Massimiliano Allegri (270 Viewers)

[U Picciriddu]

We also had no European football during Conte’s first season. Just plain competition and later the Coppa

Oh damn Zizinho already said that

 

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[zizinho]

He also broke our 9 year winning streak and finished just a point behind us the year before, so I wouldn't be so harsh. He actually won the league in his first season with Chelsea after they finished tenth the season before, so you're wrong there. As with european success its always hit and miss, sure we didn't go as far as we should have I admit, but Allegri also had his slip ups such as throwing away a 2-0 lead against Bayern, losing the locker room at half time against Real and suffering a humiliating 4-1 loss, and not being able to beat Ajax at home with Ronaldo on your team. I agree though, of course objectively speaking Allegri has had better history in europe, but europe's not our focus at the moment. Our domestic problems need to be the priority, and Conte is better suited for that.

Chelsea also won the title a year prior to Contes win, with those same exact players. It was a classic Mourinho collapse, doesn't mean the team was shit when Conte took it. In fact, you go back to the PL thread of 16-17 and you can see many of us predict Chelsea to win it when the British media was all on Mourinho vs Guardiola Manchester derby. The rebuild at inter started before him. They made the CL with Spalletti (?) and acquired Marotta, made some good transfers like a free De Vrij or Lautaro and made the CL again. Then when Conte came they got Barella, Bastoni, Sensi, Lukaku. They kept improving season after season for a while even before Conte. You guys try to paint Conte like a magician who wins with shit teams, he needs great players like everyone else.

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@Ronn look at this guy watch him cry a river like an offended karen on twitter again if you single him out for stirring shit

Twitter?

 

[singus]

What happened this summer is our finances were crippled by poor business over the last few years and a global pandemic (if you hadn’t noticed). A rebuild now is a long term job, which is why we would given a proven winner and someone who understands this club a long term contract to be centrally involved in the project.

You’re completely missing the point. Short termism is exactly what has got this club in the mess it is in. Poor decisions prioritising short term success instead of long term growth. Showing faith in a quality manager and committing to him is exactly what we should have done, and yes I’m happy we’ve taken a long term approach with a manager that has proven he can manage top level clubs and win with them.

1-2 year contracts give managers no stability, it’s an inter/AC/Napoli level approach. We were successful historically precisely because we had consistency and trusted our manager.

You are mixing a lot of things together here then. When the club shitcanned Allegri, he was still on a long contract. It was not short termism that started that decline.

Then we hired a new coach who managed to win the Scuedetto in his first season. Are you saying that we should have kept Sarri (I wanted neither Sarri, Pirlo or the rehire)? Or is this short-termism a concept that here is used to Allegris advantage only?

 

[JuveE46]

It's more than him. It's Pepe (who was on form), Matri, Giaccherini, De Ceglie AND Estigarribia who played quite a lot for us. Our bench, however, was filled with trash. We had Borriello, Krasic, Pazienza, Padoin and Marrone. We were luck there weren't plenty of injuries surely. We didn't have Tevez and our forward line was weak so we gathered goals mainly from Marchisio's free role and forward runs, since only Matri and Vucinic scored 10 goals.

I'm not going into Conte >>>>>>> Allegri debate nor I'm gonna turn this into Conte conservation. I'm just saying how this team look entirely different when Conte took over. It was mentality switch and mindset that changed which was brilliant. Then results came.

No, I'm not saying that Allegri is as good as Pirlo, before you say that, no. But I'm not seeing much from Allegri since he took over. Plenty of times we played a bit better than Pirlo's squad. Plenty of times we were exactly the same and plenty of times we struggled and grabbed points without showing anything.

If you go back and read posts when we appointed Allegri you'll see he was my first choice and I wanted him badly here. But honestly, I expected a lot more. Sure, our squad may not be ideal, far from that. But struggling and losing to bottom side teams? Our one player earns as much as their full squad. You can't say we have a weak team when we talk about that. It would've been entirely different had we lost to Chelsea, Bayern or City. I'd be first to say how we're way behind those teams and we had to drop points. But showing absolutely ZERO stuff against midtable and bottom table teams, teams that just joined Serie A, that is not acceptable even with "this mid of ours".

One of the biggest differences is that when Conte came in and interestingly enough also tried to implement 442/424 hybrid but quickly saw we don't have the players for it and wisely and quickly chose a system that worked, most importantly he went down to basics and very straight forward way of playing, no hybrids just keep it tight and simple.
With Max he seems to be stuck and clueless, to top it off he thinks it's ok to change systems against a team which is in best form of thier history coming from 7 matches straight.
If he can't get the attack to fire properly at least tighten up the defence. IDk man it makes me think if Max has early Alzheimer I don't get this approach.

 

[X Æ A-12]

It'll all be good next season once Fagioli, Rovella and additional CM come in. No more Rabiot or Betacur

 

[Mark]

It'll all be good next season once Fagioli, Rovella and additional CM come in. No more Rabiot or Betacur

They young. We don't play those.

 

[s4tch]

We also had no European football during Conte’s first season. Just plain competition and later the Coppa

Oh damn Zizinho already said that

https://www.juventuz.com/threads/massimiliano-allegri.40977/page-2821#post-6429335

#metoo

anyway, conte is a great motivator, but he won't return, and he couldn't miraculously motivate this squad into a scudetto winning one either. we have to do much better with our recruitment. ramseys and rabiots should never wear this jersey.

 

[Zebra fake fam]

I'm 100% sure that Allegri will do good with our pathetic squad. He is the only thing that gives me hope in the long run.

Thats called delusion my friend. Keep at it

 

[X Æ A-12]

They young. We don't play those.

False. Maxx is great with youngsters

 

[Mark]

False. Maxx is great with youngsters

he gonna be back? :O

 

[il brutto]

You are mixing a lot of things together here then. When the club shitcanned Allegri, he was still on a long contract. It was not short termism that started that decline.

Then we hired a new coach who managed to win the Scuedetto in his first season. Are you saying that we should have kept Sarri (I wanted neither Sarri, Pirlo or the rehire)? Or is this short-termism a concept that here is used to Allegris advantage only?

He had one year left on his contract at the time. Agnelli knows he made a mistake in letting Allegri go and that's why he brought Max back to start a new long-term project here. If you're looking for Agnelli to make hasty short-term decisions again I think you're going to be disappointed.

 

[X Æ A-12]

he gonna be back? :O

You would sell him?

 

[Mark]

You would sell him?

who are we talking about?

 

[kao_ray]

Thats called delusion my friend. Keep at it

Don't forget where Milan was the last 10 seasons. Don't get too cocky.

 

[s4tch]

For me Scudetto was the target starting the season. We have the largest wage budget, most revenue, have a lot of players that know how to win, we should be competing. Of course now is not the time to talk about Scudetto, we need to crawl out of the canyon of failure first, once we do that lets see where we're at.

that is usually the metric that marks the best squad of the league, so statistically it makes sense to expect the best paid squad to be the best performing squad too. but we pay over 20m net combined to ramsey, tek and rabiot only, which is higher than the complete wage bill of multiple clubs. we're the new inda of 2010 with overpaid, unmotivated mercenaries. the majority of our squad is unsellable due to their wages. at least ronaldo was professional enough to give his all on the pitch for his astronomical salary. the same can't be said about half of our squad. that's why i'd only keep chiesa, loca and cuadrado if it was up to me. but we're stuck with these fuckers. this is not the best squad, and the starting eleven without cr is barely top3.

the way we're performing now (meaning udinese, empoli and last 2 matches) is obviously unacceptable. i just can't see a shortcut here. fire allegri, then what? no coach will turn rabiot into prime vidal or arthur into 100m pjanic lol

 

[U Picciriddu]

https://www.juventuz.com/threads/massimiliano-allegri.40977/page-2821#post-6429335

#metoo

anyway, conte is a great motivator, but he won't return, and he couldn't miraculously motivate this squad into a scudetto winning one either. we have to do much better with our recruitment. ramseys and rabiots should never wear this jersey.

Great minds think alike.

Conte was the right man at the right moment, after we coincidentally had a perfect mercato (among with Barza and to a lesser extend Matri the winter before) that laid the foundation for the Juventus of the years after that. We were also lucky that Inter started their decline together with Milan. There isn’t much to say or compare. Different times, perhaps a less competitive Serie A, different expectations, etc.

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that is usually the metric that marks the best squad of the league, so statistically it makes sense to expect the best paid squad to be the best performing squad too. but we pay over 20m net combined to ramsey, tek and rabiot only, which is higher than the complete wage bill of multiple clubs. we're the new inda of 2010 with overpaid, unmotivated mercenaries. the majority of our squad is unsellable due to their wages. at least ronaldo was professional enough to give his all on the pitch for his astronomical salary. the same can't be said about half of our squad. that's why i'd only keep chiesa, loca and cuadrado if it was up to me. but we're stuck with these fuckers. this is not the best squad, and the starting eleven without cr is barely top3.

the way we're performing now (meaning udinese, empoli and last 2 matches) is obviously unacceptable. i just can't see a shortcut here. fire allegri, then what? no coach will turn rabiot into prime vidal or arthur into 100m pjanic lol

You could also turn the comparison to ‘how much did teams lower their wage budget’, we’d see a very different picture.

 

[Siamak]

#Juve points after 11 games (it's only statistical data)

07/08 - 21
08/09 - 21
09/10 - 21
10/11 - 19
11/12 - 21
12/13 - 28
13/14 - 28
14/15 - 28
15/16 - 15
16/17 - 27
17/18 - 28
18/19 - 31
19/20 - 29
20/21 - 23
21/22 - 15

 

[Ronn]

Ritirio is a sign of desperation. After Tuesday we should play our best in Serie A and rest for CL matches.

 

[Mike-e-y]

You are mixing a lot of things together here then. When the club shitcanned Allegri, he was still on a long contract. It was not short termism that started that decline.

Then we hired a new coach who managed to win the Scuedetto in his first season. Are you saying that we should have kept Sarri (I wanted neither Sarri, Pirlo or the rehire)? Or is this short-termism a concept that here is used to Allegris advantage only?

There’s no mixing here from me. The initial sacking was as short term as hell - they sacked a winning manager because they wanted to rapidly change their footballing philosophy - which they stuck by for 12 months until sacking Sarri who was a complete cultural misfit. What’s more short term than that approach? Allegri shouldn’t have been sacked because he had won the league with about 6 rounds to spare. Why would we sack a manager for that? Regardless

we can’t keep sacking managers or not committing to our ‘project’. It’s farcical. Give a proven winner a long term project and embark on a plan with him. There’s no mixed messages and nothing not clear about that.

 

[singus]

He had one year left on his contract at the time. Agnelli knows he made a mistake in letting Allegri go and that's why he brought Max back to start a new long-term project here. If you're looking for Agnelli to make hasty short-term decisions again I think you're going to be disappointed.

Right now it looks more like his mistake was to rehire him than fire him in first place. But that we shall see later this season. Its still early and there is time to start building a team.

I dont care if Allegri stays if he starts building a team and things start making sense. But if not, then I certainly hope our directors will act at some point and not just watch it burn. Our goal is the same here I hope -the club over individuals.