[CL] Champions League 2015/2016 (34 Viewers)
- Thread starter Dostoevsky
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2012 Pirlo was from a different planet so don't even try. He'd be better than Marchisio at sleeping with chisio's wife. Pirlo of 2012 was substantially superior to any regista in the game. Vidal of 2012 is substantially superior to the very mediocre sturaro. Vidal was unstopppable. We currently struggle to control the midfield against Fiorentina for Gods sake.
I'll give you peluso but you have to give me the younger Chiellini and Barzagli and Licht. Again the squad now is better in attack but much worse in midfield and more or less the same at the back.
Allegri is not a better coach and mentality wise I dont know why you think the current team has the old team's mentality. Pirlo, Tevez and Vidal were huge figures and their departure still affects us today. I have no idea how you can praise the current team's mentality as superior to 2011 and 2012 mentality when Conte's team went undefeated for an entire season and were undefeated in Europe beating many good teams on the way like Shakhtar Celtic and Chelsea before succumbing to Bayern. The unprecedented mental and tactical collapse at the start of the season is a clear indicator that this is a new team.
I'll give you peluso but you have to give me the younger Chiellini and Barzagli and Licht. Again the squad now is better in attack but much worse in midfield and more or less the same at the back.
Allegri is not a better coach and mentality wise I dont know why you think the current team has the old team's mentality. Pirlo, Tevez and Vidal were huge figures and their departure still affects us today. I have no idea how you can praise the current team's mentality as superior to 2011 and 2012 mentality when Conte's team went undefeated for an entire season and were undefeated in Europe beating many good teams on the way like Shakhtar Celtic and Chelsea before succumbing to Bayern. The unprecedented mental and tactical collapse at the start of the season is a clear indicator that this is a new team.
What Lgor said.
But I could imagine that stuff about Bonucci to be knowingly exaggerated to rile people up as well, but not sure.
Most satisfying non-Juve game I've every watched in my whole life. Actually, among the most satisfying games of football I've ever watched in general.
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Haven't watched them enough to really rate the guy's performance in general, but that one goal was 100% his fault
But I could imagine that stuff about Bonucci to be knowingly exaggerated to rile people up as well, but not sure.
They love attacking circus football and if an attacking team loses to a counter attacking team they say that the counter attacking team are cheaters. They think that the team with more created chances should win the game and not the team that scored more goals
finale dahoam
@DAiDEViL
finale dahoam
@DAiDEViL
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Haven't watched them enough to really rate the guy's performance in general, but that one goal was 100% his fault
It's weird to forget how ridiculously strong and well rounded our team was except for the mediocre attack. Our midfield used to bully majority of its opponents.
Now you have Marchisio as only reliable consistent presence defensively. With the added downside of him not being much a playmaker besides lacking top class covering warrior next to him.
Of course, but by the spring of 2013 he severely declined. Not the same player anymore and clearly an inferior to his 2012 levels. Bayern's midfield completely overrun him. Current Marchisio would cope up far better in this task.
We gave them the ball but shut down every area of the pitch. Their 60% possession had no relevance on the match and their only shot on target was from the penalty kick. Deliberately conceding possession and luring them into our trap. The important thing is what you are able to create when in possession and we clearly didn't struggle during the match and never looked troubled. Hey, I'll give you Celtic game as an example (since you like to bring it up), when we also conceded possession, but the scoreline was 3-0 in our favor. Never understood the fascination that some here have with possession. Pretty much useless stat.
Barza and Chiello are about the same level as then.
Staggering that anyone would say that after tremendous campaing last year and completely turning things around this term. Allegri is a better manager. Deal with it. His ability to read the game and exploit opponent's weaknesses is second to none.
We couldn't beat teams like Galata or Copenhagen in his 2nd CL season, or 10 men Benfica ffs, while practically the same team reached the final last term. Clearly the mentality was an issue for us. This year eventhough we struggled at the beggining of the season, mostly in Serie A (due to many new faces) we fairly easy managed to qualify for the second round in the CL. The right mentality.
We gave them the ball but shut down every area of the pitch. Their 60% possession had no relevance on the match and their only shot on target was from the penalty kick. Deliberately conceding possession and luring them into our trap. The important thing is what you are able to create when in possession and we clearly didn't struggle during the match and never looked troubled. Hey, I'll give you Celtic game as an example (since you like to bring it up
), when we also conceded possession, but the scoreline was 3-0 in our favor. Never understood the fascination that some here have with possession. Pretty much useless stat. Barza and Chiello are about the same level as then.
Staggering that anyone would say that after tremendous campaing last year and completely turning things around this term. Allegri is a better manager. Deal with it. His ability to read the game and exploit opponent's weaknesses is second to none.
We couldn't beat teams like Galata or Copenhagen in his 2nd CL season, or 10 men Benfica ffs, while practically the same team reached the final last term. Clearly the mentality was an issue for us. This year eventhough we struggled at the beggining of the season, mostly in Serie A (due to many new faces) we fairly easy managed to qualify for the second round in the CL. The right mentality.
i feel you. 
Finale Dahoam - best non juve/italy related football day ever.
best friend threw me out of his apartment because i wouldnt stop laughing.
Finale Dahoam - best non juve/italy related football day ever.
best friend threw me out of his apartment because i wouldnt stop laughing.
Our current team is better than 2012.... Our defense is almost the same, except that compare AS and Evra with Peluso and De ceglie is kind of XXXXXXX
If we manage somehow to keep Pereira, Asamoah and Khedira healthy... Our current MF would be in a close level than 2012...
Current Pobga = Vidal 2012
Current Marchisio << Pirlo 2012
Current Khedira < Marchisio 2012
There's not need to compare Vucinic, Quagliarella and Matri with Mandzu, Morata and La Joya
Last but no less, Conte turn head to the bench and cry... Max have options
If we manage somehow to keep Pereira, Asamoah and Khedira healthy... Our current MF would be in a close level than 2012...
Current Pobga = Vidal 2012
Current Marchisio << Pirlo 2012
Current Khedira < Marchisio 2012
There's not need to compare Vucinic, Quagliarella and Matri with Mandzu, Morata and La Joya
Last but no less, Conte turn head to the bench and cry... Max have options
In attacking sense (even if Vidal was more deadly) yes, but in defense sense? HUGE HUGE gulf of difference, and the impact it had. Lead by example and set the tempo (as is the way Pirlo lead and made everyone take a breather by taking reigns at any given situation), bullied anything in sight. Pretty much Conte style, made sure everyone just gunho pressed the opposition machine like, dont let them breath.
Dont see that as much now, we drop deeper and are organised, move smart as a unit, Allegri prefers that, more guarded approach with slower tempo over frenzied hounding (but also not his fault Vidal is sold and you get no one that can offer same type of work in midfield, ala Allan or Naingolan etc), cant escape that, we simply lack the aggression and ability to hound and scare ball holders. I mean the best at it for us right now is our box striker Mandzukic, thats not a good sign. Vidal did the work of two players in such a style. Never underestimate that. The ability to be first on lose balls and give minimum amount of seconds on the ball unharassed for your average opposition player.
I will stop rambling and offer a visual aid for this very very important aspect we miss dearly, this a clip of Hernanes facing us from that season:
What do you notice?
look at fucking Vidal, ANIMAL, but also look at all of the players, they were INSTILLED to be terriers in a way we lack now sadly defensively. This aspect is needed much more for CL big games too, and level of quality difference someone like Vidal brings, even he was limping he did more then Khedira is doing in this aspect right now.
Dont see that as much now, we drop deeper and are organised, move smart as a unit, Allegri prefers that, more guarded approach with slower tempo over frenzied hounding (but also not his fault Vidal is sold and you get no one that can offer same type of work in midfield, ala Allan or Naingolan etc), cant escape that, we simply lack the aggression and ability to hound and scare ball holders. I mean the best at it for us right now is our box striker Mandzukic, thats not a good sign. Vidal did the work of two players in such a style. Never underestimate that. The ability to be first on lose balls and give minimum amount of seconds on the ball unharassed for your average opposition player.
I will stop rambling and offer a visual aid for this very very important aspect we miss dearly, this a clip of Hernanes facing us from that season:
What do you notice?
look at fucking Vidal, ANIMAL, but also look at all of the players, they were INSTILLED to be terriers in a way we lack now sadly defensively. This aspect is needed much more for CL big games too, and level of quality difference someone like Vidal brings, even he was limping he did more then Khedira is doing in this aspect right now.
Of course, but by the spring of 2013 he severely declined. Not the same player anymore and clearly an inferior to his 2012 levels. Bayern's midfield completely overrun him. Current Marchisio would cope up far better in this task.
We gave them the ball but shut down every area of the pitch. Their 60% possession had no relevance on the match and their only shot on target was from the penalty kick. Deliberately conceding possession and luring them into our trap. The important thing is what you are able to create when in possession and we clearly didn't struggle during the match and never looked troubled. Hey, I'll give you Celtic game as an example (since you like to bring it up), when we also conceded possession, but the scoreline was 3-0 in our favor. Never understood the fascination that some here have with possession. Pretty much useless stat.
Barza and Chiello are about the same level as then.
Staggering that anyone would say that after tremendous campaing last year and completely turning things around this term. Allegri is a better manager. Deal with it. His ability to read the game and exploit opponent's weaknesses is second to none.
We couldn't beat teams like Galata or Copenhagen in his 2nd CL season, or 10 men Benfica ffs, while practically the same team reached the final last term. Clearly the mentality was an issue for us. This year eventhough we struggled at the beggining of the season, mostly in Serie A (due to many new faces) we fairly easy managed to qualify for the second round in the CL. The right mentality.
We gave them the ball but shut down every area of the pitch. Their 60% possession had no relevance on the match and their only shot on target was from the penalty kick. Deliberately conceding possession and luring them into our trap. The important thing is what you are able to create when in possession and we clearly didn't struggle during the match and never looked troubled. Hey, I'll give you Celtic game as an example (since you like to bring it up
), when we also conceded possession, but the scoreline was 3-0 in our favor. Never understood the fascination that some here have with possession. Pretty much useless stat. Barza and Chiello are about the same level as then.
Staggering that anyone would say that after tremendous campaing last year and completely turning things around this term. Allegri is a better manager. Deal with it. His ability to read the game and exploit opponent's weaknesses is second to none.
We couldn't beat teams like Galata or Copenhagen in his 2nd CL season, or 10 men Benfica ffs, while practically the same team reached the final last term. Clearly the mentality was an issue for us. This year eventhough we struggled at the beggining of the season, mostly in Serie A (due to many new faces) we fairly easy managed to qualify for the second round in the CL. The right mentality.
If you are going the too many new players route, Conte's 2011 had more new players, no winning experience at all apart from Buffon and Pirlo and yet Conte made them into an unbeatable team despite the extremely mediocre attack and he was competing against Allegri's Milan. Allegri this year has a better squad with less changes and more experience and he gave us Juve's worst start in its recent history. Similarly, this season Mancini had more new players to integrate and a worse squad and yet he has started the same competition much better.
Allegri is better at managing the CL no question there, but he is not generally the better coach. In Serie A, Conte always gets the upper hand and again beat Allegri's Milan themselves while Ibra was still there and on fire.
In any case, my main point was that the old Bayern had no weaknesses. The current Bayern are beatable using good counterattacking football. We have a better chance now than we had a few years ago even though we lack the momentum that we had back then going into the Bayern match.
You see, this here is a football forum, and when the topic comes up comparing a football team 3 years ago to now, adults interested in communicating as sane and not so self-absorbed nincompoop maniacs, recall how it was and respond and discuss the differences in various aspects or view points. Its very fascinating stuff, you should try it sometime.
You see, this here is a football forum, and when the topic comes up comparing a football team 3 years ago to now, adults interested in communicating as sane and not so self-absorbed nincompoop maniacs, recall how it was and respond and discuss the differences in various aspects or view points. Its very fascinating stuff, you should try it sometime.
You see, this here is a football forum, and when the topic comes up comparing a football team 3 years ago to now, adults interested in communicating as sane and not so self-absorbed nincompoop maniacs, recall how it was and respond and discuss the differences in various aspects or view points. Its very fascinating stuff, you should try it sometime.
For serious though:
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You see, this here is a football forum, and when the topic comes up comparing a football team 3 years ago to now, adults interested in communicating as sane and not so self-absorbed nincompoop maniacs, recall how it was and respond and discuss the differences in various aspects or view points. Its very fascinating stuff, you should try it sometime.
Get over it Osman, Vidal is gone and him and Pogba are completely different players.
Conte is a big motivator and tactically good. Allegri is an inferior motivator, but good with young players and a better tactician.
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