Russia - Ukraine Conflict 2022 (63 Viewers)

s4tch

Senior Member
Mar 23, 2015
33,886
read both the original tweet and the quote in the reply. it's clear that trump has no influence on putin, his deal making abilities are failing here, and if he wants peace indeed, he has to start turning on his master. otherwise it is a very long massacre

his proposal to ukraine is simply atrocious. "just surrender, give me your minerals, your territory to russia and be happy with it" isn't gonna cut it


- - - Updated - - -

it's an evil person. the sooner he dies the less damage he can do

 

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Last edited:
Jun 16, 2020
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Looking to the (potential) cease fire, the Panama Canal, the southern border in the US: this administration starts negotiations very aggressively but they’re able to get the results they want. It won’t win the beauty price but it has been effective so far.
 

s4tch

Senior Member
Mar 23, 2015
33,886
Looking to the (potential) cease fire, the Panama Canal, the southern border in the US: this administration starts negotiations very aggressively but they’re able to get the results they want. It won’t win the beauty price but it has been effective so far.
trying to make ukraine surrender and taking away military aid while alienating the whole world isn't effective, it's a fucking disgrace

russia has the gdp of spain (okay, a bit more) and an economy in free fall. trump is saving them here on ukraine's expense, no other way to spin it
 

s4tch

Senior Member
Mar 23, 2015
33,886
https://ria.ru/20250312/kapitulyatsiya-2004448813.html

Ukraine capitulated in Jeddah. But there is a nuance

It is believed that the name of the Saudi city of Jeddah, where the negotiations between the delegations of the United States and Ukraine took place, came from the Arabic word for "grandmother" and indicates the biblical Eve, whose grave is allegedly located there. This time, the grandmother again said twice: there is two news for Russia following the negotiations - good and bad.
You should start with the bad so as not to be disingenuous. The results of the meeting in Jeddah are not very good from the point of view of Russia's interests, and it is impossible to hide it: yesterday Ukraine did not receive military assistance and intelligence information from the United States, today it is receiving it again.

The best outcome would be in the absence of any results, so that the Kyiv guests were stubborn, Donald Trump continued to rage, and Volodymyr Zelensky remained the guy who was to blame for everything for Washington. But now Trump is ready to change his anger to mercy and welcome Zelensky back to Washington, because he believes he has signed up to his terms.


It's not that the situation has suddenly become bad for Russia. I just stopped being perfect. There was a rollback to positions when Zelensky had not yet made a scene in the White House and everyone believed that he had no choice but to agree to Trump's demands. Zelensky himself thought otherwise, went into conflict, was beaten, stood in the corner on peas, realized something for himself and crawled to confess: he sent a letter of apology to Washington and did not interfere with the "breakthrough" in Jeddah. What happened there is really called a breakthrough by Trump.


In fact, Kyiv simply stopped being capricious and agreed to the Americans' demands: to forget about the return of the positions of 2022 - and even more so from 1991 - and accept a 30-day truce with a possible extension, during which humanitarian issues (for example, the exchange of prisoners) will be resolved and consultations on a peace agreement will be held.
This is not yet a defeat for Kyiv, but a radical change in their tactics due to the failure of the previous, knowingly stupid one: to make Trump fall in love with Zelensky. Now, as then, Zelensky does not want peace, but wants to live on the allowance of NATO, wait for the "window of opportunity" (Martian attacks on Russia, for example) and feed the population with unrealistic hopes. He thinks that a rollback to such positions is also possible.

So the game continues. The question is what we are playing.


Trump believes that he is playing cards. "You don't have cards to play," he shouted to Zelensky as he sat across from him. But now what is happening is more like a children's game of sifu: this is a variation of tag, but you need to salt not with your hand, but with an object - a sifa (for example, a ball).

In the White House, Zelensky caught the sifu with his whole body, becoming an outcast and the impossible person who prevents Trump from receiving the Nobel Peace Prize. At the same time, due to the inertia of Zelensky, the European Union was also "sifted", which opened up encouraging prospects for discord within NATO between the United States and the EU.

So far, the prospects have not gone anywhere - Trump has been sent to Brussels for many sins and he has not even begun to sort out the reasons for a conflict with Europe (while tormenting Canada). But the EU took the opportunity to reduce the intensity of passions and clung to the American foot before it really kicked them: Ursula von der Leyen and Emmanuel Macron declared their support for the agreements in Jeddah.

Having accepted Trump's conditions, the Ukrainian delegation beat off the sifu to us. This is what US Secretary of State Marco Rubio means when he says that "the ball is now in Russia's court." It has its own games in its head (specifically, American football), but its rules are also clear: Moscow must either agree to the offer or reject it.
How we reject it will determine Russia's skill as a player in this special diplomatic discipline. It is necessary to contrive and hit the ball into Ukraine so that Zelensky again becomes an obstacle to Trump's Nobel Prize.

There is no question at all that Russia will accept the proposal from Jeddah in its current form. The West and Ukraine are asking in unison to stop hostilities, but their chorus has been demanding this since February 2022 and no one has the right to pretend that they have not heard that Russia has some conditions - the elimination of the reasons for the start of the NWO. In this sense, nothing has changed - all the reasons are in place both on the part of the United States and NATO, whose military infrastructure poses a threat to Russia's security, and on the part of Kyiv. Ukraine has not fulfilled any of the conditions, moreover, it has not declared goodwill that they can be fulfilled. Russia is asked for a truce only on the grounds that its opponent is doing very badly at the front.

Trump was wrong when he said that Zelensky had no cards left: the ataman planned to use the occupied part of the Kursk region of Russia as a "trump card" in the negotiations. But since then, the Russian army has almost knocked this "trump card" out of the hands of the enemy - only a small piece remains. In order to save at least this piece, Ukraine agrees to an immediate ceasefire. Kiev understands that this is not a serious proposal for Moscow, but they themselves accept it only in the hope that the US president will switch his anger to Moscow.
With all due respect – but who plays like that? No matter how much Trump is in a hurry, the only realistic way to end the conflict is dozens and hundreds of meetings of negotiating teams with tedious agreement on each point of the peace agreement. This is not a special whim, it has always worked this way. For example, negotiations in Paris to end the Vietnam War lasted four years.

It will be necessary to convey to Trump information about the real scale of the problems standing in the way of peace gently, so that this does not become a blow to his optimistic nature. It is always unpleasant to inform a person that his proposal cannot be implemented due to mistrust and bitter experience gained when Kiev and the collective West deceived Russia, which made concessions. But Trump must understand, because it's not about him, but about the bad people who came before him (he warmly agrees that they are bad), and with him everything will be completely different, but there is still a lot to be done to restore trust between the countries and Russia is ready for such joint activities.

As for the second, good news, Trump's shift of attention from Zelensky to Moscow has come at a great cost to Kiev and has brought Ukraine closer to the degree of despair after which peace will actually be possible.
Due to inflated expectations, Ukrainians are now immersed in despondency and feel betrayed. The agreement of the delegation in Jeddah to a truce is just a maneuver, but the very conduct of such a maneuver contradicts what propaganda has been instilling for three years. Yesterday it was stated that accepting Trump's conditions is the capitulation of Ukraine. Now the conditions have been accepted, and they are worse than before the quarrel in the White House, since the US treaty on rare earth metals will be rewritten in its favor. It turns out that Ukraine has capitulated? It turns out so.
Shock, anger, fear, confusion - all this is now being experienced by a country to which no one can explain what kind of "betrayal" or, conversely, "victory" happened: the propagandists themselves are shocked, and the manuals have not yet arrived. This makes it easier for Russia to continue working to achieve its goals. For her, stress in the ranks of the enemy has its own nuance.
Yes, Ukraine capitulated in Jeddah – shameful, although predictable for everyone who did not believe Zelensky and the Ukrainian media. But she capitulated to the President of the United States. Ukraine's capitulation to the States as a whole, from Russia's point of view, took place back in 2014 and was formalized by breaking cookies with Victoria Nuland, so nothing fundamentally new happened in Jeddah.
The capitulation of Ukraine (not so much to Russia, but to reality), which can really put an end to our ethno-political conflict, is yet to come. And, since we are talking about games, it will be easy to recognize it by the Russian cry "Goal!".

best part again:
How we reject it will determine Russia's skill as a player in this special diplomatic discipline. It is necessary to contrive and hit the ball into Ukraine so that Zelensky again becomes an obstacle to Trump's Nobel Prize.

russia in a nutshell for you.
 

Ronn

Senior Member
May 3, 2012
20,917
https://ria.ru/20250312/kapitulyatsiya-2004448813.html

Ukraine capitulated in Jeddah. But there is a nuance

It is believed that the name of the Saudi city of Jeddah, where the negotiations between the delegations of the United States and Ukraine took place, came from the Arabic word for "grandmother" and indicates the biblical Eve, whose grave is allegedly located there. This time, the grandmother again said twice: there is two news for Russia following the negotiations - good and bad.
You should start with the bad so as not to be disingenuous. The results of the meeting in Jeddah are not very good from the point of view of Russia's interests, and it is impossible to hide it: yesterday Ukraine did not receive military assistance and intelligence information from the United States, today it is receiving it again.

The best outcome would be in the absence of any results, so that the Kyiv guests were stubborn, Donald Trump continued to rage, and Volodymyr Zelensky remained the guy who was to blame for everything for Washington. But now Trump is ready to change his anger to mercy and welcome Zelensky back to Washington, because he believes he has signed up to his terms.


It's not that the situation has suddenly become bad for Russia. I just stopped being perfect. There was a rollback to positions when Zelensky had not yet made a scene in the White House and everyone believed that he had no choice but to agree to Trump's demands. Zelensky himself thought otherwise, went into conflict, was beaten, stood in the corner on peas, realized something for himself and crawled to confess: he sent a letter of apology to Washington and did not interfere with the "breakthrough" in Jeddah. What happened there is really called a breakthrough by Trump.


In fact, Kyiv simply stopped being capricious and agreed to the Americans' demands: to forget about the return of the positions of 2022 - and even more so from 1991 - and accept a 30-day truce with a possible extension, during which humanitarian issues (for example, the exchange of prisoners) will be resolved and consultations on a peace agreement will be held.
This is not yet a defeat for Kyiv, but a radical change in their tactics due to the failure of the previous, knowingly stupid one: to make Trump fall in love with Zelensky. Now, as then, Zelensky does not want peace, but wants to live on the allowance of NATO, wait for the "window of opportunity" (Martian attacks on Russia, for example) and feed the population with unrealistic hopes. He thinks that a rollback to such positions is also possible.

So the game continues. The question is what we are playing.


Trump believes that he is playing cards. "You don't have cards to play," he shouted to Zelensky as he sat across from him. But now what is happening is more like a children's game of sifu: this is a variation of tag, but you need to salt not with your hand, but with an object - a sifa (for example, a ball).

In the White House, Zelensky caught the sifu with his whole body, becoming an outcast and the impossible person who prevents Trump from receiving the Nobel Peace Prize. At the same time, due to the inertia of Zelensky, the European Union was also "sifted", which opened up encouraging prospects for discord within NATO between the United States and the EU.

So far, the prospects have not gone anywhere - Trump has been sent to Brussels for many sins and he has not even begun to sort out the reasons for a conflict with Europe (while tormenting Canada). But the EU took the opportunity to reduce the intensity of passions and clung to the American foot before it really kicked them: Ursula von der Leyen and Emmanuel Macron declared their support for the agreements in Jeddah.

Having accepted Trump's conditions, the Ukrainian delegation beat off the sifu to us. This is what US Secretary of State Marco Rubio means when he says that "the ball is now in Russia's court." It has its own games in its head (specifically, American football), but its rules are also clear: Moscow must either agree to the offer or reject it.
How we reject it will determine Russia's skill as a player in this special diplomatic discipline. It is necessary to contrive and hit the ball into Ukraine so that Zelensky again becomes an obstacle to Trump's Nobel Prize.

There is no question at all that Russia will accept the proposal from Jeddah in its current form. The West and Ukraine are asking in unison to stop hostilities, but their chorus has been demanding this since February 2022 and no one has the right to pretend that they have not heard that Russia has some conditions - the elimination of the reasons for the start of the NWO. In this sense, nothing has changed - all the reasons are in place both on the part of the United States and NATO, whose military infrastructure poses a threat to Russia's security, and on the part of Kyiv. Ukraine has not fulfilled any of the conditions, moreover, it has not declared goodwill that they can be fulfilled. Russia is asked for a truce only on the grounds that its opponent is doing very badly at the front.

Trump was wrong when he said that Zelensky had no cards left: the ataman planned to use the occupied part of the Kursk region of Russia as a "trump card" in the negotiations. But since then, the Russian army has almost knocked this "trump card" out of the hands of the enemy - only a small piece remains. In order to save at least this piece, Ukraine agrees to an immediate ceasefire. Kiev understands that this is not a serious proposal for Moscow, but they themselves accept it only in the hope that the US president will switch his anger to Moscow.
With all due respect – but who plays like that? No matter how much Trump is in a hurry, the only realistic way to end the conflict is dozens and hundreds of meetings of negotiating teams with tedious agreement on each point of the peace agreement. This is not a special whim, it has always worked this way. For example, negotiations in Paris to end the Vietnam War lasted four years.

It will be necessary to convey to Trump information about the real scale of the problems standing in the way of peace gently, so that this does not become a blow to his optimistic nature. It is always unpleasant to inform a person that his proposal cannot be implemented due to mistrust and bitter experience gained when Kiev and the collective West deceived Russia, which made concessions. But Trump must understand, because it's not about him, but about the bad people who came before him (he warmly agrees that they are bad), and with him everything will be completely different, but there is still a lot to be done to restore trust between the countries and Russia is ready for such joint activities.

As for the second, good news, Trump's shift of attention from Zelensky to Moscow has come at a great cost to Kiev and has brought Ukraine closer to the degree of despair after which peace will actually be possible.
Due to inflated expectations, Ukrainians are now immersed in despondency and feel betrayed. The agreement of the delegation in Jeddah to a truce is just a maneuver, but the very conduct of such a maneuver contradicts what propaganda has been instilling for three years. Yesterday it was stated that accepting Trump's conditions is the capitulation of Ukraine. Now the conditions have been accepted, and they are worse than before the quarrel in the White House, since the US treaty on rare earth metals will be rewritten in its favor. It turns out that Ukraine has capitulated? It turns out so.
Shock, anger, fear, confusion - all this is now being experienced by a country to which no one can explain what kind of "betrayal" or, conversely, "victory" happened: the propagandists themselves are shocked, and the manuals have not yet arrived. This makes it easier for Russia to continue working to achieve its goals. For her, stress in the ranks of the enemy has its own nuance.
Yes, Ukraine capitulated in Jeddah – shameful, although predictable for everyone who did not believe Zelensky and the Ukrainian media. But she capitulated to the President of the United States. Ukraine's capitulation to the States as a whole, from Russia's point of view, took place back in 2014 and was formalized by breaking cookies with Victoria Nuland, so nothing fundamentally new happened in Jeddah.
The capitulation of Ukraine (not so much to Russia, but to reality), which can really put an end to our ethno-political conflict, is yet to come. And, since we are talking about games, it will be easy to recognize it by the Russian cry "Goal!".

best part again:
How we reject it will determine Russia's skill as a player in this special diplomatic discipline. It is necessary to contrive and hit the ball into Ukraine so that Zelensky again becomes an obstacle to Trump's Nobel Prize.

russia in a nutshell for you.
Trump’s nobel prize lol.
 

Ronn

Senior Member
May 3, 2012
20,917
Obama has one, so he obviously wants one. Tbf, if he ends the Russia Ukraine war, he’d have done more to deserve one than whatever the fuck Obama did to deserve his.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Obama prize will forever be a stain. He essentially won it by not being GWB. But Trump winning it by saying Ukraine started the war and tells a president whose country is under occupation “You hold no cards” would be pure vomit.
 

icemaη

Rab's Husband - The Regista
Moderator
Aug 27, 2008
36,375
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Obama prize will forever be a stain. He essentially won it by not being GWB. But Trump winning it by saying Ukraine started the war and tells a president whose country is under occupation “You hold no cards” would be pure vomit.
I don’t disagree at all
 

s4tch

Senior Member
Mar 23, 2015
33,886
"russia want peace", newest chapter:



if trump has ANY integrity left then he has to be true to his words, start sanctioning russia and provide all intelligence and military support to ukraine. even his corrupt, delusional brain should understand that russia won't stop until they are stopped. just crush their economy, it's a relatively easy target.
 
OP
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
116,251
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #8,877
    Just crossed Russian newswires

    "KREMLIN CALLED COMPLETE END OF FOREIGN MILITARY AID AND INTELLIGENCE TO Kyiv THE KEY CONDITION FOR RESOLVING THE CONFLICT IN UKRAINE PEACEFULLY"

    So Russia demanded Trump end military and intel support to Ukraine
     

    s4tch

    Senior Member
    Mar 23, 2015
    33,886
    Just crossed Russian newswires

    "KREMLIN CALLED COMPLETE END OF FOREIGN MILITARY AID AND INTELLIGENCE TO Kyiv THE KEY CONDITION FOR RESOLVING THE CONFLICT IN UKRAINE PEACEFULLY"

    So Russia demanded Trump end military and intel support to Ukraine
    the "peacefully" part is adorable
     

    s4tch

    Senior Member
    Mar 23, 2015
    33,886
    so putin made trump wait, "agreed" to a partial ceasefire, waited until donnie posted his little victory about the successful talks, then still attacked sloviansk's energy infrastructure

    he's laughing at trump and that dumb orange cuck will do nothing about it. bully the weak, break the laws, bow down to dictators, this is trump getting shit done. what an absolute failure
     

    s4tch

    Senior Member
    Mar 23, 2015
    33,886
    Trump administration halts program to track abducted Ukrainian children, lawmakers say | Reuters

    "They took $26 million of U.S. taxpayers money used for war crimes data and threw it into the woodchipper, including the dossiers on all the children," the person said.

    "If you wanted to protect President Putin from prosecution, you nuke that thing. And they did it. It’s the final court-admissible version with all the metadata," the source said.


    trump's murica, everyone. this is both governmental waste and treason. putin couldn't do anything else differently if he was the president himself. once again, there's literal blood on trump's hands. and when imbeciles say that "you're not living in america", it's not hard to see how trump's activity directly affects other people's lives. even if the war ended today, thousands of ukrainian kids will be much, much harder, if not impossible to locate

    once again, it was complete instanity to elect trump. the world is simply a shittier place now, and he's been in office for barely 2 months only
     

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