Non-Juve Transfer news (official or rumors) (11 Viewers)

[Alin]

It doesn't matter as long as they are the best team in the world.

There are arguably at least five(if not more) other top managers that do not get the same hype and sugarcoating but which could have achieved similar results if they had the same squads and resources that have been available to Pep, maybe not as entertaining or pretty(and naive lol) as he made City now however on the other hand somebody else could have been perhaps more pragmatic and might’ve just as well done better overall in europe in that same time span.

 

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[Hist]

It doesn't matter as long as they are the best team in the world.

Well he has dominated the EPL at its prime level for so long and will likely to continue. That "he hasn't won the CL therefore is a failure" argument is a bit rich especially coming from a Juventus fan.

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There are arguably at least five(if not more) other top managers that do not get the same hype and sugarcoating but which could have achieved similar results if they had the same squads and resources that have been available to Pep, maybe not as entertaining or pretty(and naive lol) as he made City now however on the other hand somebody else could have been perhaps more pragmatic and might’ve just as well done better overall in europe in that same time span.

Who?

Let's not pretend any of the big English 4 are broke. They all spend like there is no tomorrow yet only one of them is dominating the league for half a decade. Klopp's Liverpool who've won the CL and were runner ups in that period managed to snatch one League title out of 5 from him.

 

[Alin]

Who?

Let's not pretend any of the big English 4 are broke. They all spend like there is no tomorrow yet only one of them is dominating the league for half a decade. Klopp's Liverpool who've won the CL and were runner ups in that period managed to snatch one League title out of 5 from him.

You are comparing apples with pineapples tbh, the broken Liverpool team inherited by Klopp and the already there world class players and winning team inherited by Pep at City and the handpicked choice of players no matter the price that followed, also almost double the invested money on the market in the same time span compared to Klopp, while in the same time ManUTD has been a circus just as Arsenal and Tottenham for large parts, with only Chelsea being the other really worthwile challenger.

I am not saying just about anyone would have done better or at least similar in terms of results and number of trophies with the same handpicked world class players and resources available, but i’m pretty sure the likes of Conte, Ancelotti, Allegri , Tuchel, Klopp to name a few would not have fared that much worse at all overall in the same time span.

 

[Ronn]

Who's Borna Sosa?

 

[JCK]

Well he has dominated the EPL at its prime level for so long and will likely to continue. That "he hasn't won the CL therefore is a failure" argument is a bit rich especially coming from a Juventus fan.

Did I mention anything about the CL or failure?

I am not concerned about the PL. The last time I bothered watch a match or two there was at least 12 years ago.

 

[Hist]

You are comparing apples with pineapples tbh, the broken Liverpool team inherited by Klopp and the already there world class players and winning team inherited by Pep at City and the handpicked choice of players no matter the price that followed, also almost double the invested money on the market in the same time span compared to Klopp, while in the same time ManUTD has been a circus just as Arsenal and Tottenham for large parts, with only Chelsea being the other really worthwile challenger.

I am not saying just about anyone would have done better or at least similar in terms of results and number of trophies with the same handpicked world class players and resources available, but i’m pretty sure the likes of Conte, Ancelotti, Allegri , Tuchel, Klopp to name a few would not have fared that much worse at all overall in the same time span.

Tuchel and Klopp are there already and are spending big buying players left and right. Neither have been able to keep their teams performing with that consistency over multiple seasons. Ancellotti & Conte had their runs in the EPL both at Chelsea which is far from a poor club and neither could sustain their teams at the top for more than a season.

He is not dominating a broke league or a once great league going through a rough time. He is having Fergie level dominance in the EPL at its peak going against great coaches and multiple teams with open budgets. Not an easy feat unless you think anyone could have done what Lippi did for us.

Are they spending big to sustain this dominance? absolutely. And that was true of United in the Ferguson era, of Juve in the Lippi & Allegri era and of Bayern is every era.

https://www.transfermarkt.us/premier-league/fuenfjahresvergleich/wettbewerb/GB1#subnavi

^ their net spending over the last 5 years is not anomalous in the EPL. The key difference is that they spend on the right players who fit into their system as every dominant team in a top league does.

FWIW Juve is the richest club in Italy by a long margin and have been for a decade now. But we are acting more like United and less like City. You're taking local dominance for granted when we know too well at Juve both by our past (afterall Juve is actually famous for owning Italy) and by our sordid present of failing despite our riches.

 

[Alin]

Tuchel and Klopp are there already and are spending big buying players left and right. Neither have been able to keep their teams performing with that consistency over multiple seasons. Ancellotti & Conte had their runs in the EPL both at Chelsea which is far from a poor club and neither could sustain their teams at the top for more than a season.

He is not dominating a broke league or a once great league going through a rough time. He is having Fergie level dominance in the EPL at its peak going against great coaches and multiple teams with open budgets. Not an easy feat unless you think anyone could have done what Lippi did for us.

Are they spending big to sustain this dominance? absolutely. And that was true of United in the Ferguson era, of Juve in the Lippi & Allegri era and of Bayern is every era.

https://www.transfermarkt.us/premier-league/fuenfjahresvergleich/wettbewerb/GB1#subnavi

^ their net spending over the last 5 years is not anomalous in the EPL. The key difference is that they spend on the right players who fit into their system as every dominant team in a top league does.

Tuchel can’t be compared as he only started this last two summers to spend big and time will tell if the UCL win was just a fluke or if he will get Chelsea back to challenging again, altough he has been pretty solid otherwise… however Pep had like four or five other similar summers to splash in, also again, Klopp hasn’t spent half of what Pep did while at the same time not having already a squad comprising of world class players and if you really want to get into it deeper and to further debunk your bs Guardiola narrative in which he is some genius miracle maker and that everyone else been overspending on expensive handpicked players just as him(many other dominating team examples you mentioned usually didnt have a manager handpicking worldclass players as he pleases with unlimited funds), and also when he came to City he already had players like DeBruyne, David Silva, Aguero, Sane, Sterling , Feenandinho, Yaya Toure , Kompany etc waiting, all of them there aside from the multiple investments made personally for him since joining them.

As i mentioned before, few can say to have been as fortunate and with so much power of decision and handpicking, maybe only Ferguson comes close in some sense, but even he didn’t have nearly the same unlimited funds to splash either while also not having it all served on a platter to him.

 

[AFL_ITALIA]

90m and he won’t even join this season

This sport is dying.

 

[Osman]

Can you imagine that phone call to RB Leipzig HQ?

"Ja, so you mean you will double our 45m valuation, and let me get this right ja, 90m and we get to keep him for another year?"

 

[Bianconero81]

Who's Borna Sosa?

6"2 24 year-old Croatian LB/LW who plays for Stuttgart.

 

[Hist]

Tuchel can’t be compared as he only started this last two summers to spend big and time will tell if the UCL win was just a fluke or if he will get Chelsea back to challenging again, altough he has been pretty solid otherwise… however Pep had like four or five other similar summers to splash in, also again, Klopp hasn’t spent half of what Pep did while at the same time not having already a squad comprising of world class players and if you really want to get into it deeper and to further debunk your bs Guardiola narrative in which he is some genius miracle maker and that everyone else been overspending on expensive handpicked players just as him(many other dominating team examples you mentioned usually didnt have a manager handpicking worldclass players as he pleases with unlimited funds), and also when he came to City he already had players like DeBruyne, David Silva, Aguero, Sane, Sterling , Feenandinho, Yaya Toure , Kompany etc waiting, all of them there aside from the multiple investments made personally for him since joining them.

As i mentioned before, few can say to have been as fortunate and with so much power of decision and handpicking, maybe only Ferguson comes close in some sense, but even he didn’t have nearly the same unlimited funds to splash either while also not having it all served on a platter to him.

Look at the net spend over the last 5 years. His City is right there with many others. City has done brilliantly on the market and part of that is because the coach has a clear idea of his football and buys players that fit the style. The players he inherited that remained all hit their highest levels in their careers under him. Everyone that didnt fit his football was given the boot. Mancini and Pellegrini didnt dominate despite the open checkbook themselves and back then they actually used to outspend everyone.

His main strength is continuity and consistency. His teams play his style of football week in week out at incredible consistency and thats why they're so difficult to beat for a league title. Thats why City is now considered the default favorite for any league season before it starts. Thats no fluke he did the same at Barcelona and Bayern. Pep = very specific style of attacking football + incredible consistency. Thats his brand and thats what he does better than anyone else. Players used to go to City for the paycheck in the past, now they choose City for the football i.e to compete at the highest level and win the best league in the world. City is stable at the top.

If by miracle worker you mean a coach that can surprise as an underdog every now and then, then I agree thats not his brand at all and he'd probably never need to go to a club that would be considered an underdog and/or work on a tight budget. Thats not luck or fortune, he earned it by delivering success and stability right from the start of his career really. Say you are in City's shoes or Newcastle's you have funds and you want to establish yourself as a stable top team, you're telling me you'd rather hire Tuchel or Allegri?

Ofc any reasonable person would go for the tried and tested Pep. Only Klopp comes close in the stability of his team and they usually fall just an inch short of City

 

[Alin]

Look at the net spend over the last 5 years. His City is right there with many others. City has done brilliantly on the market and part of that is because the coach has a clear idea of his football and buys players that fit the style. The players he inherited that remained all hit their highest levels in their careers under him. Everyone that didnt fit his football was given the boot. Mancini and Pellegrini didnt dominate despite the open checkbook themselves and back then they actually used to outspend everyone.

His main strength is continuity and consistency. His teams play his style of football week in week out at incredible consistency and thats why they're so difficult to beat for a league title. Thats why City is now considered the default favorite for any league season before it starts. Thats no fluke he did the same at Barcelona and Bayern. Pep = very specific style of attacking football + incredible consistency. Thats his brand and thats what he does better than anyone else. Players used to go to City for the paycheck in the past, now they choose City for the football i.e to compete at the highest level and win the best league in the world. City is stable at the top.

If by miracle worker you mean a coach that can surprise as an underdog every now and then, then I agree thats not his brand at all and he'd probably never need to go to a club that would be considered an underdog and/or work on a tight budget. Thats not luck or fortune, he earned it by delivering success and stability right from the start of his career really. Say you are in City's shoes or Newcastle's you have funds and you want to establish yourself as a stable top team, you're telling me you'd rather hire Tuchel or Allegri?

Ofc any reasonable person would go for the tried and tested Pep. Only Klopp comes close in the stability of his team and they usually fall just an inch short of City

No amount of hyping and moving goalposts attempts from you will change the fact he still is a very fortunate overrated manager that had the chance to work with only teams fully stacked with world class players and that were already teams capable of winning their domestic leagues and also to seriously compete in Europe and even so somehow managed to lose a PL title to Conte and another one to Klopp while both had inferior squads and resources and at the same time still got humiliated in Europe by the likes of Lyon, Tottenham and Monaco… Nobody saying he is not a good manager overall, just massively overrated and overhyped despite failing miserably in Europe while not doing anything all that spectacular domestically when he has such a stacked world class squad and power of decision.

My main point was and still stands that there are plenty of other top managers that could’ve achieved similar results and trophies in that same time span if they had the same resources and squad that Pep had available, nobody else comes even close in terms of power of decision and cherry picking on who joins and who leaves, maybe might have not been as pretty and entertaining with someone else but it sure as hell would’ve been just as efficient.

The argument you keep pushing is not even the one i am talking about here and the biggest argument would be trying to picture him how he would have done starting a rebuild at a Atletico, Liverpool or even Juventus without those unlimited handpicked resources available to him, but with still quite decent budgets tho just with not as much power of decision, which untill proven otherwise we can just assume he would have been at best a Sarri or Emery level manager in the sense that a lot of new ideas and entertaining football philosophy but without the world class players all over the pitch bailing him out card and even less application and efficiency to his ‘ideas’… also you do realize that starting your first big job and being succesfull at a stacked Barcelona which had the likes of Messi, Xavi , Iniesta, Eto’o, Henry, Dani Alves, Puyol etc does help quite a lot in building up your reputation and therefore gives him an advantage over every other manager from the get go, despite not necessarily achieving any miracle with them either, but rather what was expected, which not the same can be said about his stint neither at Bayern and less so at City where he was given even more money and power in the decision making.


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You know what? I’ve really had enough of this bs non-Juve related debate and we clearly ain’t getting anywhere, already deviated quite a bit from the main point of discussion, i only answered initially because you seemed to say that there aren’t at least five other top managers that could have done a pretty similar job with the same resources but whom overall do not get the same hype and protection from the media, to which i think i was pretty clear about that there are probably even more than just five that are up for the task if they had been given the same resources, now other than this if you want to go on and support Guardiola you are free to go ahead and do it, just keep me out of it.

 

[Bianconero_Aus]

This sport is dying.

It’s already dead to me.

I can’t wait until the whole thing totally collapses tbh. It’s a filthy disgusting sport and if it wasn’t for my irrational love of our stupid club, I would have given up on this rotten sport years ago.

 

[Boksic]

90m and he won’t even join this season

But we made a good deal with De Ligt apparently

 

[Xperd]

But we made a good deal with De Ligt apparently

We got mugged like a typical Bundesliga team

 

[AFL_ITALIA]

It’s already dead to me.

I can’t wait until the whole thing totally collapses tbh. It’s a filthy disgusting sport and if it wasn’t for my irrational love of our stupid club, I would have given up on this rotten sport years ago.

MLS is going to have to keep the dream alive, even with no promotion/relegation and an unfortunate playoff system

 

[PhRoZeN]

Ajax are getting shafted by EPL, they are struggling to get a replacement for Antony and their talented youngster Kudus is refusing to turn up to training like Antony, and using the same tactic to force a move out to Everton.

Of course they'll get plenty of cash but it couldn't have happened to a nicer club.

 

[Osman]

Shafted? They got 160m for two replaceable players.

 

[PhRoZeN]

Shafted? They got 160m for two replaceable players.

Financially great, Ajax rarely go wrong. I just love how its affected them buying replacements and methods used by their players to push their way out to greener EPL pastures.

 

[Osman]

They replaced Martinez with Bassey. Quite good young defender.


And Antony with Ocampos for cheap.


They wanted to sign Ziyech back, who is better then Antony in Ajax, and ofcourse better then Ocampos, but Chelsea asked for 40-50m lol. So Ajax passed. They will wait for Chelsea to get desperate to sell in near future instead.


But yeah its an issue if players try the avoid training tactic to force sale. Tho its sad if said player is doing it to go to an Everton that will for sure relegate.

But they don't even need to replace Kudus, does he even start?