Antonio Conte (238 Viewers)

[Bianconero_Aus]

We can control the midfield and have possesion for 80% of the game, but if we create fuck all opportunities it isnt worth shit.

Stick to the 4-4-2. Even if our wingers arent performing at their best, we have an extra body upfront to help make things happen.

Nothing more annoying than seeing a striker isolated and surrounded by 4 or 5 players all the time.

 

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[Azzurri7]

How doesn't 4-3-3/4-5-1/4-1-4-1 fit Pirlo? Its the perfect formation for him.

We just need to have more attacking wingers. Play Vucinic - Matri - Quag/Elia/Krasic

Whatever Conte does, he should absolutely not go back to a 2 man central midfield again because the strongest part of our team right now is our 3 man midfield with Vidal, Marchisio and Pirlo and they give us an edge out there.

Where did I mention 4-3-3? I did refer to 4-5-1 though. The way we played with 4-5-1 we looked over-crowded in the middle and Pirlo didn't have the freedom he looks/seeks in the game.

 

[Nenz]

I'm trying to think. Was there a game where we started the 4-2-4 and weren't able to create? And was there a game where we played the 4-3-3/4-1-4-1 and did create a lot of clear cut chances? I remember we played a more conservative 4-3-3 to start against Catania and we then had to change to a 4-2-4 which opened up the game. Against Milan we played 4-1-4-1 and considering how much we dominated we probably didn't create enough real chances which was evident until Marchisio broke the deadlock. Now against Chievo the 4-1-4-1 system again and we see the same problem. Lots of possession and not enough chances. As for our record so far in creating chances with the 4-2-4 I'm not 100% sure how many more opportunities we gave ourselves but what I am sure of is that it created a whole lot more than the 4-1-4-1 so far. It doesn't matter if we play a 4-1-4-1 or a 4-3-3. We still have two problems - no space in midfield and an isolated striker.

As we play more we find out more and what we're finding out is that the 4-1-4-1 or 4-3-3 is the best way to achieve nil all draws.

 

[Juventino★★★]

I think some people have very short memories and have forgotten the past few seasons.

not only the past few seasons but even in our days we were struggling against Bari, Lecce, Verona...etc

and Conte was right about the attitude and that Chievo on form. they were great defensively and we dont have the young Del Piero to kill the game in one magical moment.

some of the results against small team in the 2001-2002:

Lecce Juventus 0:0
Bologna Juventus 0:0
Parma Juventus 1:0
Piacenza Juventus 0:1

2002-2003:

Bologna Juventus 2:2
Atalanta Juventus 1:1
AC Perugia Juventus 0:1
Brescia Juventus 2:0
Juventus Bologna 1:1
Piacenza Juventus 0:1
Modena Juventus 0:1
Juventus Como 1:1

 

[Azzurri7]

I'm trying to think. Was there a game where we started the 4-2-4 and weren't able to create? And was there a game where we played the 4-3-3/4-1-4-1 and did create a lot of clear cut chances? I remember we played a more conservative 4-3-3 to start against Catania and we then had to change to a 4-2-4 which opened up the game. Against Milan we played 4-1-4-1 and considering how much we dominated we probably didn't create enough real chances which was evident until Marchisio broke the deadlock. Now against Chievo the 4-1-4-1 system again and we see the same problem. Lots of possession and not enough chances. As for our record so far in creating chances with the 4-2-4 I'm not 100% sure how many more opportunities we gave ourselves but what I am sure of is that it created a whole lot more than the 4-1-4-1 so far. It doesn't matter if we play a 4-1-4-1 or a 4-3-3. We still have two problems - no space in midfield and an isolated striker.

As we play more we find out more and what we're finding out is that the 4-1-4-1 or 4-3-3 is the best way to achieve nil all draws.

You're spot on.

4-2-4

vs Parma = 4-0
vs Siena = 1-0 (We could have score more)
vs Bologna = 1-0 (Until Vucinic was red carded, Dp taken out at HT and we played with 1striker)

= 9points out of 3games we grabbed while playing 4-2-4 (Except Bologna's 2nd half when we played with 1striker due to Vuci's red card)


4-5-1

vs Catania 1-1 (We all remember how weak we were and the hard time Catania gave us, check the match threads)
vs Milan 2-0 (It worked but still few questions mark over Bonera's gift)
vs Chievo 0-0 (Well, we all saw this)

= 5points 3games we grabbed playing 4-5-1.

 

[Bezzy]

you forget only that chievo is way better then siena (who cleary is one of the weakest in serie A)
and milan came to our stadium for a draw.

 

[Azzurri7]

you forget only that chievo is way better then siena (who cleary is one of the weakest in serie A)
and milan came to our stadium for a draw.

Okay Janna, shut the fuck up.

 

[Nenz]

You're spot on.

4-2-4

vs Parma = 4-0
vs Siena = 1-0 (We could have score more)
vs Bologna = 1-0 (Until Vucinic was red carded, Dp taken out at HT and we played with 1striker)

= 9points out of 3games we grabbed while playing 4-2-4 (Except Bologna's 2nd half when we played with 1striker due to Vuci's red card)


4-5-1

vs Catania 1-1 (We all remember how weak we were and the hard time Catania gave us, check the match threads)
vs Milan 2-0 (It worked but still few questions mark over Bonera's gift)
vs Chievo 0-0 (Well, we all saw this)

= 5points 3games we grabbed playing 4-5-1.

And even the second goal against Milan was another gift from Abbiati. Bonucci probably had the only real clear cut chance that game. Against both Catania and Chievo we ended up switching to the 4-2-4 and saw a huge difference. I'd just like to see consistency. We shouldn't be afraid of stronger teams dominating our 4-2-4. What kind of winning mentality is that? Time to pick a system that works and back it. If it doesn't work during a game then by all means Conte should change things around but at least start the evidently best formation to begin with!

 

[Cheesio]

How can you come up with that conclusion? I thought almost everyone agrees that Pirlo works best with 3-man midfielders.

I two think he worked better in a 2 man MF where he was not as pressed and the MF wasn't as crowded as this, the problem with our 3 MF is that neither Marchisio or Vidal are good passer which is important when you play a 3 man MF, ( Barca have Iniesta, Milan in the golden days had Seedorf...) When you play a 3 man MF Pirlo is too deep it's easy to pressure him and none of Marchisio or Vidal has the ability to drop back to help him and starts the attack this is why we so many long balls from him in this game and this will be the problem whenever we play a small side who'll press Pirlo like this, I'd rather we play 2 man MF when he has options on the wings, one of the strikers alwas dropping to receive a pass and above all one DM who will be close to him in case they pressure him.
Another problem we have for the 3-3 that we don't capable wingers for this system, I'm sure that if we continued to play Chievo with that system and Ale didn't come in we wouldn't score even if they gave us another half, Vucinic is no goal scorer and he's way too isolated, Pepe and Krasic are jokes, you need wingers that can score and create and the onse that run and cross and Marchisio and Vidal are not MF who are know for their regular scoring.

 

[Linebreak]

Pirlo imo is clearly better in a 2 man CM - he gets more time and space and seems to play slightly higher up the pitch.

We've created the most chances playing 4-2-4 - Conte should stop being a coward and make a decision between Vidal and Marchisio.

 

[deggen10]

I thought this midfield was set-up so one of Marchisio/Vidal would be providing the support up front so more like a 4-2-3-1. This happened against Milan but not so much Chievo. Maybe the heat, maybe the communication. I think it's preferable to always play AP/AV/CM in mid but maybe he should go with a winger/striker on the left (if Chiellini is there).

Licht - Bon - Barz - Chiellini
------Pirlo--March/Vidal
--------Vidal/March----
Pepe?---------------Vucinic
----------Matri--------

 

[TrezJuve]

Pirlo imo is clearly better in a 2 man CM - he gets more time and space and seems to play slightly higher up the pitch.

We've created the most chances playing 4-2-4 - Conte should stop being a coward and make a decision between Vidal and Marchisio.

Yeah and furthermore, we always had a lot more movement going on with 4-2-4 (especially from wingers and strikers) and we also were moving the ball forward much more quickly. It was heaven like for Pirlo.

I thought this midfield was set-up so one of Marchisio/Vidal would be providing the support up front so more like a 4-2-3-1. This happened against Milan but not so much Chievo. Maybe the heat, maybe the communication. I think it's preferable to always play AP/AV/CM in mid but maybe he should go with a winger/striker on the left (if Chiellini is there).

Licht - Bon - Barz - Chiellini
------Pirlo--March/Vidal
--------Vidal/March----
Pepe?---------------Vucinic
----------Matri--------

The team's perfomances are more important than the individuals themselves.

 

[deggen10]

The team's perfomances are more important than the individuals themselves.

Oh i agree but there's hardly enough evidence to say 4-2-4 is a winner. One ok half vs Parma at home doesn't mean much. Conte is protecting the CB's big time and i don't blame him. Maybe it's Marotta's fault but playing a 4-4-2 right now would give us virtually the same defense as last season.

Personally, i'm happy with shutting out the opposition and scraping a goal or two, Capello style, for now.

 

[TrezJuve]

Oh i agree but there's hardly enough evidence to say 4-2-4 is a winner. One ok half vs Parma at home doesn't mean much. Conte is protecting the CB's big time and i don't blame him. Maybe it's Marotta's fault but playing a 4-4-2 right now would give us virtually the same defense as last season.

Personally, i'm happy with shutting out the opposition and scraping a goal or two, Capello style, for now.

I think there are enough evidences of it, maybe it's best to agree to disagree.

 

[Albertmare]

Fuck Vucinic in lone striker formation againts small team

 

[frick]

You're spot on.

4-2-4

vs Parma = 4-0

Against Parma, the 4-2-4 gave two goals but when Conte made Vucinic the lone striker, Juve scored two VERY GOOD goals and pretty much playing very good football, dominating, owning, before the defense lose concentration and conceded late.

vs Siena = 1-0 (We could have score more)

I don't think so, it was a so so game, it's almost the same situation with Chievo. Hadn't it been because of Pepe's long ball, Juve would take only 1 point.

vs Bologna = 1-0 (Until Vucinic was red carded, Dp taken out at HT and we played with 1striker)

Against Bologna, again there's almost no clear chance when it was 4-2-4 (that goal was unconvincing) but then Matri played as single striker in the second half. Except for the stupid mistake from DC, Juve were dominating with that formation, bombarding the opponents even though they already lose 1 man.

= 9points out of 3games we grabbed while playing 4-2-4 (Except Bologna's 2nd half when we played with 1striker due to Vuci's red card)

Against Parma, the single striker formation scored two goals so the 3 points should be splitted.

4-5-1

vs Catania 1-1 (We all remember how weak we were and the hard time Catania gave us, check the match threads)

Matri simply couldn't handle the job as the single striker. This is the proof that the single striker performance hence its choice is very crucial. This is the first time Conte started with 4-1-4-1, with and Elia as starter and Vidal also starting as AM. Everything feels unconvincing and they still need time to adapt after starting every game with 4-2-4.

vs Milan 2-0 (It worked but still few questions mark over Bonera's gift)

Even if you take out the two goals, Juve were still dominating the match, the win are fully deserved.

 

[Lion]

conte sucks.

 

[Nenz]

Oh i agree but there's hardly enough evidence to say 4-2-4 is a winner. One ok half vs Parma at home doesn't mean much. Conte is protecting the CB's big time and i don't blame him. Maybe it's Marotta's fault but playing a 4-4-2 right now would give us virtually the same defense as last season.

Personally, i'm happy with shutting out the opposition and scraping a goal or two, Capello style, for now.

Did you not see the drastic changes during games when we switched to the 4-2-4 because the 4-3-3/4-5-1 wasn't working? There might not be strong evidence for the 4-2-4 considering the amount of games played but its sure as hell evident in our performances that it is superior relative to the 4-5-1. Play flowed well in the 4-5-1 against Milan but created few real chances. We were lucky to win that game. Every other time we played it we have really performed poorly and its no surprise that Conte went back to his original formation because it gives our midfielders far more space and doesn't isolate the forward(s) and ended up creating more chances and more goals.

 

[La Professore]

conte sucks.

quit boozing!

 

[Camurria]

A small correction for those who mentioned we used a 4-5-1, against Milan, Catania and Chievo... It was a 4-1-4-1... with a 4-2-3-1 when we shifted in attack.