Platini : If I Were UEFA President... (2 Viewers)

sateeh

Day Walker
Jul 28, 2003
8,020
mikhail said:
Very much. Strictly amateur though, which partially explains why you lot keep beating up our players when we play compromise rules.
:D, i didnt you guys didnt have a pro league there. I thought thats why some players from Ireland were brought here to play in the Afl.
Anyway saw some clips from the game and the fans certainly didnt care if that sport was practised amateurely or not. They just wanted to rip our player's heads off

@Jack- football lost its way a long time ago imo. I just dealt and dealing with it.
 

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JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
123,580
mikhail said:
Says a Lebonese fan of an Italian 'big club'? :rolleyes:
You never asked me if I support a Lebanese team. And then again this proves my point, an Italian 'big club' is what I was exposed to. Cheers for proving my point even more :pint:
 
Sep 28, 2002
13,975
Jun-hide said:
Well I am not exactly sure as to which exact format the tournament should take but what I do know is that the current way in which teams gather up in Japan for couple of matches isnt plausible. The same goes for basketball as well. Its just not possible that us locals can generate as much passion as the home supporters if the game was played in a 2 leg home-away format.

Fli makes a good point though. Anyway tournament that tries to incorporate as much teams as possible is bound to have problem with the toll travelling takes. But then again, when you see teams like Real, Man U, Bayern, Fiorentina and even Juve (I had a pleasure of seeing Alex doing some timed trickery stuff prepared by the newcasters ditto for Aimar :D ) come to Japan for promotional purposes then one must wonder if they really are concerned about travelling that much if they can get marketing exposure. After all, South American players seem to manage fine in Europe considering the fact that they go back and forth for WC matches. And most teams in Europe nowadays operate on a rotational basis anyway. The matter of fact is if European teams will have far more significant monetary benefits if one can actually arrange both Asian, European and South American teams to play in a competition that actually matters. This will be far more effective than meaningless pre-season matches they come in for and loose for whatever reasons. In case of Real, they sure became a laughing stock for a while. Getting thrased to relegation threatened Verdy was just an icing on the cake.:D

So my conclusion is that teams really dont matter about travelling that much as long as they believe they can get compensated for it. Moreover, I don't really see a significant drop off in quality of games played due to travelling. If anything else, I think Europeans could be surprised by the qualities in the other continents and over time one should actually see a convergence between leagues.

My best idea is that CL place should be somewhat expanded and allocated on the basis of past results achieved by each respective continent in world events. In a similar fashion to the oen currently operated by UEFA, which Erik kindly elucidiated, we can keep in check the balance between quality and diversity. Obviously this means that only one or two teams will get the chance to participate in Asia, Africa and North America, and a few more South American teams. We can even put pit these continents against each other to ensure quality of matches doesnt get degraded too much. The looser of this group get to participate in UEFA Cup. In doing so, I feel we should also limit the maximum number of teams in each nation, especially in Italia, Spain and England, since 4th place teams exactly world-beaters by any means and if teams in South America could get enough revenues to sustain its stars, I actually feel teams like Sao Paulo and Internacional, Boca Juniors will be better than Liverpool, Depor, and Fiorentina. Just look at Sevilla and Villareal - half of their players are from South America and apart from few exceptional ones - I bet there are many of equal perhaps even superior quality that hasnt come to Europe yet.

I am kind of favoring the extension of the current format and probably making some expansion of teams at the preliminary rounds to the other continents based on the international coefficients by each continent. I know FIFA won't allow UEFA to dictate the pace of global tournament moreover if UEFA has desire to do so, but this format is vastly superior to the one that is going to be played in a short time. And I think it is almost undebatable the general value of having world-wide club tournament.
they travel overseas to play some irrelevant friendly games, where dont even try. when they have to travel to tokyo one week and to sao paulo the next, to play the games that actually do matter it would be much more difficult. sure, clubs will get their revenues from that. but will the players last?


and you propose what dislike probably the most about otdays football. more commercialization.
 

mikhail

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2003
9,576
Jeeks said:
If you don't give them a chance to participate, year in year out, they will never be good enough. They will only fall out in the stupid qualifying round that has absolutely no significant TV coverage, no revenews and nothing.
Having watch Shelbourne, Derry, Cork, et al struggle in these stages, I have to say that:
1) Yes, it brings in revenue. A lot of it, given the budgets of those teams. Give them more? NOOOO! That'd kill my national league, make a Rosenborg to piss all over the rest of them. So you'd get no competition in Europe and no competition domestically, and the big leagues, having just one slot or whatever, will also become monopolised by one team with all the money.
2) It has TV coverage, but it fits the audience. Small teams are covered by stations with interested audiences.
3) It means a lot to the fans. Getting to the second qualifying stage means more to a Derry fan than getting to the quarter final means to a Juve fan. You can piss on their acheivement if you like, sneer at how inconsequential it is, but it does mean something.
 

JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
123,580
sateeh said:
@Jack- football lost its way a long time ago imo. I just dealt and dealing with it.
I am dealing with it unfortunately, the whole discussion was that I wanted the old CL format and Seven insists on the marketing campaign we see every two weeks is better. I feel sorry for him because he is young and is also a UEFA victim.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
38,288
mikhail said:
Having watch Shelbourne, Derry, Cork, et al struggle in these stages, I have to say that:
1) Yes, it brings in revenue. A lot of it, given the budgets of those teams. Give them more? NOOOO! That'd kill my national league, make a Rosenborg to piss all over the rest of them. So you'd get no competition in Europe and no competition domestically, and the big leagues, having just one slot or whatever, will also become monopolised by one team with all the money.
2) It has TV coverage, but it fits the audience. Small teams are covered by stations with interested audiences.
3) It means a lot to the fans. Getting to the second qualifying stage means more to a Derry fan than getting to the quarter final means to a Juve fan. You can piss on their acheivement if you like, sneer at how inconsequential it is, but it does mean something.
Yep.
 

JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
123,580
mikhail said:
Having watch Shelbourne, Derry, Cork, et al struggle in these stages, I have to say that:
1) Yes, it brings in revenue. A lot of it, given the budgets of those teams. Give them more? NOOOO! That'd kill my national league, make a Rosenborg to piss all over the rest of them. So you'd get no competition in Europe and no competition domestically, and the big leagues, having just one slot or whatever, will also become monopolised by one team with all the money.
2) It has TV coverage, but it fits the audience. Small teams are covered by stations with interested audiences.
3) It means a lot to the fans. Getting to the second qualifying stage means more to a Derry fan than getting to the quarter final means to a Juve fan. You can piss on their acheivement if you like, sneer at how inconsequential it is, but it does mean something.
It does mean something and it can mean more!!

If a Derry fans is as happy as a Juve fan in your example, how happy will he be if they reach the 1/16th of the cup and play Real Madrid instead of Fiorentina? You don't have to answer that was rhetorical.

The TV coverage you talked about exists, but how much are Heineken and Playstation throwing money there compared to a Liverpool - Roma game? it cannot be compared. Who gains more money? The 4th placed team in England and the 4th placed team in Italy and they can do that again and again year in year out and Ireland's Champion will only gain the measly amount gained by reaching the second qualifying round.

Just keep on doing that for a certain period of time, you are a mathematician and you know about logarithmic scales. In a matter of years many teams will just disappear and make the likes of Seven happier.
 

JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
123,580
Seven said:
They don't disappear thanks to the CL. They disappear because they fuck up financially.
It is only Real Madrid, Barcelona, Valencia, Villarreal, Manchester United, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, Milan, Inter, Roma, Juventus, Bayern München, Ajax and Lyon that are good at managing money. All the others are just morons that will end up bankrupt. :faq1:
 

sateeh

Day Walker
Jul 28, 2003
8,020
Jeeks said:
I am dealing with it unfortunately, the whole discussion was that I wanted the old CL format and Seven insists on the marketing campaign we see every two weeks is better. I feel sorry for him because he is young and is also a UEFA victim.
for me, although i always like the big games.Especially the rivalries in Europe.
But both sides make a valid point here and well on one had u run the risk of decreasing the quality of the games and make less people interested in it.
The smaller teams could be competitave in Europe however that would take at least 5-10 years. Their fans will wait but will the other millions and millions wait? i dont think so, so this would lead to some of the thing John mentioned.

Another thing is that i still think that if there r good enough teams then they could make it to the elite. Watever the format is , if some team is good enough they could make it.Villareal made it last year and this year we have one russian team that causing havoc.

finally a question, if the G-14 break away and create their competition then what will happen to this one and all the smaller teams in europe ? they would just be right where they r and could be worse.
 

JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
123,580
sateeh said:
for me, although i always like the big games.Especially the rivalries in Europe.
But both sides make a valid point here and well on one had u run the risk of decreasing the quality of the games and make less people interested in it.
The smaller teams could be competitave in Europe however that would take at least 5-10 years. Their fans will wait but will the other millions and millions wait? i dont think so, so this would lead to some of the thing John mentioned.

Another thing is that i still think that if there r good enough teams then they could make it to the elite. Watever the format is , if some team is good enough they could make it.Villareal made it last year and this year we have one russian team that causing havoc.

finally a question, if the G-14 break away and create their competition then what will happen to this one and all the smaller teams in europe ? they would just be right where they r and could be worse.
It is all up to which organization can raise more sponsor money that make the simple minded fall into their campaigns; that organization would host a "better" competition. Either way the poor teams (I refuse to call them small and poor just because I compare them to others) will be getting poorer and nearing vanishing.
 
Sep 28, 2002
13,975
sateeh said:
for me, although i always like the big games.Especially the rivalries in Europe.
But both sides make a valid point here and well on one had u run the risk of decreasing the quality of the games and make less people interested in it.
The smaller teams could be competitave in Europe however that would take at least 5-10 years. Their fans will wait but will the other millions and millions wait? i dont think so, so this would lead to some of the thing John mentioned.

Another thing is that i still think that if there r good enough teams then they could make it to the elite. Watever the format is , if some team is good enough they could make it.Villareal made it last year and this year we have one russian team that causing havoc.

finally a question, if the G-14 break away and create their competition then what will happen to this one and all the smaller teams in europe ? they would just be right where they r and could be worse.
g-14 would fail. some teams few years ago threatened to break away from fia and how did that end. oh yeah, foot iin a mouth
 

JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
123,580
Fliakis said:
you know where should uefa look? to the fa cup. by far the most interesting cup in the world.
Why? Because a team from England's second division can beat the Premiership leader? What a bad image for football!! Why does a team from the second division even bother play? Seven won't watch the game.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
38,288
Jeeks said:
Why? Because a team from England's second division can beat the Premiership leader? What a bad image for football!! Why does a team from the second division even bother play? Seven won't watch the game.
How many second division teams ever won the FA cup?
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
38,288
Jeeks said:
It is only Real Madrid, Barcelona, Valencia, Villarreal, Manchester United, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, Milan, Inter, Roma, Juventus, Bayern München, Ajax and Lyon that are good at managing money. All the others are just morons that will end up bankrupt. :faq1:
They are if they assume they'll reach the CL semi-finals and adjust to that thought.
 

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