his performance should not be taken into consideratiion, but you never know with Capello. Sometimes I feel he makes these traps on purpose.

I gotta say the more matches I watch, the more I get the feeling some of the people here are rather disconnected from reality. First of all it's the thing with treating Del Piero like he's so different from the whole team, discussing his performance everytime. Often he gets stick for being average, whereas many others get away with being average consistently (Nedved anyone?). To me he's just a team player, it's a bit unsettling to have all this focus on him.

Secondly, people's expectations are out of whack. Like tonight we played probably one of the best teams in Europe and we were lucky to win. Reading the forum I get the impression that people expect us to beat them convincingly, like that's the standard we're aiming for. But when I watch big matches like this, it's almost always even and decided by a small margin. People who think tonight's Bayern will be beaten by several goals I find a bit delusional. We played average tonight and we beat a strong team. Conversely, sometimes we beat small clubs playing like shit and the celebration is resounding.

The thing about Ibrahimovic is that most of the time he's fairly average (like tonight). He's very rarely absolute trash (like vs Milan) and he's very rarely very good. Although the spotlight is on him, he is to me quite consistent, far less magical than people have him being. For his style, he has made quite a few enemies around here and not everyone will wish him well, which is sorta understandable, it's the case with controversial players.

 

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[JCK]

++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


I gotta say the more matches I watch, the more I get the feeling some of the people here are rather disconnected from reality. First of all it's the thing with treating Del Piero like he's so different from the whole team, discussing his performance everytime. Often he gets stick for being average, whereas many others get away with being average consistently (Nedved anyone?). To me he's just a team player, it's a bit unsettling to have all this focus on him.

Secondly, people's expectations are out of whack. Like tonight we played probably one of the best teams in Europe and we were lucky to win. Reading the forum I get the impression that people expect us to beat them convincingly, like that's the standard we're aiming for. But when I watch big matches like this, it's almost always even and decided by a small margin. People who think tonight's Bayern will be beaten by several goals I find a bit delusional. We played average tonight and we beat a strong team. Conversely, sometimes we beat small clubs playing like shit and the celebration is resounding.

The thing about Ibrahimovic is that most of the time he's fairly average (like tonight). He's very rarely absolute trash (like vs Milan) and he's very rarely very good. Although the spotlight is on him, he is to me quite consistent, far less magical than people have him being. For his style, he has made quite a few enemies around here and not everyone will wish him well, which is sorta understandable, it's the case with controversial players.

Amazing :thumb:

 

[Zé Tahir]

Couldn't have put it any better Martin

 

[Martin]

++ [ originally posted by Jeeks ] ++


Amazing :thumb:

For once I can't tell if you're being sarcastic

 

[JCK]

++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


For once I can't tell if you're being sarcastic

It's too late for my sarcasm at this moment, it was a good point of view you showed there.

 

[swag]

I vote that Jeeks wasn't being sarcastic.

 

[JCK]

++ [ originally posted by swag ] ++
I vote that Jeeks wasn't being sarcastic.

It really isn't worth it, I admitted the fact.

Who's dat in your avatar?

 

[sallyinzaghi]

Kudos to Trezegol.

The victory is very much appreciated but I cannot help but notice our shaky performance - but of course, Bayern is a really strong side, they played extremely well. I am just extremely thankful we won this game, we were quite stretched, and only hope for rooms of improvement.

I thought Zlatan played better today in comparison to the game vs milan where I thought he should've been taken off (and for a moment wanted to choke him to death in the game). Overall, it was just a tough match for us.

I am still unsure bout Camo's substitution though, was it because he picked up a knock, or was it because he wasnt on form? (Capello claimed it was both ) And I did not get to see the incident that caused Chiellini to go to the ground.

As for Zlatan's red card, he deliberately kicked the opponent twice. The referee was very strict and I guess Zlatan deserved it. Massive skills, but some sense needs to be knocked into the boy's head - leading by a goal against a side like Munich with 5 minutes or so to go - and getting sent off and putting more unnecessary pressure on the team - I do not appreciate such gestures.

 

[Vinman]

++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


I gotta say the more matches I watch, the more I get the feeling some of the people here are rather disconnected from reality. First of all it's the thing with treating Del Piero like he's so different from the whole team, discussing his performance everytime. Often he gets stick for being average, whereas many others get away with being average consistently (Nedved anyone?). To me he's just a team player, it's a bit unsettling to have all this focus on him.

Secondly, people's expectations are out of whack. Like tonight we played probably one of the best teams in Europe and we were lucky to win. Reading the forum I get the impression that people expect us to beat them convincingly, like that's the standard we're aiming for. But when I watch big matches like this, it's almost always even and decided by a small margin. People who think tonight's Bayern will be beaten by several goals I find a bit delusional. We played average tonight and we beat a strong team. Conversely, sometimes we beat small clubs playing like shit and the celebration is resounding.

The thing about Ibrahimovic is that most of the time he's fairly average (like tonight). He's very rarely absolute trash (like vs Milan) and he's very rarely very good. Although the spotlight is on him, he is to me quite consistent, far less magical than people have him being. For his style, he has made quite a few enemies around here and not everyone will wish him well, which is sorta understandable, it's the case with controversial players.

agreed

 

[ZhiXin]

I will give my match report 7 hrs later.
Right now I have some work to do and I will be able to watch the game over again.

 

[rokkstar]

amazing comments really.

First of all, I would like to congratulate and rejoice the victory over Bayern : Revenge Best Served Cold ?

I'm surprised that none of u guys came to see on the tactical side of the match.

Yes it was a hot and cold affair during the match. From what I see, Juve stalled out with an offensive plan on the startup with a formation that I see as 3-4-1-2. This quite suprised me as it had all our three CBs and our fullbacks (Chie and Zambro) working overtime.

dP was NOT at all comfortable in the link-up role. Face it guys, if capello as coach of Juve, I do not see him replace Ibra if he is available. Then where does that leave him? he and mutu were tried as wingers/support strikers during the match Vs milan. it did not work.

Then in the 2nd half, capello reverted to 4-4-2 with neddy just drifting into the middle of the park. this spruced things up and in the following minutes, Juve were more livelier on the onset. Great! This happened becoz' our players were working together as a unit. Even Zlatan was Unselfish in this match. It also helps if u got ya key players on form... drumroll.... trezegoal ---> 4 shots, 3 on target , 2 goals.

about zlatan sent off..... it has been discussed, he feels like a star, that's the trend nowadays ( e.g. Beckham, Rooney?).. leave him.

Mauro for me, it's sad to see him go off like that, I think he has a personal problem / injury bugging..... his mind wasn't in the game.


For me MOM --- Gianluca Zambrotta.

Now for revenge against milano.


Forza Juve, as always...

 

[ZAF3000]

Good post Martin..
I am with you. I am really happy with the result. We are now the top of our group. Result wise we could not ask for more.
My, and others here, concern is the performance.
The keeper's performance is not that good whether its Cheminti or Abbiati. But this hopefully will change as soon as Superman comes back. The deffense is great. The forwards are amazing. Its the midfield that worries us all. They can play solid.. They can be so solid that they can hold a scoreless sheet for as long as they want (if you know what I mean). BUT they are too solid to create. If we get down by 1 goal, even if it was a small team, I have this worries that we will lose because I don't feel that we are capable of seperating a deffense by creativity.
Three years ago that was not the case. If you guys remember the game against Miland durin the 03-04 season first leg. We went down by a goal in the first half. Afterwards we hunted Milan down.. Dida played the best game of his life that night. We hunted them down till Di Vaio scored that magical shot.
In the Champions league you are expected to go down by a goal in mange ocassions.
Lets look back into last season's CL campaign. We won all our matches 1-0 until we have reached Real. We lost 0-1 during that match we could not push forward. Then again we regained ourselves by trashing Madrid (performance wise) at Delle Alpi. We went to Liverpool. We went down by to goals. We could not do anything. No creativity. We manged to pull back one goal thanks to Zambrotta's corss and Fabio's header.
At Delle Alpi everyone was expecting a game like Real's. What people did not realize that Real was not a team. Liverpool wasa avery organised team. In a duration of 90 minutes we could not create anything. We needed one goal only and we had 90 minutes to do so. Creativity was ZERO.
So this is what worries me.

 

[A_LAcki]

++ [ originally posted by Azzurri7 ] ++
Thats Fabiana Mr. Rami....

First of all Congrats for the game...

Another poor performance by Juventus.....I really have no words to describe it...I'm getting fed up with this sitiuation.

I'm happy David managed to save our asses, thanks to Patrick.

Not a bad Formation Crapello started with, tho I don't understand why Kovac and Thuram were both playing when he could have started with either Camo or Mutu to ATTACK and to take control of the game.

Zambrotta was the best player IMO....

Thuram reminded me of his good old days.....

Del Piero was really trying hard but no legs out there to help....Capello was unfair towards him.(again).

Zlatan had a good game but acted like a 12year old kid....So I wouldn't give him 6, Less for sure....

Emerson,Canna were like usually, Solid games....Kovac made lot of mistakes....

and FFS come back gigi....

C'grats again for the win.....and thanks alot Lens..

Howexacly was this a poor game? We won, had a couple of chances and Bayern only scored from a mistake of Abiatti! You are overreacting dude.

 

[sateeh]

well i saw the game last nite and here is wat i thought abt it...

We saw some tactical changes from Don.Fabio, starting with the 3-5-2 formation and then converted again to a different 4-4-2 where neddy played behind the two strikers.

First of all i have to say that i think the team played very against a tough team thatss bayern.... and we deserved the win against them.Although the bayern team wasn't playing bad i have to say, but we deserved the win,cuz we played better over the 90mins.

Abbiati-Wasn't tested much,but i thought he was going to be beaten in that early header from deisler's free kick from trezi,but he saved it well.The goal although it was his fault IMo but also its very hard.Overall he wasnt tested much but also he did well.

Canna-Solid as usual and did some excellent interventions at some times

Kovac- i think he played well against his old team.Although he made some very tough tackles, but he did make any mistakes...just gave away alot of fouls(But that was wat everyone was doing).But overall he did well.

Thuram-I can see why he was played in the center, he lost some pace from his game.But the power is still there, solid all over the field and even had some runs forward..He had a good game against Pizzaro especially and makkay as well.

zambo-How is this guy not considered the best fullback in europe..i just dont know how...Defensively or offensively he can do anything a coach needs.He played a great game last nite again.I liked it in the begining of the game when he outpaced two defenders to reach the ball and deliver a quality cross to trezi which he didnt convert.

Chiellini-well he played much better last nite than the games before.Looks a bit more confident, but he needs more work in my opinion.I hope he gains more experiencewith match practice.He didnt do anything wrong. Had some good crosses as well.

Viera-offensively he didnt have the best of games.Defensivley he played well i think.Held the midfield well but his passes weren't as inspiring as we expected.Ofcourse other than that assist to trezi for the goal.

emo-Forgotten solidier i guess.U cant see wat he did in this game unless u look very closely, especially defensively.Where he u always see him running with ballack to defend with him inside the box.And i saw some good movements from him offensively as well.I think he had a good game.

Alex-I guess if this game wasn't as open as it was and a fast tempo player in the midfield then he would've played a better game.I dont think he had the best of games, he had some nice touches on the ball, and he tried his best as always but it wasn't good enough for this game.I guess cap made the best choice by subbing him although he could've waited a bit, but he made the right choice.

Ibra-i saw one of his better games in a long time.But again i saw the part of his game that i dont like.He gets frustrated too easily, and Martin u talked abt him not making any friends in the forum.I dont think he is making any friends on the field as well.U can see that many players just dont respect him.But thats for another day.
He started veryy well, distributing the ball, dribbling going hard for the ball for the whole 90mins. He played well in this game and i hope he concentrates on keeping the form of this game and even improving it a bit.The two yellow cards were just a shame, should'nt even got the first not to think abt the 2nd.

Trezi-Master finisher, missed an early chanced but compensated with two goals.Most of our traffic was directed towards him cuz players just know , that he will finish the job.Very good game.

Don.Fabio-he tried to start a new formation with 3-5-2 and he succeeded with it.As chances were made and no goals conceeded, u couldn't expect the team to play a great game with a new formation.Then when the system was changed again it was like a new system as well although it was 4-4-2, as neddy wasn't playing on the flank.
camos sub was controversial but he didnt play well and he took an knock as reports said, but also it showed how much more he knows as many ppl would've opted for mutu instead of trezi.

Anyway we have livorno to think abt now then Roma.
and good win last nite
forzaa juvee

 

[sateeh]

++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


I gotta say the more matches I watch, the more I get the feeling some of the people here are rather disconnected from reality. First of all it's the thing with treating Del Piero like he's so different from the whole team, discussing his performance everytime. Often he gets stick for being average, whereas many others get away with being average consistently (Nedved anyone?). To me he's just a team player, it's a bit unsettling to have all this focus on him.

Secondly, people's expectations are out of whack. Like tonight we played probably one of the best teams in Europe and we were lucky to win. Reading the forum I get the impression that people expect us to beat them convincingly, like that's the standard we're aiming for. But when I watch big matches like this, it's almost always even and decided by a small margin. People who think tonight's Bayern will be beaten by several goals I find a bit delusional. We played average tonight and we beat a strong team. Conversely, sometimes we beat small clubs playing like shit and the celebration is resounding.

The thing about Ibrahimovic is that most of the time he's fairly average (like tonight). He's very rarely absolute trash (like vs Milan) and he's very rarely very good. Although the spotlight is on him, he is to me quite consistent, far less magical than people have him being. For his style, he has made quite a few enemies around here and not everyone will wish him well, which is sorta understandable, it's the case with controversial players.

Great post Martin... Spot on in all counts.

Another thing that pisses me off , is that ppl r happy that Ibra got A red card..this is unacceptable.ppl should see the bigger picture here.

 

[Eire]

bayern are a quality team they will be dangerous in the knockouts over two legs im glad juve cant draw them in the last 16.

vieira was not amazing but he needed these games(milan and bayern)
to regain match fitness maybe against livorno and def for the roma match we will see vieira at 100%.

imagine how much more confident our defence will be when gigi is back in goal not to mention a lot better.

this was a valuable win after two hard matches samp and milan

 

[baggio]

++ [ originally posted by sateeh ] ++


ppl should see the bigger picture here.

Dont know about the people, but I sure hope Capello sees the bigger picture here. He's making a monster out of Zlatan by giving him security in his position. Which by the way, is killing any motivations Ibrahimovic would otherwise have if he had to earn his place. And that too, when there's someone on the bench, whose done just about as much as one could expect to be in the first eleven.

 

[Snoop]

++ [ originally posted by snoop ] ++
first of all,I have to say this again,you guys del piero cock suckers,i think you deserve that name,are really pathetic to celebrate the red card for Zlatan. that proves me once again how gays you are ,and not Juve fans..

we have pathetic people here,since they reported me

well,if you celebrate the red card of any Juve player,because you love another player, you deserve that name,and you are not a Juve fan

 

[Martin]

++ [ originally posted by sateeh ] ++


Great post Martin... Spot on in all counts.

Another thing that pisses me off , is that ppl r happy that Ibra got A red card..this is unacceptable.ppl should see the bigger picture here.

I am actually, for several reasons. First of all, Zlatan needs to learn to play cleanly. You don't see any of our other players doing what he does and neither should he. The whole thug mentality is just tiring and he should cut it out. It's alright to try hard, to win the ball off defenders and so on, but do it without drawing fouls.

Secondly, since Capello refuses to bench Zlatan, this is basically the only way he will not play. And I don't think he should play every single match, so far he's played more matches than all the other forwards (and more minutes per match as well I'm quite certain). If you score 10 times in 13 matches, you have a strong case to be untouchable (Trez), but Zlatan is nowhere near as effective and I think Mutu/DP should take his place now and then.

 

[Maresca]

++ [ originally posted by Azzurri7 ] ++


I didn't see him on the bench....He's probably mad at the way he's treated.

yeah, DP should have stayed