Calciopoli or Morattopoli.. inter fake orgasm (38 Viewers)

[JCK]

when you supported the team in Serie B you didn't feel like maybe Juve had an enemy or two?

No, I went to Torino and watched a game and supported the team in their hard times and I watched them come back to Serie A and I felt happy for their return.

No I want you to not believe he conspiracy. I never presented one, the gazzetta did. The only conspiracy there is you believe already. The "Moggi was the antichrist puppet master of soccer" theory. I showed how silly the theory was and how unjust the trial was.

No matter how you twist the words, Juventus were punished and you think this is a set up. As I said, I watch the game for the love of Juventus and the sport not to hate my rivals and wish death upon them or call them enemies or whatever you and others give them names. Inter fans are people, Liverpool fans are also people. Moratti is a club president, he might be different but I don't know about that, I have never met him. The only thing I know is that Moggi hurt the image of the club I love and the whole story ends here.

whoever doesn't want to know about farsopoli doesn't have to read the thread, simple.

Farsopoli is an inexistent word. WAKE UP!!!

So what about Liverpool fans then?

Oh right, they control Telecom. Now I get it.

No, Liverpool fans control slaughter houses and booze according to Turk.

 

Buy on AliExpress.com

[gsol]

Jack, Moggi was used as an excuse to hurt the team WE love. I don't "think" it was a set up. The setup was uncovered and I'm confident that it will eventually become public knowledge.

 

[JCK]

Until then...

 

[JCK]

I have a question though, if you are so technical and you don't consider Calciopoli a conspiracy, did it start as a conspiracy then?

 

[Cronios]

Gsol i also have a question,
considering what the "shadow man' said and what have you posted,
about Montezemolo hurting Juve's interests. I still fail do understand what kind of interest he would have, what kind of conflicts between Juve Ferrari and Fiat exise
and how the relegation of Juve can help Fiat to regain some financial stability??
I dont think its a logic conclusion since the Agnelli family was very pleased with the Moggi system, the never had to invest money on Juve and Moggi was able to deliver some good results and give the all the necessary prestige without the necessary investments!!
Why would anyone want to mess with this balance?
Whats your opinion, i think you know better the details on this specific topic.

 

[gsol]

I have a question though, if you are so technical and you don't consider Calciopoli a conspiracy, did it start as a conspiracy then?

If you are asking, "did certain people conspire to damage Juve?" the answer is yes.

I claim that what is stated about Farsopoli is fact and not "a conspiracy theory" like some say. That's an easy word to throw around but the truth is that a conspiracy theory ceases to be a conspiracy theory the moment it is proven. As soon as the publications of the sentences occured, the "conspiracy theory" became a fact and all evidence afterwards only served to support that fact.

Yes there were conspirators who organized the farse, some are already in prison (Tavarolli and Ghioni) and there are links to articles here explaining their arrests.

 

[gsol]

Gsol i also have a question,
considering what the "shadow man' said and what have you posted,
about Montezemolo hurting Juve's interests. I still fail do understand what kind of interest he would have, what kind of conflicts between Juve Ferrari and Fiat exise
and how the relegation of Juve can help Fiat to regain some financial stability??
I dont think its a logic conclusion since the Agnelli family was very pleased with the Moggi system, the never had to invest money on Juve and Moggi was able to deliver some good results and give the all the necessary prestige without the necessary investments!!
Why would anyone want to mess with this balance?
Whats your opinion, i think you know better the details on this specific topic.

This is a topic open to interpretation so please don't jump down my throat.

Keep in mind the Agnelli brothers were dead and no longer able to support the triade.

Juventus was self sustaining. They didn't ask for money but they also didn't share it. Juventus was almost like the black sheep of the IFIL/FIAT group.

FIAT went through some hard times financially and Juventus obviously didn't lend a hand as the team had it's own projects in mind. Montezemolo assuming financial control from the triade would erase that. If you think about it, yes Juventus lost over 200 million euros in Calciopoli but it almost entirely came back when Tronchetti's Telecom sponsored Ferrari SpA (I posted the article and remember that Montezemolo is acting Ferrari President).

Then the Elkan's turned around and refinanced Juventus 104.5 million euros from IFIL funds essentially pocketing the rest which was used for other FIAT related projects. Now FIAT is more involved in Juventus than it had been in recent times (New Holland Sponsorship).

The loss was fast and temporary but the benefits now rest with FIAT as they have total financial control again. Should Juventus become excessively profitable again like in the triade days, FIAT will know they can count on that money too.

 

[Cronios]

I see your point and i vaguely remember the reallocation of the funds reported by your self and some Italian media. Hmm i have to remark there is a logic in your argument there... but again the Agnelli's family prestige has been suffered severe loses by Juve's relegation as a whole,.
IMO not the best way to make business and make money,
one the other hand the remaining Agnelli's are silly enough to try that, esp in such a desperate times.
Though i remember Montezemolo refusing many times over any kind of involvement with football and Juve, despite even the avocato himself has been said to propose him a place as a global sporting director. I dont think that Montezemelo was the mastermind, he has been offered supreme power but he declined to grab her, along with the full responsibility.
His ambitions do not much on this profile.
So that leaves just a few options, within the Agnelli, capable of pulling this of...

 

[gsol]

Montezemolo didn't want to run the team because he doesn't understand the economics of the sport. he just wanted access to the finances. through the new triade and primarily Blanc he now has that.

The Agnelli family always had a bad image when it came to soccer because the press was relentless in crucifying the team. Now it looks like they cleaned themselves up in the public eye.

The loss of face and money was temporary. Now they have total control. As far a image is concerned...I doubt the sold fewer FIAT 500s because of Calciopoli...but they did get the key to their finances.

 

[gsol]

I want to pose a question now.

We all know that in order to fix a match you need the co-operation of someone outside your camp. There are a million ways to go about it but inevitably to fix a game you need to either corrupt the adversary or the referee. There is no other way.

Since no referees and or player/managers of other teams were convicted (for Juventus matches or matches of Juventus’ direct adversaries) then how could Moggi and Giraudo have fixed a match?

Keep in mind that all other convicted parties like De Santis were convicted for games that didn’t affect Juventus Lecce-Parma on the last day of the season when Juve were already champions).

 

[Cronios]

Yea, i ve pointed out the same annoying quaestion back then and never got an answer...
I repeat the same question to everybody who laughs about Juve and never had a straight answer.
Most of the ppl point at the easy victims, Moggi and the refs and managers that have been banned.
They dont know anything more, they dont need not know anything more, this is what they wanted to believe, this is what gazzetta served them, this is what everybody believes...

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

their most common response to those questions is, "I don't know about all that, but I've seen how Juve have been cheating all these years with my own eyes."

 

[gsol]

I hear that too. Then I point out all the occasions that similar calls kept Juve from earning points and titles and they mysteriously don't remember them.

 

[Seven]

Jack, Moggi was used as an excuse to hurt the team WE love. I don't "think" it was a set up. The setup was uncovered and I'm confident that it will eventually become public knowledge.

gsol,

there is not a single doubt in my mind that we were screwed over by someone. Either we weren't the only ones guilty or perhaps no one ever really was guilty, but either way someone screwed us.

But like I said a couple of months ago, this kind of thing is natural to Italian society. Especially in the world of football, I have always found that in Italy a lot of shady deals go on. To make matters even worse, everyone is always trying to detect a conspiracy.

However, I consider a quest for the truth irrelevant. Either Juventus now is clean or they always were. In any case, I'm cheering for a proper team. And I just don't find the time to care about anything else anymore. Even if I'm a huge Juventus fan, I'm Belgian enough to realise it's just football.

 

[Salvo]

gsol,

there is not a single doubt in my mind that we were screwed over by someone. Either we weren't the only ones guilty or perhaps no one ever really was guilty, but either way someone screwed us.

But like I said a couple of months ago, this kind of thing is natural to Italian society. Especially in the world of football, I have always found that in Italy a lot of shady deals go on. To make matters even worse, everyone is always trying to detect a conspiracy.

However, I consider a quest for the truth irrelevant. Either Juventus now is clean or they always were. In any case, I'm cheering for a proper team. And I just don't find the time to care about anything else anymore. Even if I'm a huge Juventus fan, I'm Belgian enough to realise it's just football.

well said

 

[Vinman]

gsol,

there is not a single doubt in my mind that we were screwed over by someone. Either we weren't the only ones guilty or perhaps no one ever really was guilty, but either way someone screwed us.

But like I said a couple of months ago, this kind of thing is natural to Italian society. Especially in the world of football, I have always found that in Italy a lot of shady deals go on. To make matters even worse, everyone is always trying to detect a conspiracy.

However, I consider a quest for the truth irrelevant. Either Juventus now is clean or they always were. In any case, I'm cheering for a proper team. And I just don't find the time to care about anything else anymore. Even if I'm a huge Juventus fan, I'm Belgian enough to realise it's just football.

100% agree with everything, up until the last paragraph....finding out the truth would be some sort of vindication...not that it will change things, however

 

[Salvo]

i beleive we were screwed over. i believe we didnt do anything wrong. IMO it was all jealousy, because every one new we were at the top and no one could compete with us. we were nearing our 3 star were everyone els was one 1. this conspiracy is goes deap into italian football and into even politics. teams got jealous and pulled us down.

 

[JCK]

gsol,

there is not a single doubt in my mind that we were screwed over by someone. Either we weren't the only ones guilty or perhaps no one ever really was guilty, but either way someone screwed us.

But like I said a couple of months ago, this kind of thing is natural to Italian society. Especially in the world of football, I have always found that in Italy a lot of shady deals go on. To make matters even worse, everyone is always trying to detect a conspiracy.

However, I consider a quest for the truth irrelevant. Either Juventus now is clean or they always were. In any case, I'm cheering for a proper team. And I just don't find the time to care about anything else anymore. Even if I'm a huge Juventus fan, I'm Belgian enough to realise it's just football.

Couldn't be said better.

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

so then we can agree that we were f---ed over?

 

[Snoop]

Ofcourse we do, but that doesn't necessary mean that we were punished for nothing, or we were innocent!