OK..You all knew this topic was coming eventually (14 Viewers)

[GRK]

++ [ originally posted by Nicole ] ++
Definiltely, I heard on the news that another hurricane was seen off the US coast apparently its heading right for Hugh Hefner

Nice.

 

Buy on AliExpress.com

[Amash]

++ [ originally posted by Bürke ] ++
There is no God.

Can u proove it???

 

[Tifoso]

OK.

Every thing that's in being now, came from something else, right?
(For example, you're your parents' son).

Now, being a rational person, you obviously believe that everything that is in being now, came from something? (ie, again, you, from your parents).

So everything that gave being to everything now, had to in turn come from something, and so on until you reach the first thing.

Now, by definition, that 1st thing can't have been created (ie, there can't be anything before the 1st thing, by definition).

So that 1st thing is completely unique--everything that is in being is derived from it, yet it is derived from nothing but itself.

Now, every "creation" (ie, you, again, for example) took place in time (had to: because there is a "before" and an "after" it existed)--again except that 1st one.


So, to summarize:

1.It is the source of everything else
2.It is the only uncreated thing
3.It is the only thing that existed (I would argue exists) outside of time.


Sounds like a pretty good definition of God to me.

 

[Amash]

I'm not competent to give any definition of God because I'm just one in row and I'm nothing compared to the Cherisher and Sustainer of the worlds so I can't comment your definition

 

[Tifoso]

++ [ originally posted by Amash ] ++
I'm not competent to give any definition of God because I'm just one in row and I'm nothing compared to the Cherisher and Sustainer of the worlds so I can't comment your definition

Fair enough, amico mio.

 

[Amash]

++ [ originally posted by Tifoso Lou ] ++


Fair enough, amico mio.

I'm glad u understand me

 

[Zlatan]

++ [ originally posted by Tifoso Lou ] ++


Ahhh, then I've convinced you that Bush is a good guy?

Please dont tell me you voted for him.

++ [ originally posted by Amash ] ++


Can u proove it???

Can you prove there is?

++ [ originally posted by Tifoso Lou ] ++
OK.

Every thing that's in being now, came from something else, right?
(For example, you're your parents' son).

Now, being a rational person, you obviously believe that everything that is in being now, came from something? (ie, again, you, from your parents).

So everything that gave being to everything now, had to in turn come from something, and so on until you reach the first thing.

Now, by definition, that 1st thing can't have been created (ie, there can't be anything before the 1st thing, by definition).

So that 1st thing is completely unique--everything that is in being is derived from it, yet it is derived from nothing but itself.

Now, every "creation" (ie, you, again, for example) took place in time (had to: because there is a "before" and an "after" it existed)--again except that 1st one.


So, to summarize:

1.It is the source of everything else
2.It is the only uncreated thing
3.It is the only thing that existed (I would argue exists) outside of time.


Sounds like a pretty good definition of God to me.

I disagree with your analisys. You're applying the sets of logic for the same situation. If God could have existed without being created, there is absolutely no reason why something else could have existed without being created by God.

And BTW, even if there is a god whats to say that he even cares what happens to us?

 

[Amash]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++

And BTW, even if there is a god whats to say that he even cares what happens to us?

Haha that is the stupidest thing I ever heard. So in your theory if there is God( I belive there is) we all would be wealthy and healty and etc ???

 

[Zlatan]

++ [ originally posted by Amash ] ++


Haha that is the stupidest thing I ever heard. So in your theory if there is God( I belive there is) we all would be wealthy and healty and etc ???

No, actually thats not what I am saying, altho it would only be fair that God creates equal opportunities for all.

What I am saying, even if there is some God, some higher being that created us, who's to say that he cares what happens to us, that he looks at what we do, that he controls our lives, or that he determines what will happen to us when we die?

 

[Tifoso]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++





I disagree with your analisys. You're applying the sets of logic for the same situation. If God could have existed without being created, there is absolutely no reason why something else could have existed without being created by God.

And BTW, even if there is a god whats to say that he even cares what happens to us?

The greatest minds in the world (atheists, or at least agnostics included) have considered the logic brilliant, actually (it isn't mine, BTW)

Do me a favor. Read Thomas Aquinas' Summa Theologica (get the abridged one volume version---the unanbriged one goes to many volumes).
The argument is his.

I am very impressed (I don't mean that to sound condescending, OK?).

You are absolutely right, of course. The proof I posted proves the existance of a creator God, but that's it. Aquinas goes further to prove the existance of a loving God. Read it. He is probably the greatest mind of the 1st 1000 years of Christianity (some would argue ever).

 

[GordoDeCentral]

I really shouldnt get into this but i am waitin on a friend so what the hell... your concept of fairness is skewed on both a temporal and spatial level ... ooh fug it he's here will talk about it later, going to the sox games pray for them soooooox

 

[Tifoso]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++



No, actually thats not what I am saying, altho it would only be fair that God creates equal opportunities for all.

What I am saying, even if there is some God, some higher being that created us, who's to say that he cares what happens to us, that he looks at what we do, that he controls our lives, or that he determines what will happen to us when we die?

Calvary.

 

[Tifoso]

++ [ originally posted by Altair ] ++
I really shouldnt get into this but i am waitin on a friend so what the hell... your concept of fairness is skewed on both a temporal and spatial level ... ooh fug it he's here will talk about it later, going to the sox games pray for them soooooox

White or Red?

 

[Amash]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++



No, actually thats not what I am saying, altho it would only be fair that God creates equal opportunities for all.

What I am saying, even if there is some God, some higher being that created us, who's to say that he cares what happens to us, that he looks at what we do, that he controls our lives, or that he determines what will happen to us when we die?

He gave us directions and gave us free will so we can live by His directions or we can live by our or anybody elses directions. He doesen't control our lives because we are all creators of ours fortune.

 

[Amash]

++ [ originally posted by Zlatan ] ++

altho it would only be fair that God creates equal opportunities for all.

Man God isn't comunist

 

[Tifoso]

++ [ originally posted by Amash ] ++


He gave us directions and gave us free will so we can live by His directions or we can live by our or anybody elses directions. He doesen't control our lives because we are all creators of ours fortune.

Exactly.

He gives us all free will. Upside: a human being is not a robot. Downside: someone can choose to shoot you (as happened to me).

 

[Seven]

++ [ originally posted by Tifoso Lou ] ++



He is no "dumber" than any other politician: he was a high C average student in college---ie, average.

I find it a tad distasteful to see people here bashing the leader of my country. You don't see me bashing yours.

Just sayin...

Let's be fair, Bush is a ****ing moron. Simply no question about that.

 

[Tifoso]

++ [ originally posted by Seven ] ++


Let's be fair, Bush is a ****ing moron. Simply no question about that.

53 million American voters (and many others to boot) would disagree.

My last post on the subject.

 

[Seven]

++ [ originally posted by Tifoso Lou ] ++


The greatest minds in the world (atheists, or at least agnostics included) have considered the logic brilliant, actually (it isn't mine, BTW)

Do me a favor. Read Thomas Aquinas' Summa Theologica (get the abridged one volume version---the unanbriged one goes to many volumes).
The argument is his.

I am very impressed (I don't mean that to sound condescending, OK?).

You are absolutely right, of course. The proof I posted proves the existance of a creator God, but that's it. Aquinas goes further to prove the existance of a loving God. Read it. He is probably the greatest mind of the 1st 1000 years of Christianity (some would argue ever).

Thomas Aquinas? Get your names right, friend. If you're going to act all cool about it at least name him Thomas from Aquino.

 

[Amash]

++ [ originally posted by Seven ] ++


Thomas Aquinas? Get your names right, friend.

It doesen't metter at all