Who created Hell? (3 Viewers)

[Enron]

Oh, right. I wasn't sure whether you were talking about a historical fact.

No. Though I'm pretty sure there are some papers written on the subject. In fact the professor who brought it up was working on a paper regarding the subject of Hell. I'm just not sure where to look to find theological papers.

 

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[Martin]

The government wants the best for us Martin.

Why did they create prisons?

The short answer: Population control.

We've had prisons as a way of removing people from society for 1000 years or so. Rulers used to toss people in jail at the slightest hint of opposition to the presiding rule.

I grant you in today's world the answer is more complicated. Prisons are humane and their role is to rehabilitate more than to punish.

 

[HelterSkelter]

The purpose of hell and a prison is the same.To punish people.For hell,it comes down to sins,and in the case of prisons,it comes down to law breaking.

Both Hell and Prisons teach people the consequences of wrong doing.

 

[Enron]

The purpose of hell and a prison is the same.To punish people.For hell,it comes down to sins,and in the case of prisons,it comes down to law breaking.

Both Hell and Prisons teach people the consequences of wrong doing.

They aren't related. Though both are created by man.

With Hell what does teaching have anything to do with it. Once you are dead what can you learn, it's isn't like you can be rehabilitated and released. The Hell I'm most familiar with is a place of eternal punishment. Where those who live evil lives or didn't donate enough to the Catholics during the middle ages go.

 

[Martin]

I don't know where you are living but mothers in Lebanon definitely torture their children. My neighbour, a little boy, is a very troublesome kid. He always curses and annoys his elders. His mother punishes him by making him place an extremely hot pepper in his mouth. This boy cries like there's no tommorow. I never saw him misbehave ever again.

Lebanon sounds like a friendly place Fine, have it your way. I'm still pretty sure that most mothers don't do this, even in Lebanon. Certainly not in European culture.

Wouldn't you call this torture? But it's from a loving and caring mother that wants nothing but the best for her boy. What a sadistic bitch you would say. This boy grew up to have excellent morals, ethics, and amazing respect for others around him.

Does this analogy work then?

It does if you put it that way. But in our world we have decided that such treatment amounts to child abuse and we don't approve of it.

 

[JCK]

The purpose of hell and a prison is the same.To punish people.For hell,it comes down to sins,and in the case of prisons,it comes down to law breaking.

Both Hell and Prisons teach people the consequences of wrong doing.

Prisons are not there to punish people they are there for two purposes:

1- To teach those who made mistakes how to abide by the laws
2- To isolate those who are dangerous to the society from the others.

 

[Martin]

The purpose of hell and a prison is the same.To punish people.For hell,it comes down to sins,and in the case of prisons,it comes down to law breaking.

Both Hell and Prisons teach people the consequences of wrong doing.

Nein. The purpose of prison (unless it's life time imprisonment which is rare) is to rehabilitate someone. You punish by removing their freedom to live in the world. You also help them learn a skill, develop themselves, maybe pass the high school program if they were high school dropouts etc. Prison isn't a torture chamber, it's an attempt to "fix" what is preventing people from coping with life in society.

Hell is just defined as torture, and as Enron said, "punishment" is meaningless unless you give people a chance to behave better. The only other justification would be to scare off other people, but us living don't know who went to Hell, so that doesn't hold. We're left with pure sadism.

 

[rounder]

What about the death sentence. Is that also rehabilitation?

Saddam had his life taken away from him because of his immoral and unethical actions. Who killed him? The court of law did. Imagine that, with all the human rights programs in the world, we still have legal man slaughter.

This is an example that shows us how morality has nothing to do with punishment. Especially when it comes it the punisher's part.

The punisher here, the court of law, is simply punishing Saddam for his atrocities;
the way god punishes us for ours.

 

[JCK]

What about the death sentence. Is that also rehabilitation?

Saddam had his life taken away from him because of his immoral and unethical actions. Who killed him? The court of law did. Imagine that, with all the human rights programs in the world, we still have legal man slaughter.

This is an example that shows us how morality has nothing to do with punishment. Especially when it comes it the punisher's part.

The punisher here, the court of law, is simply punishing Saddam for his atrocities;
the way god punishes us for ours.

Hopefully all countries will follow the countries that have removed the death sentence from their system.

 

[jukazem]

As far as I know there is Heaven after Hell; assuming that to be correct Hell isn't a meaningless punishment.

And about having Hell, I think its just. A capitalist will probably understand it; one gets what one deserves or works for. Also I believe that there can be no Heaven without Hell and vice-versa, one wouldn't know what either one is like without the other. Like light and darkness, hot and cold ...

 

[Martin]

What about the death sentence. Is that also rehabilitation?

Saddam had his life taken away from him because of his immoral and unethical actions. Who killed him? The court of law did. Imagine that, with all the human rights programs in the world, we still have legal man slaughter.

We don't. Civilized countries don't have a death penalty.

See for yourself:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cb/Death_Penalty_World_Map.png

The red ones allow the death penalty. The blue ones ban it absolutely. The others don't ban it explicitly but never use it in practice (only for war crimes etc). Both Europe and the Americas are almost entirely free of the death penalty.

 

[Enron]

What about the death sentence. Is that also rehabilitation?

Saddam had his life taken away from him because of his immoral and unethical actions. Who killed him? The court of law did. Imagine that, with all the human rights programs in the world, we still have legal man slaughter.

This is an example that shows us how morality has nothing to do with punishment. Especially when it comes it the punisher's part.

The punisher here, the court of law, is simply punishing Saddam for his atrocities;
the way god punishes us for ours.

Alright. How about this comparison? We, "mankind", punish the evil by removing them from our world. In short, once someone dies they cease to exist in the world of man.

With that said, is it not too difficult to believe that God would do the same in his world. Perhaps those deemed "too evil" to reside in heaven are given the same treatment. Perhaps they are merely removed from the afterlife.

 

[HelterSkelter]

They aren't related. Though both are created by man.

With Hell what does teaching have anything to do with it. Once you are dead what can you learn, it's isn't like you can be rehabilitated and released. The Hell I'm most familiar with is a place of eternal punishment. Where those who live evil lives or didn't donate enough to the Catholics during the middle ages go.

Prisons are not there to punish people they are there for two purposes:

1- To teach those who made mistakes how to abide by the laws
2- To isolate those who are dangerous to the society from the others.

Nein. The purpose of prison (unless it's life time imprisonment which is rare) is to rehabilitate someone. You punish by removing their freedom to live in the world. You also help them learn a skill, develop themselves, maybe pass the high school program if they were high school dropouts etc. Prison isn't a torture chamber, it's an attempt to "fix" what is preventing people from coping with life in society.

Hell is just defined as torture, and as Enron said, "punishment" is meaningless unless you give people a chance to behave better. The only other justification would be to scare off other people, but us living don't know who went to Hell, so that doesn't hold. We're left with pure sadism.

I will respectfully disagree.The prupose is still the same.You are warning people of the consequences of leading a bad life,so they know what will be in store of them incase they live like tards.A Prison teaches that while you're alive,while Hell serves the same purpose while you're alive,so you can mend your ways.You have your whole life to mend your ways.The after life probaly gives you more time to straighten up than a Prison.

Man responds to fear better than he responds to incentives.If you tell a student that he'll get expelled if he cheats during a paper,he'll probably avoid teaching altogether.He wont respond the same way if you give him a lecture on how good honesty is.

Hell is punishment,and we have punishment in all spheres of life.Always have.Always will.So why do we need to make a fuss about it when religion mentions it?

 

[Martin]

As far as I know there is Heaven after Hell; assuming that to be correct Hell isn't a meaningless punishment.

Depends on your religious doctrine. In Christianity there are three options, heaven, hell and purgatory. Purgatory is a "temporary hell" and after that you transfer to heaven. Hell itself is forever.

Also I believe that there can be no Heaven without Hell and vice-versa, one wouldn't know what either one is like without the other. Like light and darkness, hot and cold ...

Heaven would be pretty meaningless without hell, I agree.

 

[Enron]

We don't. Civilized countries don't have a death penalty.

See for yourself:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cb/Death_Penalty_World_Map.png

The red ones allow the death penalty. The blue ones ban it absolutely. The others don't ban it explicitly but never use it in practice (only for war crimes etc). Both Europe and the Americas are almost entirely free of the death penalty.

The US is the exception of course. We have both Federal and State death penalties.

 

[Ahmed]

Depends on your religious doctrine. In Christianity there are three options, heaven, hell and purgatory. Purgatory is a "temporary hell" and after that you transfer to heaven. Hell itself is forever.



Heaven would be pretty meaningless without hell, I agree.

same here, Martin

 

[rounder]

Alright. How about this comparison? We, "mankind", punish the evil by removing them from our world. In short, once someone dies they cease to exist in the world of man.

With that said, is it not too difficult to believe that God would do the same in his world. Perhaps those deemed "too evil" to reside in heaven are given the same treatment. Perhaps they are merely removed from the afterlife.

That's exactly what's happening. God's world is heaven in this case, and god gives us the free will to choose our destinies here on earth. After this life, god will rid of the evil doers and reward the good.

 

[rounder]

We don't. Civilized countries don't have a death penalty.

See for yourself:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cb/Death_Penalty_World_Map.png

The red ones allow the death penalty. The blue ones ban it absolutely. The others don't ban it explicitly but never use it in practice (only for war crimes etc). Both Europe and the Americas are almost entirely free of the death penalty.

Are you saying America is not a civilized country?

 

[Enron]

I will respectfully disagree.The prupose is still the same.You are warning people of the consequences of leading a bad life,so they know what will be in store of them incase they live like tards.A Prison teaches that while you're alive,while Hell serves the same purpose while you're alive,so you can mend your ways.You have your whole life to mend your ways.The after life probaly gives you more time to straighten up than a Prison.

Man responds to fear better than he responds to incentives.If you tell a student that he'll get expelled if he cheats during a paper,he'll probably avoid teaching altogether.He wont respond the same way if you give him a lecture on how good honesty is.

Hell is punishment,and we have punishment in all spheres of life.Always have.Always will. So why do we need to make a fuss about it when religion mentions it?

You say "religion mentions it", but really what religious writings explicitly mention an existence of hell? Historically, hell was never mentioned in Christian teachings until the Middle Ages, when there was a need for money in the church and war in the Holy Land. I'm not sure about Islam, perhaps someone could enlighten me?

 

[Enron]

Are you saying America is not a civilized country?

It's not.