[SPA] La Liga 2008/2009 (32 Viewers)

[Bjerknes]

I don't think anyone in there right mind would claim that we are signing as good a Cannavaro as we sold.

The organisation of the back four, in my opinion, isn't as bad as the number of goals they are conceding would suggest. The main problem is that Real's centre midfield is totally non-existant at the moment.

There were heaps of times that Real's midfield didn't track Valencia midfielders, which left the defenders out numbered or not having a spare man, which makes it incredibly tough - especially against the quality of player that Valencia have.

That's certainly a problem, but you're being really kind to this player. Even with the midfield coming back, this player has been and will get skinned from time to time, which has been the case for the last three years. After all, the job of the defense is to stop attacks whether or not they have a line of DM's in front of them, and I've seen other defenses manage much better while their other players are caught up the pitch. The screwed up defense of Barca is one of them.

But yeah, put a line of DM's in front of Cannavaro and I'm sure he'll look better. We have to judge this player on one vs. one personal challenges instead.

 

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[Alen]

I want Valencia to play in CL next year.
Egoistic reason. Valencia are placed behind us on UEFA standings while both Sevilla and Villareal are ahead of us. If Sevilla and Villareal qualify then Juve's chances to be in pot 2 will be minimal.

 

[Stephan]

Valencia will be in pot 2 or 3?

 

[Joaco]

Real...

 

[Bjerknes]

Oh, I wouldn't call that first goal a two vs. one. The ball was already passed and Canna squared up to the player.

 

[Red]

That's certainly a problem, but you're being really kind to this player. Even with the midfield coming back, this player has been and will get skinned from time to time, which has been the case for the last three years. After all, the job of the defense is to stop attacks whether or not they have a line of DM's in front of them, and I've seen other defenses manage much better while their other players are caught up the pitch. The screwed up defense of Barca is one of them.

But yeah, put a line of DM's in front of Cannavaro and I'm sure he'll look better. We have to judge this player on one vs. one personal challenges instead.

I think the truth is somewhere in between. I probably am being kind to him, but I don't think one-on-one challenges is the best way to judge him because our defensive system is based on trying to avoid having to do one-on-one defending (though this may change with a new coach).

I have seen nothing to make me change my mind on Cannavaro: he will look better in Italy than he does in Spain; he is shadow of his former self, but he is still better than Mellberg or Legrottaglie; and he probably has one decent season left in him.

That said, I'm not keen on the signing and I will only consider it a good move if we are spending big on other areas (Diego and a RB) and s needed a cheap CB to us through one season.

 

[Alen]

Valencia will be in pot 2 or 3?

Valencia can't be in pot 2. They will be almost surely in pot 3, and maybe even in pot 4.

 

[Stephan]

Valencia can't be in pot 2. They will be almost surely in pot 3, and maybe even in pot 4.

s--t then we could have a possible group of Manutd, Juventus, Valencia, and the lucky 4th.

 

[Bjerknes]

I think the truth is somewhere in between. I probably am being kind to him, but I don't think one-on-one challenges is the best way to judge him because our defensive system is based on trying to avoid having to do one-on-one defending (though this may change with a new coach).

How can one judge a defender otherwise? No matter who it is, even me or you, of course we'll do better with help around us or if the midfield squashes all the attacks.

I understand our system, but I don't really see what you're trying to say.

 

[Alen]

s--t then we could have a possible group of Manutd, Juventus, Valencia, and the lucky 4th.

That's a possibility, yes.
But if we're in pot 3 the chances for such tough group are even bigger.
Manchester, Real Madrid, Juve
Liverpool, Porto, Juve
Barcelona, Bayern, Juve
Chelsea, Lyon, Juve
Arsenal, Villareal, Juve

etc

 

[Red]

How can one judge a defender otherwise? No matter who it is, even me or you, of course we'll do better with help around us or if the midfield squashes all the attacks.

I understand our system, but I don't really see what you're trying to say.

One-on-ones are just one aspect of defending. I consider positional sense and organisational skills (both or which Cannavaro has, however it may appear at times right now), to be far more important in a CB than his ability in one-on-ones.

With Cannavaro organsing the back line and with him playing between Chiellini and a good RB (hopefully) and behind Sissoko, we will make the most of his strengths and hide his weaknesses much better than Real do i.e. prevent him being exposed one-on-one.


This is probably one of the many things we will disagree on, though, just because we have are judging on different criteria.

 

[Bjerknes]

One-on-ones are just one aspect of defending. I consider positional sense and organisational skills (both or which Cannavaro has, however it may appear at times right now), to be far more important in a CB than his ability in one-on-ones.

With Cannavaro organsing the back line and with him playing between Chiellini and a good RB (hopefully) and behind Sissoko, we will make the most of his strengths and hide his weaknesses much better than Real do i.e. prevent him being exposed one-on-one.


This is probably one of the many things we will disagree on, though, just because we have are judging on different criteria.

Positional sense is important, something he will never lose I assume, but I'm not really seeing much organization in Real's defense right now. I think people are overrating Canna for the latter.

 

[Red]

Positional sense is important, something he will never lose I assume, but I'm not really seeing much organization in Real's defense right now. I think people are overrating Canna for the latter.

Cannavaro has been a very good organiser of defences for years. Just because the other defenders aren't good enough to obey his instructions doesn't mean he isn't saying the right things.

 

[ßöмßäяðîëя]

Well, I think Sergio Ramos is better than he is, and it isn't that he says the right things, he just says them in Italian to a SPAINER!

 

[Red]

That would explain it.

 

[Bjerknes]

Cannavaro has been a very good organiser of defences for years. Just because the other defenders aren't good enough to obey his instructions doesn't mean he isn't saying the right things.

Yeah, it's always all the other players' faults, never Cannavaro's. Surely Ramos and Pepe aren't in the same league as Fabio.

 

[Bjerknes]

Actually, Ramos and Pepe are too good to listen to the old fart Cannavaro, so there you go.

 

[ßöмßäяðîëя]

That would explain it.

You fuckin' with me?

Don't fuck with me, I'll make you do 40, then you'll do 40 more, then you'll pull KP....THE GREASE PIT! I'LL RUB YOUR NOSE, IN ENLISTED MEN'S CRUD, 'TILL YOU DON'T KNOW WHICH END IS UP, YA UNDERSTAND?

 

[Bjerknes]

 

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