The NBA Thread (43 Viewers)

[Cheesio]

Of course he is gonna say that - Thomas was/is known as a very vindictive and jealous person, someone who operated silently and under the radar, so to speak.
He hates all the great players he had to compete with because he has always had to live in their shadows - Bird, Magic, and especially MJ, who had him booted from the Dream Team.

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If I am a Celtics fan, then what is Sergio's excuse for being a Lakers fan and hating the Celtics with passion?

So, everyone here is delusional but you? Yeah, that's a solid ground to stand on ...

Lol chose to avoid all the point i raised, how many coachs, GMs, players, fans would take Larry bird before Lebron if they are starting a team ??

Sergio has raised some valid points, but if he think Bird is better than LBJ. he's wrong.

Look at the teams LBJ took the finals, compared them to those Cs, lakers, bulls...We can argue that Lebron only played with one future hall of famer in Wade, who after the first year, started getting injured and never was the same.
Bird played with 2/3 at the same time, Magic had Kareem, worthy and fucking bob mcdoo coming from the bench, Micheal had Pippen rodman and Horace grant.
And let's not talk about the coaching, Lebron never had a hall of fame coach.

 

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[zizinho]

Yet you think Bird is a better defender than LBJ.

From someone who played in the 80s and on of the most respected players ever.


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He guarded KD who's a better offensive player than Domenique

LeBron gets beaten by role players on defense regularly. Average defender. Isiah is still butthurt about the 92 snub, not surprised at all that he said that

 

[acmilan]

Dont forget passing, id give Larry the edge there too. He saw plays happen 2 moves in advance. What James has over him is longetivity, both Birds prime and career ended 3-4 years too soon

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How many hall of famers has Lebron played with, so far?

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Or future Hall of famers should i say

Yeah, Bird's passing and vision for the game, full court, was something to behold - an under-appreciated part of his game, imo.

 

[zizinho]

And we see how well that turned out.

Exactly

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Great offense beats great defense every day of the week.

And destroys average defense, which is what KD did

 

[Cheesio]

:smh:

Would love to see Bird average a triple double in the finals, and guard KD who's arguably one of the most gifted offensive players this league has ever seen playing with 2 of the best shooters of all time.

And lol at Isiah being butthurt, he makes Valid point, not MJ, not Bird, not Magic, not Kobe, not Shaq had to take the load LBJ did all of this years.

 

[KB824]

Of course he is gonna say that - Thomas was/is known as a very vindictive and jealous person, someone who operated silently and under the radar, so to speak.
He hates all the great players he had to compete with because he has always had to live in their shadows - Bird, Magic, and especially MJ, who had him booted from the Dream Team.

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If I am a Celtics fan, then what is Sergio's excuse for being a Lakers fan and hating the Celtics with passion?

So, everyone here is delusional but you? Yeah, that's a solid ground to stand on ...

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Well, what can I say - I dislike LeBron because I am Celtics fan but have no problem putting MJ over Bird

Which MJ. Because if it is the MJ that I am thinking of. I am curious as to where you put Magic

 

[zizinho]

:smh:

Would love to see Bird average a triple double in the finals, and guard KD who's arguably one of the most gifted offensive players this league has ever seen playing with 2 of the best shooters of all time.

And lol at Isiah being butthurt, he makes Valid point, not MJ, not Bird, not Magic, not Kobe, not Shaq had to take the load LBJ did all of this years.

LeBron is playing on the most stacked team for 7 seasons now in a historically weak eastern conference, won only 3 rings. You made some BS points all over the last few posts, which tells me you dont really pay attention to the actual game and just take wrong opinions of other people. No one had to carry the load LeBron had to, the worst thing anyone said in this thread by far

 

[acmilan]

Lol chose to avoid all the point i raised, how many coachs, GMs, players, fans would take Larry bird before Lebron if they are starting a team ??

Sergio has raised some valid points, but if he think Bird is better than LBJ. he's wrong.

Look at the teams LBJ took the finals, compared them to those Cs, lakers, bulls...We can argue that Lebron only played with one future hall of famer in Wade, who after the first year, started getting injured and never was the same.
Bird played with 2/3 at the same time, Magic had Kareem, worthy and fucking bob mcdoo coming from the bench, Micheal had Pippen rodman and Horace grant.
And let's not talk about the coaching, Lebron never had a hall of fame coach.

People tend to be prisoners of the present moment and have short memories. Not to mention all these media personalities are there to drive the ratings up and sucking off LeBron is where the ratings are at, not telling people that LeBron can't even touch a bunch of players from 20-30+ years ago like Magic, Bird, Jordan, Jabar, etc.

Are you out of your mind or what? LeBron has been surrounding himself with super-teams for the past 8 years of his career and that's only reason he has even won a title in his career.
The most impressive stat of LeBron's career is the 7 finals in a row he's made but that was achieved by his super-teams facing literally not even basic competition in the sub-par Eastern COnf for 5-6 years now.
All of LeBron's stats have been achieved in an era of soft, defense-free basketball. Furthermore, the NBA today lacks legitimate HOF talent of years past when the league was much more competitive.
Whatever few true star players are there, they are gathered in 2-3 teams, making the NBA a very non-competitive league. That is, not only is LeBron building super-teams, he actually has no competition whatsoever until the NBA finals, which he usually finds a way to lose.

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LeBron is playing on the most stacked team for 7 seasons now in a historically weak eastern conference, won only 3 rings. You made some BS points all over the last few posts, which tells me you dont really pay attention to the actual game and just take wrong opinions of other people. No one had to carry the load LeBron had to, the worst thing anyone said in this thread by far

yeah, talk about being delusional ... just dropping crap left and right as if factual reality doesn't matter

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Which MJ. Because if it is the MJ that I am thinking of. I am curious as to where you put Magic

Magic and Bird are the same level for me, with only MJ above them.

My top-5 all time would be MJ at 1 and then Magic, Bird, Abdul-Jabbar and Russell in any order.

 

[Cheesio]

LeBron is playing on the most stacked team for 7 seasons now in a historically weak eastern conference, won only 3 rings. You made some BS points all over the last few posts, which tells me you dont really pay attention to the actual game and just take wrong opinions of other people. No one had to carry the load LeBron had to, the worst thing anyone said in this thread by far

Lol at historically stacked team, which player in these cleveland cavaliers is as good as Mchale, Walton, worthy, Kareem, Pippen, Kobe....

The eastern conference is weak, but Lebron one of the main reason of that, Whatever team he's playing for is guaranteed to be in the conference finals/finals. That's how good he is.

Matter of fact, i Would love to see any other player take that 2007 team to the finals at age 22 with Mike brown as a coach.

Just because i'am saying that Lebron is a better player doesnt mean that Bird wasn't great .It's just that he isn't as good as Lebron, neither is Magic and Magic would be the first to tell you that.

 

[KB824]

Lebron is a great player. No two ways about it.

But for me personally, I would not take him over Magic or Bird. That is just how I feel.

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However, in regards to the talk about how many HOF players they each played with, that is a discussion we simply can't have right now. We have no idea how many of LBJ's current or former teammates will be there.

To be truthful, I never viewed Worthy or Parish as HOF material, but there they are. You never know

 

[Cheesio]

That's fair. It's your opinion and i respect that.

Just like i wouldn't take any other player over T-Mac

Edit: Lebron is superior to Bird in any basketball metric you like to chose.

And this with the NBA in the 80s playing at a higher pace, defense schemes not as good as now.

 

[Post Ironic]

Only a bonehead Celtics fan would put Bird on the same level as Kareem or Magic

Both are clearly above Bird, and it's not even close.

Magic: 5 titles, 3x finals mvp, 3x regular season mvp.
Kareem: 6 titles, 2x finals mvp, 6x regular season mvp.
Bird: 3 titles, 2x finals mvp, 3x regular season mvp

Dude is clearly behind both.

1)MJ
2)Kareem
3)Magic
4)Bird
....



If Magic and Bird had played longer and not had the injury problems, maybe they pass Kareem, but that's not how history played itself out.

Below those 4 you have Russell, Wilt, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Lebron, and a few others in whatever order is wanted. Lebron likely finishes his career in the Magic to Bird area, because he'll have the volume of Kareem, but I doubt he wins the titles and finals/regular season mvps to get to Kareem tier greatness.

 

[zizinho]

Lol at historically stacked team, which player in these cleveland cavaliers is as good as Mchale, Walton, worthy, Kareem, Pippen, Kobe....

The eastern conference is weak, but Lebron one of the main reason of that, Whatever team he's playing for is guaranteed to be in the conference finals/finals. That's how good he is.

Matter of fact, i Would love to see any other player take that 2007 team to the finals at age 22 with Mike brown as a coach.

Just because i'am saying that Lebron is a better player doesnt mean that Bird wasn't great .It's just that he isn't as good as Lebron, neither is Magic and Magic would be the first to tell you that.

Did i say historically stacked? I said compared to other teams in the league. Miami big 3, then added Allen, great shooters to spread the floor, Cavs big 3, bunch of former allstar veterans as depth... Who else in the last 7 years had a better team on paper? Very few. And wait, didnt James play with Shaq even before going to Miami? Jamison too, allstar Mo Williams... Was that a terrible team compared to the rest of the east, other than Boston?

Thats BS, Lebron didnt make the finals in 2008 and 2009, so obviously youre wrong. He had Wade-Bosh in Heat, Irving-Love in Cleveland. Best team in the east by far and atleast top 3 in the league for the past 7 years. Hes supposed to make the finals on the teams hes been on.

LeBron who averaged 25ppg on 41% shooting, really? No one else ever could have reached the final on that kind of production? Rethink what you said and come again

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Lebron is a great player. No two ways about it.

But for me personally, I would not take him over Magic or Bird. That is just how I feel.

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However, in regards to the talk about how many HOF players they each played with, that is a discussion we simply can't have right now. We have no idea how many of LBJ's current or former teammates will be there.

To be truthful, I never viewed Worthy or Parish as HOF material, but there they are. You never know

Bosh, Allen, Irving will all make it imo

 

[KB824]

Only a bonehead Celtics fan would put Bird on the same level as Kareem or Magic

Both are clearly above Bird, and it's not even close.

Magic: 5 titles, 3x finals mvp, 3x regular season mvp.
Kareem: 6 titles, 2x finals mvp, 6x regular season mvp.
Bird: 3 titles, 2x finals mvp, 3x regular season mvp

Dude is clearly behind both.

1)MJ
2)Kareem
3)Magic
4)Bird
....



If Magic and Bird had played longer and not had the injury problems, maybe they pass Kareem, but that's not how history played itself out.

Below those 4 you have Russell, Wilt, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Lebron, and a few others in whatever order is wanted. Lebron likely finishes his career in the Magic to Bird area, because he'll have the volume of Kareem, but I doubt he wins the titles and finals/regular season mvps to get to Kareem tier greatness.

I would put Bird on the level of Magic. Doesn't mean that I think that Bird is better, because I don't. I will always say that Magic was better. But on the same level of greatness? Definitely.

Does that make me a bonehead Lakers fan?

 

[Post Ironic]

I would put Bird on the level of Magic. Doesn't mean that I think that Bird is better, because I don't. I will always say that Magic was better. But on the same level of greatness? Definitely.

Does that make me a bonehead Lakers fan?

Yes.

They played in the same era, on similarly star-studded teams. Kareem and Magic led the Lakers to greater things. As shown, I place Bird as number 4 behind Magic and Kareem, so it's not like I'm saying Bird is some scrub out of the top 5 of all-time, but there is a clear demarcation line there, in the form of several more titles, for both Magic and Kareem, and more mvps for both Magic and Kareem.

 

[KB824]

Yes.

They played in the same era, on similarly star-studded teams. Kareem and Magic led the Lakers to greater things. As shown, I place Bird as number 4 behind Magic and Kareem, so it's not like I'm saying Bird is some scrub out of the top 5 of all-time, but there is a clear demarcation line there, in the form of several more titles, for both Magic and Kareem, and more mvps for both Magic and Kareem.

But you can also make the argument that Magic joined a team that already had Kareem, Wilkes, and Norm Nixon.

Who did Bird have on the Celtics when he joined? McHale, Ainge, DJ and Parish didn't get there until after

 

[Post Ironic]

But you can also make the argument that Magic joined a team that already had Kareem, Wilkes, and Norm Nixon.

Who did Bird have on the Celtics when he joined? McHale, Ainge, DJ and Parish didn't get there until after

They had Archibald, McHale, Parish, Bird for the 1981 title. One year after Bird entered the league. All Hall-of-Famers. As well as Cedric Maxwell who was no scrub and won NBA finals MVP that year. Bird had tons of help, almost immediately. Also had Bill Walton and Dennis Johnson on the team in the mid-80s.

Magic was finals MVP the year before in 1980. As a rookie, on that also-stacked Lakers team.

 

[KB824]

They had Archibald, McHale, Parish, Bird for the 1981 title. One year after Bird entered the league. All Hall-of-Famers. As well as Cedric Maxwell who was no scrub and won NBA finals MVP that year. Bird had tons of help, almost immediately. Also had Bill Walton and Dennis Johnson on the team in the mid-80s.

Magic was finals MVP the year before in 1980. As a rookie, on that also-stacked Lakers team.

McHale and Parish didn't come until after the 1st season was over. A season where Bird transformed a 30 win team to a 60 win team. But the point being, is that the Celtics were not a ready made Championship team the way the Lakers were.

Put Larry on the Lakers in his rookie year. Do you think the Lakers win the title? They most likely would.

I've already stated that I think that Magic is better than Bird. I also stated that I think he is on the same level. Most people would agree,including Magic. It just seems to me that your levels that you are putting these players on are razor thin.

 

[Post Ironic]

McHale and Parish didn't come until after the 1st season was over. A season where Bird transformed a 30 win team to a 60 win team. But the point being, is that the Celtics were not a ready made Championship team the way the Lakers were.

Put Larry on the Lakers in his rookie year. Do you think the Lakers win the title? They most likely would.

I've already stated that I think that Magic is better than Bird. I also stated that I think he is on the same level. Most people would agree,including Magic. It just seems to me that your levels that you are putting these players on are razor thin.

But in the top 5ish players the margins are always razor thin.

Bird was amazing. I love the guy even if I despise the Celtics. But Magic won more, both on a team level and an individual level. That separates them for me. As well as Magic holding the 2-1 advantage in head to head finals.

 

[zizinho]

Kareem should have been FMVP in 1980 imo. Yes he missed game 6, but was instrumental in the previous 3 wins and his averages were crazy good. 33ppg, 14rpg, 5 bpg. I read somewhere recently that he should have got the award, as most voters had him as their pick, but were forced to vote for Magic instead after game 6. No idea how much truth there is to that