The 4-2-3-1 Formation (1 Viewer)

the phoenix

Junior Member
Aug 8, 2002
92
#1
Guys I was just reading an article that states that Lippi would like to use the 4-2-3-1 formation alot more often. My question is with the players we have is this formation really possible for us and what would be the starting eleven in order to make this effective? I also remember reeading that Appiah and Davids should be paired to form the defensive midfield? any thoughts?
 

IceBlu

Senior Member
Aug 26, 2003
1,364
#2
ideally i would like this lineup for the 4-2-3-1 formation


Buffon

Thuram
Montero / Tudor
Leggrotaglie / Ferrara
Zambrotta

Tacchinardi
Appiah / Davids

Miccoli / Camoranesi
Del Piero
Nedved

Trezeguet/Di Vaio


yeah Appiah and Davids could both start but id prefer Tacchinardi in there too...

Lippi knows what hes doing..

What i think will happen is that its not going to be a rigid 4-2-3-1 formation....I think Del Piero, Nedved and Miccoli will be allowed to push forward and get into striking positions as well as provide Trezeguet with service.

its really attacking with effectively 4 players capable of scoring regularly.... I hardly know any team that would be able to keep a clean sheet against this attack.
 

Adrian

Senior Member
Jan 31, 2003
4,406
#3
this formation suits us best in terms of getting the best players on the field.

but, i'm not sure if Trez actually suits it. trez is a great striker, but without plenty of support, he is nothing.

so, as long as del piero and miccoli give him enough support and creativity, this formation should see juve score lots of goals.

tacchinardi and davids are still favourites as DM. but that doesnt mean that Appiah and Maresca cant get a lot of playing time.

serie A games should see tacchinardi and davids rested.
 

sateeh

Day Walker
Jul 28, 2003
8,020
#4
I think against teams with big striking abailities it should be appiah and davids.And against teams that push back and defend it should be tacchi.
Adrian i see ur point.Miccoli isn't a midfield player who can get good passes and crosses.See that is where camoranesi fits in.

The best thing in juve this year is that we have too much options.
:)
 
Jul 12, 2002
5,666
#5
I like this formation it is good, the only thing is that we might need to put someone more pacey in defence, as Zamby and Thuram will have to be going up the wings.
 

Stu

Senior Member
Jul 14, 2002
17,556
#6
++ [ originally posted by the phoenix ] ++
Guys I was just reading an article that states that Lippi would like to use the 4-2-3-1 formation alot more often. My question is with the players we have is this formation really possible for us and what would be the starting eleven in order to make this effective? I also remember reeading that Appiah and Davids should be paired to form the defensive midfield? any thoughts?
The 4-2-3-1 is a very good formation IMO and it is working wonders for Italy and Juve at the moment. The vital thing about this formation is that it allows us to have Miccoli, Nedved, Del Piero and Trezeguet all on the field at the same time without losing much balance.

This formation was used against Man Utd in pre-season, in the Super Cup victory against Milan and in the 5-1 drubbing of Empoli just a week ago.

Here is how it normally looks:

Buffon
Thuram Legrottaglie Montero Zambrotta
Tacchinardi Appiah
Miccoli Nedved Del Piero
Trezeguet

Miccoli and Del Piero start wide on the flanks but drift into the middle alot and the versatility of these two players is what makes this formation tick IMO. At times you'll see the normal Micco-Neddy-DP but then you'll also see Neddy on the right, DP on the left and Micco upfront alongside Trez or Micco on the right, Neddy on the left and DP upfront alongside Trez.
 

Hydde

Duke NUKEM
Mar 6, 2003
36,799
#7
That formation didnt worked against empoli in the first half. Didnt worked in the way that we didnyt managed to score, and ith the change to the old formation, we trashed empoli.

But i dont think that it didnt worked, it was just that Miccoli was not in his best form, and he had3 or 4 clear chances of scoring, but sadly he didnt. If he had managed to score in that opportunities, now we would be talking another thing.

I can wait to see miccoli back, and try this thing again.
 

Adrian

Senior Member
Jan 31, 2003
4,406
#8
yeah, miccoli was obviously ready for an operation while he was playing, so i believe it would have worked fine.

sateeh, i'm not sure if i understand why you have appiah and davids as DM when the team has big striking abilities. the way i see it is that Tacchinardi sits back infront of the defence and can help out the likes of a Legrottaglie or Tudor if the otther team has tall big strikers.

and with davids and appiah, one has to be the anchor man, and i think they are too similar to play together. but of course, we are yet to see if it works so it might be worth a try.

the only other thing i want to mention is pace in the centre of defence. Montero has obviously lossed a lot of pace. Last season, we saw this lack of pace cause him to bring down players in the penalty area and he does get exposed easily when playing against the best strikers in europe. Legrottaglie and Tudor are good but are not pacey defenders either. Ciro, Iuliano and even Fresi are not either.

so i believe this is the only weak spot in our team. The only solution i can think of is putting Thuram in the centre, but then we lose big at right back especially since our formation relies on the full backs heavily.

i'm thinking that Tudor and Legrottaglie should be the centre of defence. tudor isnt very fast, but he does stop his man through his strength and height. Legrottaglie is similar, and they both are not losing their qualities such as pace and agility like Montero and Ferrara are.

this is also why i think Tacchinardi must be played at all times, because he sits back the most out of davids, appiah and maresca. Maresca is able to do this also, but his natural instinct is to attack when he can, even if his coach tells him to sit back.

what are your thoughts?
 

denco

Superior Being
Jul 12, 2002
4,679
#10
++ [ originally posted by Adrian ] ++
yeah, miccoli was obviously ready for an operation while he was playing, so i believe it would have worked fine.

sateeh, i'm not sure if i understand why you have appiah and davids as DM when the team has big striking abilities. the way i see it is that Tacchinardi sits back infront of the defence and can help out the likes of a Legrottaglie or Tudor if the otther team has tall big strikers.

and with davids and appiah, one has to be the anchor man, and i think they are too similar to play together. but of course, we are yet to see if it works so it might be worth a try.

the only other thing i want to mention is pace in the centre of defence. Montero has obviously lossed a lot of pace. Last season, we saw this lack of pace cause him to bring down players in the penalty area and he does get exposed easily when playing against the best strikers in europe. Legrottaglie and Tudor are good but are not pacey defenders either. Ciro, Iuliano and even Fresi are not either.

so i believe this is the only weak spot in our team. The only solution i can think of is putting Thuram in the centre, but then we lose big at right back especially since our formation relies on the full backs heavily.

i'm thinking that Tudor and Legrottaglie should be the centre of defence. tudor isnt very fast, but he does stop his man through his strength and height. Legrottaglie is similar, and they both are not losing their qualities such as pace and agility like Montero and Ferrara are.

this is also why i think Tacchinardi must be played at all times, because he sits back the most out of davids, appiah and maresca. Maresca is able to do this also, but his natural instinct is to attack when he can, even if his coach tells him to sit back.

what are your thoughts?
I don't actually with the notion that Tacchinardi is a good or great defensive midfielder, he is more of a palyer who keeps the move going on a steadying influence in the midfiled but a s a defensive midfileder, well i beg to differ

He does not have the pace to stop the opposition when they are attacking us unlike Davids and Appiah and I have never seen him make a last ditch tackle like Keane and Vieiria do all the time or how Davids does it for his Nt

If you also saw the Cl final , when Davids went out injured Tacchi was totally dominated by Gatusso and I don't remmeber him stopping the atacks by Costa and co

What he has over the other 2 is his height and if you watch the Italian Nt, you would see that Perotta and Zanetti can cover a lot of ground like Davids and Appiah and when Tacchi did play against Germany he looked lost in the first half and with his lack of pace he resorted to petty fouls and Italy were totally over run in the second half

I would rather Davids and Appiah becasue they have the pace to cover a lot of ground but I doubt that would happen
 

s0ftcore

Senior Member
Jul 13, 2002
568
#13
Would Tacchinardi make a good defender?

Off-topic: In CM4, I released Tacch and he joined Inter, and became a 'cultured centreback' :eek: I do see Taach playing in defence in the later part of his career though, when he's like Roy Keane's age.
 

Adrian

Senior Member
Jan 31, 2003
4,406
#14
playing appiah and davids might sound good, as they are both great at running down the balls and tackles etc...but in the end, they both are not anchor men. and you need a holding midfielder in the team.

in regards to the NT, Tacchinardi plays a game once a year, do you expect him to play great in one half of football?? traps has given perrotta and zanetti more than a handful of games to get used to the NT and playing together. its a lil harder for taachinardi to play well dont you think?

Tacchinardi played in defence at times for juve back in his young days. like on special occasions when we had no other to come on etc...i wouldnt mind seeing him a sweeper of some sort.

i tell you what, if he was tried there and become a defender, alla Helguera, juve could use Maresca in midfield also. that would be great!!
 

Hydde

Duke NUKEM
Mar 6, 2003
36,799
#15
Yeah i was thinking on that.

You think that he will like it? i mean,, he is not like zambrotta, who you can fix,turn,twist like a clay.
 

Signor

Senior Member
Jul 13, 2002
3,019
#16
Guys The Idea of playing Tacchhinardi in Defence is totaly unacceptable, we are trying to convince lippi to play Tudor in defence instead of midfield and now you want Tacchi to switch his position and play in defence. He is just great where he is. One of the best in that position IMO.
 

slack

Junior Member
Dec 13, 2002
208
#17
Actually, Tach started by playing at the back very early back in his career. Crucially, he wasn't what you'd call makeshift/plug-gap either - he was called the new 'Baresi' then. With the skills/experience he accumulated in midfield these years, he could turn well out to be a VERY good centrehalf/sweeper yet.
 
Jul 12, 2002
5,666
#18
++ [ originally posted by Adrian ] ++
playing appiah and davids might sound good, as they are both great at running down the balls and tackles etc...but in the end, they both are not anchor men. and you need a holding midfielder in the team.
I disagree. You definately don't need a slow plodding central midfielder on the team and you certainly don't need one if you play with FOUR defenders. It's ludacris really.
 

denco

Superior Being
Jul 12, 2002
4,679
#19
++ [ originally posted by Adrian ] ++
playing appiah and davids might sound good, as they are both great at running down the balls and tackles etc...but in the end, they both are not anchor men. and you need a holding midfielder in the team.

in regards to the NT, Tacchinardi plays a game once a year, do you expect him to play great in one half of football?? traps has given perrotta and zanetti more than a handful of games to get used to the NT and playing together. its a lil harder for taachinardi to play well dont you think?

Tacchinardi played in defence at times for juve back in his young days. like on special occasions when we had no other to come on etc...i wouldnt mind seeing him a sweeper of some sort.

i tell you what, if he was tried there and become a defender, alla Helguera, juve could use Maresca in midfield also. that would be great!!
I am just curious , why do you need a holding midfielder when you are not that attacking a team? We are not Real madrid, nor Arsenal not even Lazio or Milan so why do we need a holding midfielder?
Anchor man? what is that exactly? The anchorman we have in Tacchinardi hardly stops attackers or midfielders from coming at us at will and he does not have the pace to chase a lost cause unlike Appiah and Davids who have far more energy

Tacchinardi , I have always said is best as a sweeper and thats where I have been most impressed with him

It would be interesting to see without Davids having to cover if he is as effective and as for the Nt, when given your chance you grasp it with both hands , its just a flimsy excuse to say he has only played 1 game in a year, how many games do u think it took Perotta to impress Trapatoni, well the answer is 1 , the same for Zanetti and that was a friendly against Japan prior to the Wc (Zanetti)

Please can we stop mentioning Tudor because from my experience in football, you don't play from a sick bed so lets talk about players you can rely on to be fit, instead of talking about potential wasted in the medical room
 

Stu

Senior Member
Jul 14, 2002
17,556
#20
++ [ originally posted by Rickenbacker2 ] ++


I disagree. You definately don't need a slow plodding central midfielder on the team and you certainly don't need one if you play with FOUR defenders. It's ludacris really.
Really now :irritate: Tacchinardi has just come off of his best season in midfield and you want him to switch positions? :groan: That's madness IMO, since Tacchi is such as good midfielder. He may not be as explosive as Davids or as creative as Appiah or Maresca, but he does what's needed of him. He keeps things simple but is efficient :stuckup:
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)