[WC] World Cup 2014 - General Talk Thread (13 Viewers)

[swag]

or Portugal

but Belgium did quite well. QF is a good result for them. it was Italy, Portugal or Spain that underperformed in this tournament

Only one of them winning the past three major international tournaments, however.

 

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[Red]

Find it quite amusing how articles are being written praising Germany and Loew now as if they were just unbelievably brilliant throughout the tournament.

Firstly, Loew got things horribly wrong in the first few games. Germany are good enough/the opposition were bad enough that they got away with it, but he didn't have Germany playing at anything like the level they are capable of. I don't like Lahm in midfield, but Bayern can do it because they have other options at fullback. Germany do not have the players at fullback to make Lahm available to play in midfield. And I doubt Loew would have switched Lahm to fullback if there hadn't been injuries to defenders to force the change.

There was also the tactical issue of playing the opening games with too many static ball-players (Goetze, Kroos, Oezil) and a lack of players prepared to move off the ball and stretch the game. The balance of the team looked so much better once Klose came into the team and it's no surprise Schuerrle was able to have an influence as a sub given how well he moves.

Secondly, there is the issue of history already being written to suggest the Germany were masterful through the tournament and that their dominance was never in doubt. Their high defensive line always looked vulnerable and they could easily have lost to Algeria. Then you have Argentina creating more and better chances than Germany did in normal time in the final.

I'm not going to dispute that Germany are a good team or that they were the best team in the tournament, but you can already see people re-writing history based on the fact that Germany won the tournament, rather than focusing on what actually happened going through the World Cup.

 

[Trequartista]

Find it quite amusing how articles are being written praising Germany and Loew now as if they were just unbelievably brilliant throughout the tournament.

Firstly, Loew got things horribly wrong in the first few games. Germany are good enough/the opposition were bad enough that they got away with it, but he didn't have Germany playing at anything like the level they are capable of. I don't like Lahm in midfield, but Bayern can do it because they have other options at fullback. Germany do not have the players at fullback to make Lahm available to play in midfield. And I doubt Loew would have switched Lahm to fullback if there hadn't been injuries to defenders to force the change.

There was also the tactical issue of playing the opening games with too many static ball-players (Goetze, Kroos, Oezil) and a lack of players prepared to move off the ball and stretch the game. The balance of the team looked so much better once Klose came into the team and it's no surprise Schuerrle was able to have an influence as a sub given how well he moves.

Secondly, there is the issue of history already being written to suggest the Germany were masterful through the tournament and that their dominance was never in doubt. Their high defensive line always looked vulnerable and they could easily have lost to Algeria. Then you have Argentina creating more and better chances than Germany did in normal time in the final.

I'm not going to dispute that Germany are a good team or that they were the best team in the tournament, but you can already see people re-writing history based on the fact that Germany won the tournament, rather than focusing on what actually happened going through the World Cup.

Blame the 7-1 victory for that, people have short term memories.

 

[Zacheryah]

Find it quite amusing how articles are being written praising Germany and Loew now as if they were just unbelievably brilliant throughout the tournament.

Firstly, Loew got things horribly wrong in the first few games. Germany are good enough/the opposition were bad enough that they got away with it, but he didn't have Germany playing at anything like the level they are capable of. I don't like Lahm in midfield, but Bayern can do it because they have other options at fullback. Germany do not have the players at fullback to make Lahm available to play in midfield. And I doubt Loew would have switched Lahm to fullback if there hadn't been injuries to defenders to force the change.

There was also the tactical issue of playing the opening games with too many static ball-players (Goetze, Kroos, Oezil) and a lack of players prepared to move off the ball and stretch the game. The balance of the team looked so much better once Klose came into the team and it's no surprise Schuerrle was able to have an influence as a sub given how well he moves.

Secondly, there is the issue of history already being written to suggest the Germany were masterful through the tournament and that their dominance was never in doubt. Their high defensive line always looked vulnerable and they could easily have lost to Algeria. Then you have Argentina creating more and better chances than Germany did in normal time in the final.

I'm not going to dispute that Germany are a good team or that they were the best team in the tournament, but you can already see people re-writing history based on the fact that Germany won the tournament, rather than focusing on what actually happened going through the World Cup.

'I'm happy our east neighbours won it, but they werent domminating it.

They have issues with their slow defence playing a high line, they have issues with the player to put next to Schweinsteiger, and dont really got an true CF thats involved in the game.

Germans got a sick generation of attacking mids. But are held back by abscences in other positions, and won this world cup cause of the significant lack of quality worldwide.


Thing is, put a faster defender next to hummels that can cover, put Gundogan next to schweinsteiger if he gets his old form back, put Reus on the LW and add gomez as a striker.... dramatic improvement right there.



Know this, we saw Germany win a worldcup, with half the strenght they can field when everyone is fit. Just let that sink in for a while, when thinking about the next 6 years

 

[Mister]

CBF accepts Scolari’s resignation: he’s no longer Brazil’s coach

 

[Hængebøffer]

All teams looked vulnerable.

 

[JCK]

All teams looked vulnerable.

That's because how I saw it, all teams looked like they were ready to pull off surprises.

 

[swag]

CBF accepts Scolari’s resignation: he’s no longer Brazil’s coach

Will get picked up within a couple of months for $20Mil/year coaching some clown soccer club in the Middle East, most likely.

 

[Zacheryah]

According to the Castrol indext (best statistical tool around of analytics), the best team of the world cup was :

Neuer
De Vrij, Hummels, Silva, Rojo
Kroos, Oscar, Lahm, Rodriguez
Müller, Robben

With Kroos beeing the best before Robben and De Vrij.

No mention of Messi in the top 10.


But give him a golden ball.... sure Fifa, sure... Messi's bodylanguage revealed he disagreed with it himself.

Only team i am fan of is Juventus. I did feel bad for Buffon anf Pirlo for like 30 seconds but they already won a WC so fuck Italy. I was curious to see what Belgium would do with all that talent at their disposal but they sucked ass, like Zakarechya.

If you want to insult someone, try to at least write their names correct, if you want to have any credibility


I think Belgium disappointed quite a bit. Much of it down to the coach and lack of experience. Altho Holland had players with less experience and it didnt bother them, thanks to their coach and commanding players.

But to be honest, Spain going out in the groupstage with 2 losses, cant get much worse then that tbh.

 

[Red]

Blame the 7-1 victory for that, people have short term memories.

The 7-1 game is also allowing people to keep trying to claim that it was a great World Cup.

It was a good World Cup, but the 7-1 was the only memorable game in the knock-out rounds.

And even it can't be called a great game.

Thing is, put a faster defender next to hummels that can cover, put Gundogan next to schweinsteiger if he gets his old form back, put Reus on the LW and add gomez as a striker.... dramatic improvement right there.

With Reus in the team you could probably get away with playing Mueller as the centre-forward because Reus moves so much more than players like Goetze and Oezil. Still not how I'd do it, but the balance wouldn't be too bad.

It is interesting the way Germany's talent is bunched in certain areas of the pitch.

Incidentally, broadly, what did you think of Belgium's performance against Argentina?

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All teams looked vulnerable.

Indeed.

I don't think there is any strong team around just now by historical standards.

- - - Updated - - -

This is the third time in a row that Scotland have had the World Champions in the qualifying group for the Euros.

 

[piotrr]

Blatter knows now how it feels to be Poland.

@radekas

 

[swag]

According to the Castrol indext (best statistical tool around of analytics), the best team of the world cup was :

Neuer
De Vrij, Hummels, Silva, Rojo
Kroos, Oscar, Lahm, Rodriguez
Müller, Robben

With Kroos beeing the best before Robben and De Vrij.

No mention of Messi in the top 10.


But give him a golden ball.... sure Fifa, sure... Messi's bodylanguage revealed he disagreed with it himself.

I lost all faith in any Castrol index when David Lulz dominated the rankings at #1 through the round of 16 and the quarterfinals.

 

[Klin]

So which is it? Do we believe the football guru who knows everything there is to know about football or the best statistical tool around as per the same guru?

Zach says Luiz is shit.

 

[Zacheryah]

Incidentally, broadly, what did you think of Belgium's performance against Argentina?

The game highlighted the difference between a team with hardly a tactical line, against a well organised unit


We started the game, against i think Lavezzi and Di Maria, with our fullbacks playing insanely high. That immediatly led to 2-3 chances for argentina. After that, they suddenly werent allowed to cross the midline anymore. seriously, what ?

Then there was the central midfield. De Bruyne for some reason had to play very very deep and add to the triangle around messi. Wich was done incredibly amateurish, as Witsel was allways out of position and Fellaini was playing to high, all the time. So Kompany had to step out to cover all that space, wich made it easy for argentina to play trough balls. Every inch of tactical love in my body was getting torn just by seeing that.

Then there was our possession. Argentina deployed 3 lines of defence, so its key to play in the space between them, and as we could see against germany, use those flanks, cause they were always playing very compact. Yet our wingers, were very static and because De Bruyne played so deep, we never really managed to reach them. So then they hoofed it to Lukaku, who is offcourse never gonna win a duel against those two central defenders. To add to that, he had 0 support for the offballs.


it could have been so very much better. Add naingollan in the midfield, start him and defour cause fuck witsel. have de bruyne play as an actual advanced central playmaker. Have both Defour and naingollan controll the space centrally to lock up those messi runs. Play the fullbacks not to high cause Lavezzzi and especially Di Maria are to fast to deal with. Have the wingers keep it wide, but fucking move around when not in possession, seek the space. And when we get the ball, look for the space on the wings, and dare to switch to the other side when not going to quickly

But those things, require a clear tactical guideline , and automatisms for wingers and CAM to get used to, so they can quickly and efficiently pounce when setting up a counter

Especially when longer in possession. one central holding mid, or the cam must allways try to support the winger, to enable a quick switch to the other flank, wich is exactly how you deal with that argentina.


But our coach is a fucking idiot, and they gave him an new contract, so he'll fuck up the euros aswel

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I lost all faith in any Castrol index when David Lulz dominated the rankings at #1 through the round of 16 and the quarterfinals.

explain me how he domminates it, and Silva makes the final team despite missing a game ?

- - - Updated - - -

So which is it? Do we believe the football guru who knows everything there is to know about football or the best statistical tool around as per the same guru?

Zach says Luiz is shit.

Castrol index is a respected analytic tool. And according to it, Marotta is doing a terrific job.

THE key conclusion of the castrol index is that replacing an average player with a good one, is far better then replacing a good player with a world class one

 

[Klin]

Castrol index is a respected analytic tool. And according to it, Marotta is doing a terrific job.

THE key conclusion of the castrol index is that replacing an average player with a good one, is far better then replacing a good player with a world class one

And what happens when you already have a team full of good players? You replace them with bad ones and start all over again?

 

[Ocelot]

Blatter knows now how it feels to be Poland.

 

[Zacheryah]

And what happens when you already have a team full of good players? You replace them with bad ones and start all over again?

Dont be a strawman. Replacing the least good player by a better one will allways be better.


Look at 2013 bayern who tore apart anything. Compare to 2011 bayeren. They removed any weak spot they had.

But 2013 bayern doesnt got a player that is at the level of Suarez, Ibrahimovic, Messi, Ronaldo

 

[Hængebøffer]

Didn't you call Robben the best in the world?

 

[swag]

He was arguably the best player at the WC. He and James Rodriguez.

 

[Zacheryah]

Didn't you call Robben the best in the world?

Yeah, at this world cup

2013 was last year. He missed most of the year with injury, and had some quality games at the end of it