Serie A: Juventus vs Sampdoria [Jan 20 2008] (11 Viewers)

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
116,032
how can playing more offensive can help your defense I fail to understand that. You think Sampdoria will just sit and watch that? They have huge talents offensive wise, and we have comedians at back, build a great defense then work your attack, it's not like we have much options. We need to defend from the midfield, because we can't defend with these players at our penalty area.
It's actually rather simple, Cloughie football. You play to your strengths and score more goals than your opponent. A team that has a fantastic defense but terrible forwards shouldn't throw three players up top while sacrificing a player in defense. A side with excellent attackers shouldn't field two defensive midfielders instead of one and sit back an entire match if they could press the opposition and just beat them up with goals.

My point is that I don't want Sampdoria to have a lot of possession and take the game to us, making our defense struggle while the ball is on our side of the pitch 50% of the match. Sampdoria's defense isn't particulary strong either, and with a Iaquinta, Del Piero, Nedved and Trezeguet causing havoc up there they will crack at some point. If we happen to sit back and not take the match to Samp, they will get more confident and eventually mount more attacks against us, thus troubling our defense even more.

Grabbing a goal within the first 25 minutes will be crucial because Samp seems to score more in the second half. Moreover, they are 14th in the league in regards to away form. We can overwhelm them early if we fielded our weapons and played to our strengths.
 

pavelnedved

official nedved copy
Jul 15, 2006
2,992
how can playing more offensive can help your defense I fail to understand that. You think Sampdoria will just sit and watch that? They have huge talents offensive wise, and we have comedians at back, build a great defense then work your attack, it's not like we have much options. We need to defend from the midfield, because we can't defend with these players at our penalty area.
i agree, but you can still defend with a 433 as well as attack with a 442. i would opt for the 433 with obviously 2dms and nedved. special task to to iaquinta and trezeguet would be to fall back and hunt the ball, i wouldn't pose this to del piero. kind of like we did against lazio (del piero stayed upfront, trez fell back). that would give us a lot of work-rate in midfield and we would have passing options forwards with two attackers falling back and keeping the field wide

442 gives several options imo

--nedved---------------------marchionni
------------zanetti----brazzo-------------

palladino--------------------------brazzo
-----------zanetti-----nedved------------

the latter one possesses tons of work rate, with only palladino having a completely attacking role. but then again palladino has only impressed me against inter on the left.

i don't think this is almiron time in any way
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
116,032
:lol2: God people here are conservative.

This reminds me of how some Republicans want more guns in the hands of US citizens, even students, to "defend" our schools against psycho mass-murderers. If something isn't working, just add more of it and the problem will be washed away.
 

pavelnedved

official nedved copy
Jul 15, 2006
2,992
:lol2: God people here are conservative.

This reminds me of how some Republicans want more guns in the hands of US citizens, even students, to "defend" our schools against psycho mass-murderers. If something isn't working, just add more of it and the problem will be washed away.
sure very conservative, let me teach you how the basic 433 works

x----x---x
-----x-----
---x--x---
x--x--x--x

unfortunately for you it still involves 2dms

i'm sure you'd rather opt for the nedved-delpiero-palladino-iaquinta-trezeguet formation of jack, but i'm pretty confident that ranieri isn't playing that kind of fm football.
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
116,032
sure very conservative, let me teach you how the basic 433 works

x----x---x
-----x-----
---x--x---
x--x--x--x

unfortunately for you it still involves 2dms

i'm sure you'd rather opt for the nedved-delpiero-palladino-iaquinta-trezeguet formation of jack, but i'm pretty confident that ranieri isn't playing that kind of fm football.
I wasn't referring to you.

And I have no problem with two DM's when we need them.
 

David01

Senior Member
Aug 20, 2006
2,825
for once I agree with Andy, our defence is probably our weakest link so we should prevent our opponents to put pressure on them
keep our opponents as far away from our defence as possible so we should attack them instead
don't sit back and wait for them to come running at our defence, our defence is bound to make a mistake sooner or later
 

pavelnedved

official nedved copy
Jul 15, 2006
2,992
for once I agree with Andy, our defence is probably our weakest link so we should prevent our opponents to put pressure on them
keep our opponents as far away from our defence as possible so we should attack them instead
don't sit back and wait for them to come running at our defence, our defence is bound to make a mistake sooner or later
sure but you can do this with a 433, 442 as well as a 451. just look at arsenal

having 4 strikers in your line-up doesn't mean that you're keeping the opponent away from your defence, on the contrary that could really backfire.

above all we're playing at home, we should always attack.
 

David01

Senior Member
Aug 20, 2006
2,825
I'm not talking about any formation I mean the intentions of the team, they should put the pressure on them early cuz if we sit back and speculate on the counter we are bound to get into difficulties
 

Snoop

Sabet is a nasty virgin
Oct 2, 2001
28,186
It's actually rather simple, Cloughie football. You play to your strengths and score more goals than your opponent. A team that has a fantastic defense but terrible forwards shouldn't throw three players up top while sacrificing a player in defense. A side with excellent attackers shouldn't field two defensive midfielders instead of one and sit back an entire match if they could press the opposition and just beat them up with goals.

My point is that I don't want Sampdoria to have a lot of possession and take the game to us, making our defense struggle while the ball is on our side of the pitch 50% of the match. Sampdoria's defense isn't particulary strong either, and with a Iaquinta, Del Piero, Nedved and Trezeguet causing havoc up there they will crack at some point. If we happen to sit back and not take the match to Samp, they will get more confident and eventually mount more attacks against us, thus troubling our defense even more.

Grabbing a goal within the first 25 minutes will be crucial because Samp seems to score more in the second half. Moreover, they are 14th in the league in regards to away form. We can overwhelm them early if we fielded our weapons and played to our strengths.
We want the same thing to have more possession, but you are only thinking of attacking. Of course our attack is our strength, that's why I can rely on two attackers or one, because they are strong. You are admitting that our defense and midfield is weak, but you still want to weaken them more, wouldn't you lose the balance that way? Andy I am not against 4-3-3, I got sicker than you of watching defensive games. But this is not the moment to try something new, and specially when we are not at our top form (even last match we were not playing any good football, luck and individual talents help us a lot).

Playing with more forwards doesn't mean we will only attack, we need first to take the ball front, we need creative players for that, who will do that? You should have known that our midfielders are bad dribblers. We are losing the ball a lot, our striker will wait there for nothing, and Sampdoria players will take those opportunities to counter attack us with players like Montella Cassano..
 

Snoop

Sabet is a nasty virgin
Oct 2, 2001
28,186
:lol2: God people here are conservative.

This reminds me of how some Republicans want more guns in the hands of US citizens, even students, to "defend" our schools against psycho mass-murderers. If something isn't working, just add more of it and the problem will be washed away.
what a way to win an argument, that's the same case EXACTLY :shifty:
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,334
:lol2: God people here are conservative.

This reminds me of how some Republicans want more guns in the hands of US citizens, even students, to "defend" our schools against psycho mass-murderers. If something isn't working, just add more of it and the problem will be washed away.
Yes,

Capello's like an old war wound. Never quite gone.

what a way to win an argument, that's the same case EXACTLY :shifty:
Andy's not my favorite guy, but that's a correct analogy, snoop.
 
Sep 19, 2006
1,221
-------------Buffon
Brazzo/Biri - Grygera - Legrotaglie - Molinaro

Marchionni/Brazzo - Almiron - Zanetti - Palladino

----------------------- Nedved ---------------------

------------------ Iaquinta-----------------------

More like 4-2-2-1-1 with Almiron and Zanetti infront of Defense, Palladino running forward from the left, Nedved creating from midfield and Iaquinta probably the only play that can alone in front, as using Trezeguet would be useless in this formation.
r u fucken kidding me!!

:lol2: God people here are conservative.
This reminds me of how some Republicans want more guns in the hands of US citizens, even students, to "defend" our schools against psycho mass-murderers. If something isn't working, just add more of it and the problem will be washed away.
Yeah,they want a regular 4_4_2 coz it worked very well against Empoli.
 

Azzurri7

Pinturicchio
Moderator
Dec 16, 2003
72,692
While i'd like to see the trident, because all our three forwards deserve to start, I do see a lot of sense in Snoop's words.

This defence DOES need all the support it can get from the midfield. Sampdoria like to crowd the midfield, so just playing three in midfield causes a great risk of being overrun. Controlling a game is usually done in midfield, if we want to run things and be in possesion of the ball, we need to fill the midfield with bodies.
I disagree. Because we have some problems defensivly, the best thing we can do is play the trident, on both sides we're gambling If we play with 4-4-2 or 4-3-3, I say lets gamble with 3attackers.

how can playing more offensive can help your defense I fail to understand that. You think Sampdoria will just sit and watch that? They have huge talents offensive wise, and we have comedians at back, build a great defense then work your attack, it's not like we have much options. We need to defend from the midfield, because we can't defend with these players at our penalty area.
It doesn't need calculations or chemistry mate....because they're good offensively and because playing with 4-4-2 wont make much diff, taking a risk and playing with 3up-front can hurt them more. We're playing home, If this game was away then I'd worry more but we're playing home, it makes sense more to attack and have 3 upfront.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,334
how can playing more offensive can help your defense I fail to understand that. You think Sampdoria will just sit and watch that? They have huge talents offensive wise, and we have comedians at back, build a great defense then work your attack, it's not like we have much options. We need to defend from the midfield, because we can't defend with these players at our penalty area.
The logic's fairly easy, snoop. By stressing their defense, you keep yours out of trouble. But still, it implies a risk and most people want to be very cautious ATM.
 

Salvo

J
Moderator
Dec 17, 2007
62,797
The logic's fairly easy, snoop. By stressing their defense, you keep yours out of trouble. But still, it implies a risk and most people want to be very cautious ATM.
our best bet is to try and box them in in their own half. but then we risk the counter.
 

Snoop

Sabet is a nasty virgin
Oct 2, 2001
28,186
Yes,

Capello's like an old war wound. Never quite gone.



Andy's not my favorite guy, but that's a correct analogy, snoop.
I am not surprised.. you think believing in God existence isn't any different than believing every Muslim out there should be death, then you are the last person to tell me which analogy is wrong or right, seven.
 

Ahmed

Principino
Sep 3, 2006
47,928
forget all these formations, make the starting lineup based on current form...our attackers are looking sharp and are amongst the goals so i say go for 4 3 3...u can play 5 at the back but this bunch will still look inadequate...better off trying to get the goals instead of keeping them out...let the best keeper of the past 20 years earn his keep :)
 

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