[CL] Champions League 2010/11 (27 Viewers)

[Osman]

It was enough that Messi scored for the first time ever on English soil just yesterday and only after Van Der Saar was falling asleep.

Hehe yeah, that was only thing missing, not that he scores like crazy against any opposition in club level and has scored in two CL finals, whatever country that hosts it, but what was missing to show how good he is, was to score in England, his 11 goals in the CL this season didnt matter, the 12th one did because it was in England

 

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[Luca]

we can say that Zidane is a better player than Messi because he lead his team to a World Cup and led his CRIPPLED team managed by a dunce to a World Cup final.

So now Cruijff must be discounted since he lead a technically superior Netherlands to the World Cup in '74 but didnt win? I don't see how this can be used to measure a player...

 

[Alen]

Now all that is left is Messi to score a goal in South Africa.

Oh wait, he can't. He had a chance but royally choked.

 

[king Ale]

Those who won't understand my point will laugh at the comparison, but I see a similarity between Messi and Pedro. The similarity is that the way their club plays, its style, makes them at least 2-3 times better players than they are.
Obviously, the difference in quality between the two is sky-earth.

Btw, I'd really like to see Pedro in Parma and Giovinco in Barca. 2 or 3 seasons will be enough. I have a feeling that Seba will be just as good as Pedro is in Barca and the gypsy will be worse than Seba is in Parma.

Exactly. I'm not speculating things. I'm telling about what I have seen of him. He is an absolutely average player while playing for his national team.

Considering how young he was when he started to shine, I'd say he has already had enough time to prove me wrong by pulling better performances for his national side. He has lost on them all. It's a similar case to Del Piero, an extraordinary player in his club, a total average player for the Azzurri (Ale was barely given the role he had in Juve though, unlike Messi). That's why Ale is never comparable to Baggio even if he was a much more important feature for Juve.

 

[Rhizoid]

Do you think Xavi alone would do anything with an average team/unbalanced team like Argentina? Dont even need to hypothetically bring him to Argentina to make that point, he has played in a mediocre Barca and Spain in big part of his career, and he didnt "step up" as many say too easily. Not realizing the obvious of what a team game it is.

Argentina NT is a fuck up untattered joke of a team after another with new coaches all the time. Expecting one player to magically fix that alone, even if its the best player in the world, is missing the obvious. Huge difference playing with that and the best team around, not just quality, but most teamwork oriented with a particular style that is infused to whole squad for a decade.

Xavi has played with an unbalanced Barca side, if you remember the inconsistent Barca side of 2002-2003 under LVG/Antic...Xavi was still perhaps their most outstanding player, even scoring against Juve in that great win in the Nou Camp!

 

[Osman]

So now Cruijff must be discounted since he lead a technically superior Netherlands to the World Cup in '74 but didnt win? I don't see how this can be used to measure a player...

That was what I said earlier, Maradona lead Argie to two WC finals, if they had lost the 86 WC final, would Maradona been a legend but a dismissed one a bit like Cruyff is? That carrying your team to two WC finals doesnt matter, that you will only be hailed highly if you win one?

 

[Bianconero_Aus]

Until Messi scores on a wet Tuesday night at the Brittania against Stoke, he hasnt made it IMO.

 

[Osman]

Xavi has played with an unbalanced Barca side, if you remember the inconsistent Barca side of 2002-2003 under LVG/Antic...Xavi was still perhaps their most outstanding player, even scoring against Juve in that great win in the Nou Camp!

I remember, and I remember Xavi was nowhere near as good as he has been since 2006.

 

[Snoop]

Now all that is left is Messi to score a goal in South Africa.

Oh wait, he can't. He had a chance but royally choked.

 

[king Ale]

Amazing how people tend to forget this simple fact.

People can hate on him all they want, but if I had to start a team and pick one player to build around, this kid is the guy.

Ale was 24 when he failed to perform in world cup 98. It never happened in the future either.

Messi is 23 but has already won the world footballer player of the year award, is experienced enough, has had the right players in his national side to play with and has been given the role which suits him the best. It has just not clicked yet for him. Sure, there are so many years left in his career but his history of play in his national side just doesn't look promising at all.

 

[JCK]

So now Cruijff must be discounted since he lead a technically superior Netherlands to the World Cup in '74 but didnt win? I don't see how this can be used to measure a player...

I really fail to see how I discredited Cruiff in what I said.

 

[Alen]

Ale was 24 when he failed to perform in world cup 98. It never happened in the future either.

He was still 23. Stop with your weird way of counting years
And yes, you are 25, not 26!

 

[JCK]

That was what I said earlier, Maradona lead Argie to two WC finals, if they had lost the 86 WC final, would Maradona been a legend but a dismissed one a bit like Cruyff is? That carrying your team to two WC finals doesnt matter, that you will only be hailed highly if you win one?

What Zidane did in 2006 was more than what he did in 1998, France won in 1998 but lost in the final in 2006.

 

[Luca]

I really fail to see how I discredited Cruiff in what I said.

You mentioned, no more like made clear that a vital factor in your argument was that Zidane led a crippled team. My point was if that is what you're pointing out made him and his world cup story (at the least) as success, then why should Cruijff be regarded as one of the all time greats if he lead a completely superior team and failed?

 

[PhRoZeN]

Until Messi scores on a wet Tuesday night at the Brittania against Stoke, he hasnt made it IMO.

 

[am0110]

More of like you and less of am0110

I feel sorry for you

 

[Snoop]

He was still 23. Stop with your weird way of counting years
And yes, you are 25, not 26!

My father counts that way too, and it kills me

 

[king Ale]

My father counts that way too, and it kills me

When you are 25 years and 8 months old, it gets rounded to 26

 

[Snoop]

When you are 25 years and 8 months old, it gets rounded to 26

Wrong! even if you are 25 years and 364 days, you are 25

would you call one month old baby a 1 year old?

 

[king Ale]

Better than that, would you call them zero old babies?