Trezeguet out , Klose in ? (14 Viewers)

[Jun-hide]

A football team makes new fans when they are successfull. Bremen made many new fans since they won the German Championship. Their stadium is nearly always full and their merchandise is more successful than ever before.
Schalke and Hamburg should take care of their debt problems before they will ever be more successful than Bremen is. For the last twenty years, Werder was more successfull than Hamburg (with very few exceptions). But perhaps you are right, they might just be better before I know it

The big teams you have mentioned (except for Bayern) cheated. They all commercialize tv earnings (or however you call it) themselves while in the Bundesliga it is a central marketing. This is fair competition, while the italian league is a joke.

Also, I do not dream about Werder Bremen. I don't even have Pay-tv to watch them play in Bundesliga. That sums it up I guess. If there is any hobby I dream about its about expanding my collection of wrestling DVDs (btw, if anyone is interested in buying any pm me ).

To Klose: If you'd buy him for 15 or 20 million I would be very happy. It would not be worth it keeping him.

Werder is a team on the up just like Arsenal. But I just do not think these two teams have enough buffer to soak up bad season or two. That is the difference between truly big teams and merely good teams having a good season.

Suppose Arsenal don't make CL for a season (which is quite plausible IMO though unlikely) then despite their Emirates Stadium (This obviously helps) I am not too sure whether they can generate enough revenues to sustain their challenge to Man U and Chelski. Ditto for Werder. I know I may be talking out of line but I don't think my general point is that far away from the truth.

If you don't want to believe it. Just look at Depor and Leeds. I know Arsenal and Werder havent accumulated debts of magnitude of these clubs, so probably won't go that far down, but still there have been precedences of teams over-achieving and only to find out where their place really lies. That is why it is essentially IMO to have big pool of domestic and dedicated global fanbase. That is far better indicator of future record than current standings (there could be exceptions like Napoli). For this reason, I don't think Juve and Napoli will be at the current predicament for too long.

 

Buy on AliExpress.com

[RAMI-N]

Werder is a team on the up just like Arsenal. But I just do not think these two teams have enough buffer to soak up bad season or two. That is the difference between truly big teams and merely good teams having a good season.

Suppose Arsenal don't make CL for a season (which is quite plausible IMO though unlikely) then despite their Emirates Stadium (This obviously helps) I am not too sure whether they can generate enough revenues to sustain their challenge to Man U and Chelski. Ditto for Werder. I know I may be talking out of line but I don't think my general point is that far away from the truth.

If you don't want to believe it. Just look at Depor and Leeds. I know Arsenal and Werder havent accumulated debts of magnitude of these clubs, so probably won't go that far down, but still there have been precedences of teams over-achieving and only to find out where their place really lies. That is why it is essentially IMO to have big pool of domestic and dedicated global fanbase. That is far better indicator of future record than current standings (there could be exceptions like Napoli). For this reason, I don't think Juve and Napoli will be at the current predicament for too long.

agreed
well said

 

[Gradient]

Werder is a team on the up just like Arsenal. But I just do not think these two teams have enough buffer to soak up bad season or two. That is the difference between truly big teams and merely good teams having a good season.

Suppose Arsenal don't make CL for a season (which is quite plausible IMO though unlikely) then despite their Emirates Stadium (This obviously helps) I am not too sure whether they can generate enough revenues to sustain their challenge to Man U and Chelski. Ditto for Werder. I know I may be talking out of line but I don't think my general point is that far away from the truth.

If you don't want to believe it. Just look at Depor and Leeds. I know Arsenal and Werder havent accumulated debts of magnitude of these clubs, so probably won't go that far down, but still there have been precedences of teams over-achieving and only to find out where their place really lies. That is why it is essentially IMO to have big pool of domestic and dedicated global fanbase. That is far better indicator of future record than current standings (there could be exceptions like Napoli). For this reason, I don't think Juve and Napoli will be at the current predicament for too long.

You are right when you say that good work for one or two seasons does not make a club permenantly successful. I do not know a lot about Depor or Leeds but I do not think they had four successful seasons like Bremen has now. This is what makes Werder's fanbase grow the way it does.

 

[Jun-hide]

You are right when you say that good work for one or two seasons does not make a club permenantly successful. I do not know a lot about Depor or Leeds but I do not think they had four successful seasons like Bremen has now. This is what makes Werder's fanbase grow the way it does.

I say reaching the Semi-Finals of CL is far better than what Werder has achieved in recent years. And in the case of Depor, they have been consistently good between 1999-2004.

But as I have said, I don't think Werder will fall down to the where Depor is right now. Depor obviously pretended to be good by spending money which they don't have (Lazio too) whereas I do am not aware of such financial trouble in Werder. But the point is that, there is a reason why big teams do consistently well and whereas certain teams find it hard to replicate such sustained excellence. Yes its a bit unfair that how well Arsenal or Werder are run, they cannot reproduce the long history of Juve, Real, ManUre, Milan, but life is unfair.

On a side note, there have been cases where once great teams falling into a state of oblivion (Liverpool, Inter) so it is vital for us Juve fans too keep both feets on the ground and be realistic about our chances for next few years.

 

[Gradient]

I say reaching the Semi-Finals of CL is not far better than what Werder has achieved in recent years.

I say what Werder has achieved is much more. With a bit more luck with the drawings, they could have reached the semi-finals of the Champions League this year also. Monaco even reached the final and it seemed to be more of an accident.

 

[Gradient]

I say reaching the Semi-Finals of CL is far better than what Werder has achieved in recent years. And in the case of Depor, they have been consistently good between 1999-2004.

But as I have said, I don't think Werder will fall down to the where Depor is right now. Depor obviously pretended to be good by spending money which they don't have (Lazio too) whereas I do am not aware of such financial trouble in Werder. But the point is that, there is a reason why big teams do consistently well and whereas certain teams find it hard to replicate such sustained excellence. Yes its a bit unfair that how well Arsenal or Werder are run, they cannot reproduce the long history of Juve, Real, ManUre, Milan, but life is unfair.

On a side note, there have been cases where once great teams falling into a state of oblivion (Liverpool, Inter) so it is vital for us Juve fans too keep both feets on the ground and be realistic about our chances for next few years.

I think it is possible that Werder will become as popular as Juve is. I do not think it will happen though because I cannot imagine a player like Buffon or Nedved ever playing in Bremen. I am aware of the difference between real huge clubs and Werder Bremen.

 

[Jun-hide]

I say what Werder has achieved is much more. With a bit more luck with the drawings, they could have reached the semi-finals of the Champions League this year also. Monaco even reached the final and it seemed to be more of an accident.

I agree with you on how far team goes in CL is as much lottery as it is a luck. In fact, there has been some dubious winners in last couple of season or so (Not Barca though). But both Leeds and Depor achieved their results when they had to go through TWO group stages before the knockout stage. That makes it harder to poorer teams to well in the tournament. In Leeds case, they went through a group by knocking out Barca in the process (fumble by Dida helped), and qualified in a group that had Real Madrid & Lazio (Phenomenal Lazio team that was). They overachieved yes. But when you go past two tough groups in a row then it is no luck. Meaning both Depor and Leeds were pretty good team in their own right.

Werder could be consistently better. But they havent shown their full potential as of yet. Getting hammered by Lyon, and failing to go past group stage is no bar for success.

 

[Jun-hide]

I think it is possible that Werder will become as popular as Juve is. I do not think it will happen though because I cannot imagine a player like Buffon or Nedved ever playing in Bremen. I am aware of the difference between real huge clubs and Werder Bremen.

I wouldnt bet house on it.

But then again I just found your claim by Bremen has become better than Juve quite amusing. The jury is out whether Juve can recover its past eminence but don't rule us out yet.

Heck, I even supported them to go past through the group stage...

at the expense of Chelski that is (Sorry Jacques but I hate Chelski more).

 

[Gradient]

I wouldnt bet house on it.

But then again I just found your claim by Bremen has become better than Juve quite amusing. The jury is out whether Juve can recover its past eminence but don't rule us out yet.

Heck, I even supported them to go past through the group stage...

at the expense of Chelski that is (Sorry Jacques but I hate Chelski more).

I am not saying that I am sure Juve's days are over forever, I just said I think they are. Your logic during our whole discussion is quite strange (no offence please). If someone who had no idea of football believed you, he would think Paris St. Germain must be one of the most successful teams in the world.

Werder could be consistently better. But they havent shown their full potential as of yet. Getting hammered by Lyon, and failing to go past group stage is no bar for success.

I think Bremen has evolved during the past years. They got hammered by Lyon and now they had a real chance of progressing through a group with Barca and Chelsea. I do not think last years Juventus would have progressed in this group either.

 

[ReBeL]

I am not saying that I am sure Juve's days are over forever, I just said I think they are. Your logic during our whole discussion is quite strange (no offence please). If someone who had no idea of football believed you, he would think Paris St. Germain must be one of the most successful teams in the world.


I think Bremen has evolved during the past years. They got hammered by Lyon and now they had a real chance of progressing through a group with Barca and Chelsea. I do not think last years Juventus would have progressed in this group either.

Didn't Leverkusen have the same trend like Bremen afew years ago??

 

[Gradient]

Didn't Leverkusen have the same trend like Bremen afew years ago??

Yes but they spent millions on some old stars and then German pay-tv “Premiere” had financial problems and the tv earnings dramatically sank for every Bundesliga club, etc. so they were unlucky also.

 

[Jun-hide]

I am not saying that I am sure Juve's days are over forever, I just said I think they are. Your logic during our whole discussion is quite strange (no offence please). If someone who had no idea of football believed you, he would think Paris St. Germain must be one of the most successful teams in the world.


I think Bremen has evolved during the past years. They got hammered by Lyon and now they had a real chance of progressing through a group with Barca and Chelsea. I do not think last years Juventus would have progressed in this group either.

I see. I guess our opinion differ.

But there are many reasons as to why Juve would do better in near future than say Bremen. I find your claim than Bremen is better simply because they are playing in the CL and we are not to be far short sighted and perplexing.

PSG has never been a big team in European for that matter, not in comparison to Juve.

Of course everything what we right and say is to a large extent opinion. That is why I never asked you to provide some facts to prove our opinion. B
But I don't think it is beyond the reason human being to realize that Juve has more potential than Werder for the European stage and Domestic League.

No, I don't we would have qualified from that group but I am sure had we not been relegated and made more reinforcements (which we would have had) then our chances of doing better than Werder is far greater. Werder is a good club. But but they havent achieved anything to declare themselves as the big gun.

 

[flieeeekke]

you know why werder isnt a big club? because if we offered some decent money for diego he would join juventus without thinking twice imo.

 

[Alltagsheld]

you know why werder isnt a big club? because if we offered some decent money for diego he would join juventus without thinking twice imo.

1st mistake: We don't have any money
2nd mistake: Diego would not move at the moment anyway

 

[Turk_Bianconero]

1st mistake: We don't have any money
2nd mistake: Diego would not move at the moment anyway

1-We(Juventus) have a lot of money
2-We dont need Diego

 

[JCK]

Diego owns Ronaldinho

 

[Cuti]

1) we do not have a lot of money, we have an average amount.
2) we need Diego badly

 

[ReBeL]

1) we do not have a lot of money, we have an average amount.
2) we need Diego like fuck

Do you mean all of us need fuck??

 

[Turk_Bianconero]

1) we do not have a lot of money, we have an average amount.
2) we need Diego like fuck

1- we dont lose money,you will see the money when transfer market open
2-he played like sh.t with porto and overrated,he cant play for national team

 

[Gill_juve]

Do you mean all of us need fuck??

yeh baby