'Murica! (258 Viewers)

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,342
Interesting analysis of Donald Trump I found posted elsewhere:

Notice that every time he takes a strong position on something - it's the strongest and the most extreme one he can take without actually getting totally stumped

Deportation of illegals, The Wall, China muslim ban now serve as a few examples.

By comparison his moderate positions are barely ever mentioned even though they are bigger in number.

Why does he do this? Several reasons:

1) To dominate the news cycle - you will be hearing nothing but Trump for the next few days, even more than you normally do.

2) The truthful hyperbole - Trump describes this oxymoron in The Art of the Deal - he has been using it for years - by friendly exxageration you draw the attention to the issue at hand and force others to discuss it, making them realize that there is actually a problem, even if it is not as big as you presented it.

3) To appear as the leader on the issue so he can frame the discussion - the issue of problems of islamic immigration is now firmly in Trump's hands, just 24 hours after Obama delivered just his 3rd, very weak speech from the Oval Office on the same theme. Trump is forcing everyone to react to him and it does not matter than most media and representatives don't support him.

4) To have a strong starting position so he can negotiate down later - Trump won't deport 12 million Mexicans and he won't ban muslims from entering the country. However, he has put himself into a position to accomplish these goals at least partially once he is done negoatiating about them.

5) To lock down his base - not much to explain here even though I think it's only a secondary motive.

Trump is obsessed with deals and has been his whole life. This is the biggest one yet and he is playing by the same rules he has always played by... and he is winning.

I understand his rationale, but he overplayed his hand here. Of course this will resonate well with those who already support Trump as well as those who ask for strong measures against terrorism and are somehow under the impression that this is the only issue the US face today. But to everyone else it makes him sound like a bigoted moron.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,342
I wouldn't call him fascist either tbh. Not that that makes him or his policies better in any way, but facism isn't the right label imo.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism#Nationalism

If you read what fascism really is, I'd say the vast majority of Americans are fascists, were it not for the lack of any desire for a totalitarian state (but in truth it's kind of there with all the intelligence agencies and stuff).
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
116,141
Interesting analysis of Donald Trump I found posted elsewhere:

Notice that every time he takes a strong position on something - it's the strongest and the most extreme one he can take without actually getting totally stumped

Deportation of illegals, The Wall, China muslim ban now serve as a few examples.

By comparison his moderate positions are barely ever mentioned even though they are bigger in number.

Why does he do this? Several reasons:

1) To dominate the news cycle - you will be hearing nothing but Trump for the next few days, even more than you normally do.

2) The truthful hyperbole - Trump describes this oxymoron in The Art of the Deal - he has been using it for years - by friendly exxageration you draw the attention to the issue at hand and force others to discuss it, making them realize that there is actually a problem, even if it is not as big as you presented it.

3) To appear as the leader on the issue so he can frame the discussion - the issue of problems of islamic immigration is now firmly in Trump's hands, just 24 hours after Obama delivered just his 3rd, very weak speech from the Oval Office on the same theme. Trump is forcing everyone to react to him and it does not matter than most media and representatives don't support him.

4) To have a strong starting position so he can negotiate down later - Trump won't deport 12 million Mexicans and he won't ban muslims from entering the country. However, he has put himself into a position to accomplish these goals at least partially once he is done negoatiating about them.

5) To lock down his base - not much to explain here even though I think it's only a secondary motive.

Trump is obsessed with deals and has been his whole life. This is the biggest one yet and he is playing by the same rules he has always played by... and he is winning.
I think it's pretty obvious Trump is gaming the system. He is an expert at this, and already admitted it when he said Democrats were his best friend for a reason in New York. I wouldn't be surprised if he's formulated this tactic with the hedge being an actual terrorist attack before the elections, sort of like a reverse Bush. Chances are it will happen, and he's positioning himself as such. Of course, more people will probably die of bee stings in 2016 than terrorist attacks, but that doesn't matter to the Neo-Cons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism#Nationalism

If you read what fascism really is, I'd say the vast majority of Americans are fascists, were it not for the lack of any desire for a totalitarian state (but in truth it's kind of there with all the intelligence agencies and stuff).
They are fascists in that they believe the state is everything and can do no wrong. It's really odd because the approval ratings in government are very poor, especially in Congress, but folks still believe in the institution as a whole. I would say it's some sort of really weird fascist and socialist combination where people want government handouts, spying to keep us safe from phantom threats, and an overall disconnection from reality.
 

Osman

Koul Khara!
Aug 30, 2002
61,501
Who cares what some people think? This is the equivalent of political suicide. Dude's no longer relevant.
He is getting increase in (Iowa) polls bro...



Yeah its crazy...


Even Dick Cheney is saying this guy is crazy, thats how obvious this shit is getting. DARTH CHENEY THINKS YOU GONE TOO FAR.


But hey, his polls approving, in the game of who can say the more fucked up shit, he is leading, Ted Cruz was gaining in Iowa with his marvellous bravado of ignorance so he had to come with something, his brainstorming lead to this, and you would assume this would be automatic career suicide, but it isnt so far...

- - - Updated - - -

Interesting analysis of Donald Trump I found posted elsewhere:

Notice that every time he takes a strong position on something - it's the strongest and the most extreme one he can take without actually getting totally stumped

Deportation of illegals, The Wall, China muslim ban now serve as a few examples.

By comparison his moderate positions are barely ever mentioned even though they are bigger in number.

Why does he do this? Several reasons:

1) To dominate the news cycle - you will be hearing nothing but Trump for the next few days, even more than you normally do.

2) The truthful hyperbole - Trump describes this oxymoron in The Art of the Deal - he has been using it for years - by friendly exxageration you draw the attention to the issue at hand and force others to discuss it, making them realize that there is actually a problem, even if it is not as big as you presented it.

3) To appear as the leader on the issue so he can frame the discussion - the issue of problems of islamic immigration is now firmly in Trump's hands, just 24 hours after Obama delivered just his 3rd, very weak speech from the Oval Office on the same theme. Trump is forcing everyone to react to him and it does not matter than most media and representatives don't support him.

4) To have a strong starting position so he can negotiate down later - Trump won't deport 12 million Mexicans and he won't ban muslims from entering the country. However, he has put himself into a position to accomplish these goals at least partially once he is done negoatiating about them.

5) To lock down his base - not much to explain here even though I think it's only a secondary motive.

Trump is obsessed with deals and has been his whole life. This is the biggest one yet and he is playing by the same rules he has always played by... and he is winning.
This is fairly obvious, that he is 1000% extreme populist and doesnt mean majority of the thing that he says. Thats what makes him even more dangerous too, litterally can do and say anything to win. His tactic is obvious when this muslim statement came just as Ted Cruz and some others were gaining or overtaking him in Iowa by their typical muslim bashing, so ofcourse he had to outdo them...its sickening it actually works...
 

Cronios

Juventolog
Jun 7, 2004
27,519
our society has evolved, we are now more educated than ever before, we live in the information era, where everyone and everywehere have access to informations that allows him to make an "informed" decision and yet somehow ppl still tend to succumb nationalistic popularism...
Trump, Le pen ? Seriously?
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
116,141
our society has evolved, we are now more educated than ever before, we live in the information era, where everyone and everywehere have access to informations that allows him to make an "informed" decision and yet somehow ppl still tend to succumb nationalistic popularism...
Trump, Le pen ? Seriously?
It just goes to show how poor the left is.
 

Ocelot

Midnight Marauder
Jul 13, 2013
18,943
It just goes to show how poor the left is.
True, the left has been in shambles the past 25 years, ever since Blair & Schröder's amazing idea of the "Third Way" most social democratic parties in Europe don't deserve to be called left anymore. And I don't think the US ever had a left party at any point during the last 40 years.

It's tragic really, the crisis of 2008 should've been the natural chance for leftist movements around the world, but the only thing we got was Occupy.

Except for the few countries where actual left parties got popular due to the clusterfuck that were the Troika austerity measures.
 

swag

L'autista
Administrator
Sep 23, 2003
84,776
I think it's pretty obvious Trump is gaming the system. He is an expert at this, and already admitted it when he said Democrats were his best friend for a reason in New York. I wouldn't be surprised if he's formulated this tactic with the hedge being an actual terrorist attack before the elections, sort of like a reverse Bush. Chances are it will happen, and he's positioning himself as such. Of course, more people will probably die of bee stings in 2016 than terrorist attacks, but that doesn't matter to the Neo-Cons.
I liken Trump to the AIDS virus. He's perfectly tuned himself to exploit the ugly social attitudes in American culture that we all know exist but people don't want to publicly admit nor face up to. The more that exists, the more his approach thrives. If we had a culture that more strongly outed, rather than tolerated (if not condoned), forms of racial and religious discrimination (let alone outright political hyperbole and posturing), Trump's strategy would fail.

I have to secretly admire what he's done as the biggest troll on American politics and intolerance.
 

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