American Juve (14 Viewers)

[Majed]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++
Lets be honest on one other point...when the Soviet Union fell, where do you think many of their high-paid nuclear scientists went after being given their termination notices ?????

Al Queia, ladies and gentlemen........................

Yeah! that makes a whole lot of sense!!

The USSR falls, and the countries that make them up just disappear!!

OF COURSE NOT!!

Most of them are in Russia, some in China, and some in the west in the ol' US of A where they'd get paid better!! The rest were killed by the USSR so they won't get scatered around.

Why on earth would these scientists join Al-Qa'idah; an organization that was standing by the Taliban in Afghanistan that faught the USSR and crippled their military forces for years!? does that make any sense at all?!

The Soviets hate Taliban (and therefore AQ) as much as they hate the US.

BTW, If AQ really did have all these scientists, how would they even make a single Nucke!?! with ttheir bare hands?! AQ are in cells all around the world. they dont have nucks labs. They dont have the equipment. FYI, It's not hard to know how to make a nuke. the tough part is to get the equipment needed to put the head together and make it.

 

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[Majed]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++


Yes , Osama has nukes, in fact, there may be 20 suitcase nuclear warheads in our country RIGHT NOW, and these terrorist scumbags are just waiting for the go -ahead to launch world war 3 on our soil

Unfortunately, I feel its unavoidable........

no offense, but I laughed my ass off at this one.

If this were true, then they would have been set off a long time ago. Thankfully, this hasn't happened, and thankfully, it isn't true either.

These stories were made up to keep the average Joe like you and me scared, so that whatever next mission the US gov. come up with, all they have to do is say that they're "fighting terror," so the millions of pupits (formerly human thinkers) would automaticaly agree without looking into it.

Sorry Vinman, y'all in NY have gone through a lot... and my heart goes out to you all , but you're not seeing the bigger picture and the other side of these decisions.

To fight terrorism and only terrorism, we have to fight it from its roots. We can't be as bad as them and turn the world against us. We have one of the greatest civilizations and we should be the role-models.

 

[Zlatan]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++


...and while we were trying to appease the feeble UN about going into Iraq, the WMD were being taken by many tractor trailers for "safe-keeping " into Syria. My country knows this, but what are we supposed to do ??? Invade Syria ????? I have my feelings on that, and eventually we may be forced to, because they are yet another radical country that wants to harm us-directly or indirectly....

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++


I agree Vinamn. Also, I dont trust those frenchies. I mean, they were against the US war in Iraq, and they clearly dont like Americans. Tholse bloody forg eating french. They eat frogs for god's sake!!! They too have nuclear weapons. Hey, that must be reason enough to invade. I mean, how can you trust people who eat frogs with nuclear weapons? Come on, think about it, an American flag on top of the Eiffel tower... I tell you, they cant be trusted, inveade them!!!

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++
Lets be honest on one other point...when the Soviet Union fell, where do you think many of their high-paid nuclear scientists went after being given their termination notices ?????

Al Queia, ladies and gentlemen........................

Eeeer, the US? Let's not forget that the US made the first nuclear bomb with the help of German scientists that changed sides...

 

[Zlatan]

Also, the war agenst terrorism hasnt ben all that successful, at all. Now Al Quaeda, and most terrorist groups are made out of independant cells, that have very little to do with Osama. He's their spiritual and moral leader, but in terms of prepering and carrying out attacks, they can act independantly and dont rely on Osama. When you kill one cell, two new will pop out. Terrorsm can only be stopped if thge causes for it's existance go away. Namely, US troops on Saudi and Iraqi soil, US support of Israel, etc.

 

[Vinman]

++ [ originally posted by Majed ] ++


Yeah! that makes a whole lot of sense!!

The USSR falls, and the countries that make them up just disappear!!

OF COURSE NOT!!

Most of them are in Russia, some in China, and some in the west in the ol' US of A where they'd get paid better!! The rest were killed by the USSR so they won't get scatered around.

Why on earth would these scientists join Al-Qa'idah; an organization that was standing by the Taliban in Afghanistan that faught the USSR and crippled their military forces for years!? does that make any sense at all?!

The Soviets hate Taliban (and therefore AQ) as much as they hate the US.

BTW, If AQ really did have all these scientists, how would they even make a single Nucke!?! with ttheir bare hands?! AQ are in cells all around the world. they dont have nucks labs. They dont have the equipment. FYI, It's not hard to know how to make a nuke. the tough part is to get the equipment needed to put the head together and make it.

EVERYONE HAS A PRICE , FOOL !!!!!!!!!

We didnt hire any of their scientists...Osama paid them VERY well, our government wont tell you that ........

 

[Vinman]

++ [ originally posted by Majed ] ++


no offense, but I laughed my ass off at this one.

If this were true, then they would have been set off a long time ago. Thankfully, this hasn't happened, and thankfully, it isn't true either.

These stories were made up to keep the average Joe like you and me scared, so that whatever next mission the US gov. come up with, all they have to do is say that they're "fighting terror," so the millions of pupits (formerly human thinkers) would automaticaly agree without looking into it.

Sorry Vinman, y'all in NY have gone through a lot... and my heart goes out to you all , but you're not seeing the bigger picture and the other side of these decisions.

To fight terrorism and only terrorism, we have to fight it from its roots. We can't be as bad as them and turn the world against us. We have one of the greatest civilizations and we should be the role-models.

Laugh all you want because YOU'RE the one thats naive !!!!!

I think I know just a little more about this subject than you, son......

Fact- Osama has bought at least 30 suitcase nukes from the Chechen mafia

Fact- Osama has hired former Soviet and Pakistani nuclear scientists to help develop missiles

Fact- 80 % of the Muslims in the USA are of the Wahabi sect- the MOST radical sect of Islam

Fact- Al Queida has agents in NYC, Chicago, Miami, Los Angeles, and Houston, just to name a few US cities, ready to be called

Fact- informants have admitted that Al Queida has 20 suitcase bombs within the American borders- this has also been confirmed in Europe (it wouldnt be too tough, only 3% of imports are checked by US Customs)

Fact- Osama has PROMISED that the next attack on America will be NUCLEAR !!!!!

 

[Bjerknes]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++
Riv, you can hardly say that he certanly had WMD2. The fact is none have been found, and until they do you cant be absolutely sure they did have them.


And I dont think I'm being naive Andy, two military bases might not seem much to you, but in the end it's all about control, economic, political and military.

Also, anyone could have sold WMDs to AQ. Hell, the Russians could have done it. Every man has his price.


P.S. Are you denying that Bush is a complete ass?

Saddam had them AND used them before, what makes you think that all of a sudden he disposed of them in a proper way? He did have them, but he conveniently must have got rid of them before the new Iraq war. It makes clear sense.

Of course anybody could sell them. So whats your point?

I would never call the President of my country a complete ass. Eventhough I disagree with him in some issues.

 

[Zlatan]

He had it 20 years ago. Most of it, had it been kept until now, would be completely useless.

 

[Bjerknes]

++ [ originally posted by Majed ] ++


UN are a joke only because they're the US government's pupit.

Iraq didn't complied with what?! common people?! There are no WMD.

We were able to find Saddam in a hole in the ground and not a single documnet that even points to WMD were found let alone the warheads themselves!! get real.... please.
All this WMD BS is hype created by the media to serve Dubya's purpose to go into war. (We made our own excuse!)

No offense, but you and Andy have bought into all the media BS.

we're talking about a country that has been under very tight UN sanctions for a decade. They can barely provide food and medical equipment. Their weapons (whatever was left of them) are decades old.

Like y'all mentioned, AQ and Suddam are two diffferent entities. Osama bin Laden never liked Saddam anyway, and this has always been a well known fact. Bin Laden hates Saddam as he hates the Saudi government and many gulf leaders. Bin Laden was only against the War The Media here in the US (and probibly the UK) have tried to force a strong connection between them down our throats.
The only connection is that when Bush declared war against Iraq, Bin Laden automatically was on "Iraq" (not Saddam's) side because he hates the US.
So you could say that with the war against Iraq, the US is uniting these groups together!!


Back to my point, the media successfuly made you River believe that the UK were a target before the war. They were not.

Did AQ ever bomb a UK embassy?
Are the UK supporting Israel with WMD, protecting them from UN laws and providing them with the most modern military technology?

case and point: Spain.
When were they ever a target?!! no .. Never!!
but the moment they helped the US in Iraq, AQ launched an attack in Madrid!

Congratulations... Blair has succesfully MADE YOU A TARGET and The war in Iraq has Successfully United these freaks agianst Y'all! :down:

With all due respect Majed, I don't give a rat's ass what the media has to say on some issues. From the "Fair and balanced" bull shit of Fox News, to the Al-Jahelpdaterrorists Arab news agency, I don't rely on these sources cuz they are too opinionated. I can make my own decisions thank you very much. Sorry Majed, but thats what I believe.

 

[Vinman]

And Btw Majed, I'm not an "average Joe" like you, I work in law enforcement, so I have a little better grip on reality........

 

[Majed]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++


EVERYONE HAS A PRICE , FOOL !!!!!!!!!

We didnt hire any of their scientists...Osama paid them VERY well, our government wont tell you that ........

you're even more paranoid (and naive) than I thought!

yeah... and I'm sure Osama also built them nice labs around the world.

1. Most of Osama's wealth has been forzen. Look at the weapons they had in Afghanistan. (some they got from currupt-Russian people who've secretly sold them to him, and the others are outdated and given to him years ago by the the US)

Did you know the Afghans used to turn lights (lanterns) on and off during the night on mountains so the US forces could shoot missles at them (we thought they were guerilla forces or anti aircraft guns) just to use the remains of the missles for their day to day activities. Osama can't use his half of his wealth.

2. Logicly, would these scientists rather work in half-ass poor excuses of nuclear labs (assuming these labs do exist) or somewhere where they are safe from bombs dropping on their heads, safe from Uranium/Plotonium radiation messing up their body, and where they live in the best houses and get paid legally?

I wounder if the people that tell you Osama has Nuckes and scientists the same people who said that the Al-Shifa medicine factory in Sudan produced chemical weapons?

 

[Majed]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++
And Btw Majed, I'm not an "average Joe" like you, I work in law enforcement, so I have a little better grip on reality........

all the more reason to be brain washed!

 

[Bjerknes]

++ [ originally posted by Majed ] ++


Common Andy?!
Do you really think our gov. would spend millions and millions on "helping" other for the sake of it when we have our own problems?

to answer your questions:
Somalia: to bring back the American forces in Eastern Africa and reclaim their old bases along the red sea cost. Why would our gov want this?
1. It's not too far from Saudi Arabia. With these bases, the US can protect its main suppliers from another direction. (Dont foget that Saudi-Yemeni relations weren't good at all)
2. Long ago (in the 70's I think), it was beleived that there were offshore oil fields, so further exploring was still a possibility.
3. Somalia location makes it easier for the US to protect the oil tanker routes through the india ocean and the red sea.

These may seem as good goals, but the way in which the government has dealt with Somalia is terrible. Durring the conflict in Somalia last decade, 19 US soliders were killed and 1000 Somalis. what's worse is that the US already had bases on the Somali red sea coast from the regime that it supported back in the early 80s. The terrorizing regime was as bad (if not, worse) than Saddam's regime in Iraq. The Us supported them (with money and weapons) to keep them in power. in exchange, we got to build bases. The whole mess in Somalia was in fact mostly our fault. We helped the oppressors, then we left and a civil war staretd because the people couldn't take the regime anymore. the country was ripped apart!! So the US had to get back in there agian. (but failed as you've seen in "Black Halk Down")

Zlatan already answered about Bosnia.
as for Liberia, I havn't read much about it, but the fact that Nigeria supplies a significacnt amount of oil to the US (which i think is supposed to increase) is enough for me to assume that the US is only keeping its interests safe. Nigeria are spending a lot of resources in the Liberian situation, all while having their own problems. The US wouldn't want a civil war to tear up Nigeria. again, i need to research more about how the US dealt with Liberia and what were the results.

To sum up, I'm sorry to say that you're being the naive one Andy. The Media has done a fantastic job in brain washing many of the people.

Read my above post Majed.

Some points about Somalia are understandable, but not your points on Liberia. Nigeria is certainly not a huge source of oil for us, so that makes no sense that we would commit thousands of troops to a country that has nothing to do with Nigeria.

Not offense to you Majed, or any other people of Arab descent, but you all seem to share the same views that America is the enemy. I know a couple of Arab kids from Saudi Arabia, and they completely disagreed with the war on Iraq and our stance with oil demand. Its like a broken record after a while. They don't even listen to anybody knowledgable of the facts, sadly, the same views seem to be teached at an early age, and they never change.

 

[Vinman]

You know sooo... much

Go back to your room and play your Playstation2, because thats the ONLY reality you know.

And 9/11 didnt happen either !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Vinman]

++ [ originally posted by Majed ] ++



all the more reason to be brain washed!

Your welcome for helping to protect your SORRY ASS !!!!

 

[Bjerknes]

++ [ originally posted by Fliakis ] ++


how do you know that?

Reports in Newsweek and Time Magazine respectively. Both said that there is a good chance that Osama has these "Suitcase Nukes".

 

[Zlatan]

Maby eyou should play some PS2 Vinman, why is it hard for you to accept that you could be wrong?

 

[Zlatan]

Anyways, there are bigger chances that Osama would have dirty bombs, not real nukes.

 

[Vinman]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++
Maby eyou should play some PS2 Vinman, why is it hard for you to accept that you could be wrong?

The facts are there -Z-

If you read my post above you should understand...............

 

[Vinman]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++
Anyways, there are bigger chances that Osama would have dirty bombs, not real nukes.

Why ???? Its a fact that he bought them...........

Suitcase nukes will destroy an entire city