CL hangover : Lippi puzzles me (1 Viewer)

nedved34

Senior Member
Oct 3, 2002
3,919
#41
for god sake people.SHUT UP!with this squad.it's a great job to reach final and beat the best ever team in the world REAL MADRID. we need creative midfielders.it's the players that played bad.not lippi.camoranesi was really bad.what can lippi do??
 

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#10

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2002
7,330
#42
yeha i agree m8 jus the team let s down today, didnt really play as well as we kno they can.....but u gotta say di vaio wudda provided more creation than the muscle of zala??
 

kweku

Junior Member
Jul 20, 2002
167
#43
Maybe I praised the change of mentality to early..............

but first of all, the players who feels they should take tke penalties, should do it, so thats probably way Zala and Montero was amoung them five. But I most admit I was suprised to see that Zala took one.;) and yes I said to myself he going to miss it or to be honest i shouted he is going to miss it. :)

But we didn´t lose the beacuase of that, penalties is all down to to luck and nerves.

We lost beacuse we switched back to the old italian mentality, the fear of losing. In the beginning of the when Milan was really controlling the game I thought it might be a tactical decision from Lippi, that we should let them controll the game for the first 10-15 minutes. Maybe because he thought they would attack with many players coming forward and then we would counter attack. But as the first half progressed Milan kept up the pressure, even if we were not outplayed. We didn´t have a passing game at all.


The only time we managed to controll game was the first 10 minutes of the second half. Then my hopes of actually winning the game was rapidly getting higher. but from the 55-58 min until the penalities almost nothing happened from both sides.
They all said this was going to be spectcular game, but the critics of italian football most definetly won this round! :) This might sound crazy, but I thought that it was positive when Real madrid scored that second one.
So with all the facts in hand, I really wished that Sheva goal hadn´t
been cancelled.

Lippis mistakes?

Well I think he wanted to have the best players on the pitch and since Tudor is an overall better player than Birindelli. So thats why he opt to play Montero on the left side, nothing wrong with that. He decided to take Camo out of the game, and even if I really dont think Camo was worse than the rest, I have no problem with this, the sad thing is that we didnt have any better player than Conte to throw in. He didnt play bad at all. But Milan had players like Rivaldo and Ambrosini as midfield subs and even a player like Redondo whom I feel isn´t as good as he used to be, would surely contribute in such a big game. Se my point ;)

Davids got injured so we had to replace him, and this was our last subsitution and having in mind that we had no midfield subs left, putting on a forward was probably the right thing do. Some say it should of been Di vaio, but Di viao has been awful lately, and Zala has managed to score in the last two games. So the decision was probably not that hard. And some say Zala played bad, but he played at the same level as he always does. The guy isn´t better than this, so we shouldn´t complain, at least he played to his ability, something that cant be said about all of our players.

But with the facts in hand, playing Pessotto to the left in midfeild might have been a wiser choice. Because we were tactically a mess last night when we played 3 upfront. Dp didnt link with the midfeilders at all. So playing with four men in midfield with Pessotto to the left would surely not improve our offence. But we were not attacking anyway just making those discusting long balls, so at least it would made it easier for Juve to closed them down. And I admit that I would of been of them who would heavily critisis LIppi for putting on Pessotto instead of a attacker ;). but as I said we were not attacking anyway so....................................................................................................


But the big mistake Lippi made was when Rogue Junior got injured. Why didn´t he swap Zambro and Contes positions? I´m pretty sure it was because he wanted Zambro to help Thuram contain Serginho, even if its understandable, the fear of losing was shown again:rolleyes:. But why not play Del Piero in his old favourite position to the left then? or at least concentrait our attacts to the left instead of those long balls? We had the change to take controll of the game, but we didn´t dare to. And this is why we didnt win the game!

Many complained about Trez in the match thread. I dont understand why? We all know that Trez needs help from his teammates to score goals. So if he isn´t getting the passes what is he supposed to do? I can only recall one good cross from 120 minutes of football, Trez cant dribble, he cant pass etc etc, but we all knew this, so what new about that? And he scores goals when he is given the opportunity to do so. Dont forget he scored two important goals agianst Real madrid, with the help of his teammates of course, but he didnt let us down when he got the oppotunity to score. Dp didn´t play bad but he didn´t play good either. He cant do it all by himself, but i was ecpecting a lot more from him, especially when Nedved was suspended. Nedved played even better than he had done before, when Dp was injured, proving how big of player he really is. Sad to say the "no big game", player tag remains on Dp.

Something that surely cant be said about Buffon, the bigger the game gets, the better Buffon gets. Thank yuo Buffon, respect!
Got ot give praise to Ferrara as well.

But the sad thing is that none of the teams seemed to have that Cl finals inspiration, ecxept for Buffon and Gattuso, you got the love the Gattuso figthing spirit. :) I guees the fear of losing to took the upper hand.

Btw had we won, we hadn´t done it with style and even if winning is the most important and the joy would of been the same, i would of still had that bitter taste in my mouth. Winning as we did against Real madrid gives more satisfaction, you have to admit that. Its a shame that the REal madrid game wont mean anything know. Could of been a classic Juve game.

Congrats MIlan the most positive side won, or maybe I should say the less negative team won ;)


Hopefully we will be back again next year.

Forza Juve
 

tam-tam

New Member
May 29, 2003
13
#44
++ [ originally posted by dj juve ] ++
one things for sure, we depend too much on 1 or 2 players in this team, and it's worrying..
spot on!!!

if we want to be a great team, we have to have a range of capable players and formations, ready to be deployed anytime.

see, we DON'T have to have a replacement for nedved, but we do need an equivalent solution, minus nedved in which the after effect would be similar if we had nedved on the pitch. it's ok to change the way we play the game, as long as it is effective.
 

*aca*

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2002
869
#45
I've seen many JUve games this season, and in many (definitevly not all) of those games Juve performed meakly, and was not looking "dangerous"...

Many draws and victories were gained in the last couple of minutes or in extra time. Sometimes it was luck, sometimes determination of one or two players that did not give up.

Juve's performance last night was bad. DP, Camo, Davids (while he was on the field), or anyone who could win the game for Juve did not wake up. It was one weak performance minus luck and minus determination.

and minus Nedved ;)

Say what you may, this guy is a driving force behind anything Juve did this year. Yeah, team consists of 11 players and he is not alone on the field, but he is on that field much more than anyone else of the Juve players. He takes the lead. When it matters and when it doesnt. DP does it sometimes, Davids too...Nedved is always there, at least this year he was. And yesterday he was not on the field.

Once, here in this forum i said that Nedved is 50 % of Juve this season. Someone almost called me an idiot :D. Take away Nedveds contribution this year from Juve's performance and see what you get. True, there would be someone else on the field, but who? ;)

As regards to Lippi, i dont think there is much blame that can be pinned on him. True, some of the changes he made are "strange" if they can be called that, but he took of Camo who was not even close to Camo in the first half of the season. Maybe he could have put Marco in, but hey, those are the things you never know. Milan for all their ball possesion did not create all that much either and you lost the lotery, not the football game.

Also, this team did more than you could have hoped for. Sure, JUve is always title contender and you are one of the "big" guys, but this team did more than i ever thought they would.

And i think that you should consider that also ;)
 

Hydde

Minimiliano Tristelli
Mar 6, 2003
38,733
#46
yeah, definitely they surpassed the expectations, sadly we lost the cup byourselves, because milan was not a better team than us.

Everything started wrong with that nedved yellow card. I tried to not worry so much, because we cant be reliying in only one player, but sadly this is the way we succed , and he wasnt yesteday.

Lippi´s blame? well , like treze and others, he had a bad game yesterday, but we dont have the right to criticise someone that carried juve to the finals. He is human, and he can do mistakes too, sadly he did does mistakes always on the finals.

The pks?? is not lippi´s fault.....because some players that could scored those penalties, donyt wanted to shoot....... and lippi can force someone , who dont have the winning mentality, to play.

We lost because we failed has a team.

Now we have to find the ways to correct our errors, and be ready to kick asses in next season.
 

bonglegs

New Member
May 29, 2003
13
#47
I have to say that over time I have learned to trust Lippi's "perculiar" decisions; but last night was something else.
4,2,3,1 would have been a better formation. With DP, Zamb and Di V behind Trez.DP could have then really linked the play, which was desparately missing.
Camo was great earlier in the season and I'm a big fan, but he just hasn't been performing of late and shouldn't have started.
 

Ferrari^M

Senior Member
Sep 3, 2002
1,042
#48
If we won no one would be saying any of these. If conte scored at the bar situation we would say great choice lippi for putting conte in.
We lost at penalties for gods sake. We've had a year full of injuries and yet we did so much. I think we shouldn't criticise anyone.

And about the fact that we depend to much on some players.
Hmmm well yes maybe, but don't almost all teams have that?
Real without Zizou is much weaker, Milan with rui costa out yesterday lost much of it's strength, Inter with Vieri and the list goes on.

We lost it yes, so we'll just have to try harder next year.
Don't shoot the best team in the world for this year, because if you look what we've done, yes we had the best team of all.
 

danielão

Senior Member
Jul 12, 2002
671
#50
I think the only mistake Lippi made was not getting the squad to attack even in the slightest when Roque Junior got injured. It was basically like Milan was down to 10 men, but still nothing came.
 

Dragon

Senior Member
Apr 24, 2003
27,407
#51
they were to nervous and the perfect time to score was on min 110 until the end since milan where doing nothing, on those ten minutes juve should have attacked and won the match
 

Stu

Senior Member
Jul 14, 2002
17,557
#52
IMO Lippi is to blame. First of all, his starting lineup was very questionable. Secondly, why on earth did he bring on Zalayeta who's very much an out-and-out striker when he could have brought on Di Vaio who could have dropped back into midfield at times. Thirdly, when Roque Junior was injured, why didn't he push DP or Zambro out to the left to try to take advantage of this, and if he had brought on DV instead of Zala he would have had another outlet at his disposal, and a better penalty taker. And finally, I thought that his choice of peno takers was piss poor. Why did he give Trezeguet, who obviously wasn't confident, the responsibility of taking the first spot kick, and why, oh why, did Montero and Zalayeta kick when Ferrara, Tacchinardi or Zambrotta could have? Sometimes I just get the impression that Lippi tries to be a bit too tricky and he ends up fooling his own self.
 

Juve5150

New Member
May 25, 2003
46
#53
Ryan thinks that they weren't calm enough while playing. There's a different atmosphere around them that somehow made them unable to be... at ease. Something made them nervous (or looked that way), judging by the many times they've slipped to the ground. He thinks probably the absence of Nedved had caused that psychological situation for the rest of the teamates.

Oh well... it ain't over yet for Juve. It'll never be. Keep the faith, Juventinis!
 

tam-tam

New Member
May 29, 2003
13
#54
++ [ originally posted by littleD ] ++
I think the only mistake Lippi made was not getting the squad to attack even in the slightest when Roque Junior got injured. It was basically like Milan was down to 10 men, but still nothing came.
i hoped they would attack like crazy. but they all looked tired....i think:down:
 

Desmond

Senior Member
Jul 12, 2002
8,938
#55
lippi has to bear part of the blame....camoranesi has been horrible in the previous few matches he played in,and although i wasn't exactly shocked imo it turned out to be a mistake.before,i was also rooting for him to play in the final but since he wasn't played in the chievo game,i thought,dv might actualy make more sense.

montero on the left was a mistake,but honestly it didn't turn out to be one.i really thought that he did very well,except for the fact that he didn't even make an effort to attack.thuram was seemingly afraid to over-commit himself to attacking but did well in defence.tudor wasn't bad but could have been better.it wasn't ferrara's best game either,but the performance was an assuring one.

the substitutions were okay though.conte didn't play all that well but still better than the practically non-existent camo in the first half.also,i thought the zala substitution was pretty sensible as we couldn't possibly take off a defender when milan were controlling the game and davids had just taken a knock,and we needed goals then,which zala has provided us with on many important occaisions this season.

as you all are,i am puzzled as to why we didn't take the game to milan when roque junior was injured.we should have attacked even to the extent of risking a counter attack.it was EXTRA TIME,dammit!

----------------------

however, the reason we actually lasted the two hours was because of buffon.i have criticized him lately but he has proven to me that those accusations cannot be applied to the big games lately.the inzaghi save was pure class,he reacted even more quickly than i could have imagined anyone doing and the header was to powerful that i thought that it'd have gone in regardless of whether buffon got a hand to it or not.but he palmed it away to inzaghi's dismay and my joy:touched:
 

my_hitzJUVE

Senior Member
Dec 14, 2002
740
#57
++ [ originally posted by Ferrari^M ] ++
If we won no one would be saying any of these. If conte scored at the bar situation we would say great choice lippi for putting conte in.
We lost at penalties for gods sake. We've had a year full of injuries and yet we did so much. I think we shouldn't criticise anyone.

And about the fact that we depend to much on some players.
Hmmm well yes maybe, but don't almost all teams have that?
Real without Zizou is much weaker, Milan with rui costa out yesterday lost much of it's strength, Inter with Vieri and the list goes on.

We lost it yes, so we'll just have to try harder next year.
Don't shoot the best team in the world for this year, because if you look what we've done, yes we had the best team of all.
u're right...no blame blame after this...look forward...and avoid internal conflict...it will destroy us.
 

JuveBoy

Senior Member
Feb 4, 2003
5,022
#58
++ [ originally posted by A_LAcki ] ++
Well said Ferrari^M!
QUESTION: WHO THINKS THAT WE CAN GO TO THE FINAL NEXT YEAR AGAIN??????????
Lippi did what he could with this team.
Playing in the final of the CL means money so we can buy some good player for the next season
 

Hydde

Minimiliano Tristelli
Mar 6, 2003
38,733
#59
Im just only worried about lippi´s and trezeguet´s words.

Lippi is aying that if he dont win the cup the next year...he will quit juve and dedicate his life to his grandson, because he is ashamed.

Trezeguet was blasting lippi because of the wron decitions!. Ok, i know that lippi did mistakes in that game, but is better to shut the mouth and try to forget. Say to the coach that he was the guilty in his face could cause problems.
 

my_hitzJUVE

Senior Member
Dec 14, 2002
740
#60
++ [ originally posted by Hydde ] ++
Im just only worried about lippi´s and trezeguet´s words.

Lippi is aying that if he dont win the cup the next year...he will quit juve and dedicate his life to his grandson, because he is ashamed.

Trezeguet was blasting lippi because of the wron decitions!. Ok, i know that lippi did mistakes in that game, but is better to shut the mouth and try to forget. Say to the coach that he was the guilty in his face could cause problems.
is it true about trezegol news?...are u sure?
it is bad condition if it really happen...:frown:
 

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