out now?


  • Total voters
    166
  • Poll closed .

Osman

Koul Khara!
Aug 30, 2002
61,499
He doesn't belong there. Juve was always keen to sell him and make a good profit. Good decision seeing how he flopped in recent years.

Don't recall we were ever interested in Darmian and he's affirmed player, not that young.
This is not only about us (even if we have to prioritize too and hesitate due to the competition), these players used to be signed by other italian clubs. Used to be its was huge rarity someone like Vieri went outside Italy just for 1 season, now its the norm. Since Giuseppe Rossi til now, now if you have a breakout year and Italian clubs hesitate for the sums the buying club is asking for, even the italian players will easily go overseas for better money. Many of the foreign players already see Italy as a stepping stone now, to bigger pay day and more prestige elsewhere. Darmian is the starting fullback for the Azzurri and he plays outside Italy? Doesnt make any sense in the old standard. But now, will become common occurance if you excell enough.


Its not about flopping or not, if you top scorer in the league with a minnow, another italian club took the gamble on you, regardless of how you did. You did not go to a German or Spanish club...
 

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Hust

Senior Member
Hustini
May 29, 2005
93,703
Apparently United are going to offer Milan £40m this summer (sell De Gea to Madrid) :D
We need a GK tho. Gigi isn't gonna last forever. For me, that will be the most interesting replacement we will need to make over the last few years. More so than the DP one.
 

JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
74,937
We need a GK tho. Gigi isn't gonna last forever. For me, that will be the most interesting replacement we will need to make over the last few years. More so than the DP one.
I think we'll enquire but they could sell him abroad for more and that is what will happen, Milan are a disaster and uncompetitive, it's a shame he's such a staunch Milan fan because a once in a generation Italian keeper like that you normally associate with Juventus.

It's a very specialist position, we won't find another Gigi but there are alternatives who can still be world class, you never know how good some of these could potentially be.
 

Hust

Senior Member
Hustini
May 29, 2005
93,703
I think we'll enquire but they could sell him abroad for more and that is what will happen, Milan are a disaster and uncompetitive, it's a shame he's such a staunch Milan fan because a once in a generation Italian keeper like that you normally associate with Juventus.

It's a very specialist position, we won't find another Gigi but there are alternatives who can still be world class, you never know how good some of these could potentially be.
I dont' see any of our younger GK's like Leali, for example, coming anything close to WC. Hopefully our scouts can pull a rabbit out of a hat. When was the last none Italian GK we had, Van der sar? Juve almost ALWAYS has an Italian guarding the net.
 

Osman

Koul Khara!
Aug 30, 2002
61,499
We can't take the best players off Napoli, Inter, Milan and Roma, it's a struggle even with Fiorentina and Lazio. Can you imagine us going to Napoli this summer and taking Higuain and Insigne, or Donnarumma from Milan? :lol: Serie A will never operate as Bayernliga, the politics and hatred runs too deeply, some players will simply not be seen dead in Juve colours, and presidents know they might as well be if they sell them.

Bayern are in a unique position as the overwhelmingly biggest club in a strong league.
I dont know how people can be that clueless that they would need this above explained to them? Even the rare times a big player came to us from elsewhere, it used to create immense shit storm, like Baggio. Its only natural for likes of Sampdoria, Udinese, Atalanta etc to sell us players without fuss. Everyone else from Parma to lazio, even when we got their best player and it was the natural hierarchy, and both clubs were needing to sell due to having huge financial scandals about to occur, it was still done with some hint of bad blood and anomosity. Bayern simply doesnt have that, that clubs who have no hope of competing with them absolutely do everything they can to not sell to you (only thing I recall is Rudi Völler refusing to sell Vidal to them). The poster who said Italy is tribalistic was spot on. Closest fuss Bayern got was with Neuer and Schalke, and that was barely a blimp compared what we go through, we cant even entertain bidding on mid level Fiorentina and Lazio players now due to the hostile attitude of their presidents. While Bayern could dismantle Dortmund (prolly will get Reus or Gundogan at some point) now, and Leverkusen in Lucio/Ballack days, and very few bat and eye, just natural untested top dog.

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I think we'll enquire but they could sell him abroad for more and that is what will happen, Milan are a disaster and uncompetitive, it's a shame he's such a staunch Milan fan because a once in a generation Italian keeper like that you normally associate with Juventus.

It's a very specialist position, we won't find another Gigi but there are alternatives who can still be world class, you never know how good some of these could potentially be.
But has he proven anything yet tho? Main thing he has going for him is being solid and being a teenager, which is crazy in itself, his age. But the bid for him is more about his agent then him so far IMO.
 

Vlad

In Allegri We Trust
May 23, 2011
24,029
This is not only about us (even if we have to prioritize too and hesitate due to the competition), these players used to be signed by other italian clubs. Used to be its was huge rarity someone like Vieri went outside Italy just for 1 season, now its the norm. Since Giuseppe Rossi til now, now if you have a breakout year and Italian clubs hesitate for the sums the buying club is asking for, even the italian players will easily go overseas for better money. Many of the foreign players already see Italy as a stepping stone now, to bigger pay day and more prestige elsewhere. Darmian is the starting fullback for the Azzurri and he plays outside Italy? Doesnt make any sense in the old standard. But now, will become common occurance if you excell enough.
I really don't recall that many top young Italian talents leaving the league in recent years, especially if bigger domestic clubs were interested. But let's stick to Juve and we pretty much snatched every promissing young Italian player of late, from Berardi, Rugani, Zaza, Sturaro, prolly Mandragora and Sensi soon, even foreign ones like Dybala. There will always be some exceptions so in the old days you had starting Azzurri RB Panucci playing for Real Madrid, or already mentioned Vieri for Atleti. But if Juve are keen on some young player from the minnows, we'll definitely be his preferred destination to England or Spain and we can pay fairly well as already seen this summer, if the player in question is seen as fitting.


Its not about flopping or not, if you top scorer in the league with a minnow, another italian club took the gamble on you, regardless of how you did. You did not go to a German or Spanish club...
Neither Italian club wanted Immobile.
 

JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
74,937
But has he proven anything yet tho? Main thing he has going for him is being solid and being a teenager, which is crazy in itself, his age. But the bid for him is more about his agent then him so far IMO.
He needs to be left alone for a few years, really. Milan might have internal pressure but from the outside no one expects much from them right now, a big stage in a second rate side is good for him.
 

Osman

Koul Khara!
Aug 30, 2002
61,499
I'm talking about whole league. Its the minimum requirement that club like us with the stature we have in this country to focus on and get the young talents we can get. And for said players to want us. But whole league become a stepping stone selling destination, and the economic realities has hit home to the degree where you do well for a small club, and its not either good timing to join the top top club, or whatever reason, your destination automatically becomes overseas. Because they have the money and pulling power Italy doesnt anymore. There is no denying that.

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He needs to be left alone for a few years, really. Milan might have internal pressure but from the outside no one expects much from them right now, a big stage in a second rate side is good for him.
That is true, and I agree, thats why I allways speak against any sign of him talking up, because its seriously too soon. Its great Miha trust him, and so far he is promising enough to hold his rare position. But beyond that, this teen needs to grow. And not be instantly called the new Gigi without much to back it up yet.
 

Hust

Senior Member
Hustini
May 29, 2005
93,703
I'm sure our scouts are aware of needing a GK soon. Gigi still looks in good shape so its hard to say when his decline will start and how quickly it will slide when it does start. When it does, we need to be ready.
 

JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
74,937
I dont' see any of our younger GK's like Leali, for example, coming anything close to WC. Hopefully our scouts can pull a rabbit out of a hat. When was the last none Italian GK we had, Van der sar? Juve almost ALWAYS has an Italian guarding the net.
Just had a look over the Italian keepers who have come through in the last few years, some this season:

Alberto Brignoli 1991 - Samp/Juve
Luigi Sepe 1991 - Fiorentina/Napoli
Francesco Bardi 1992 - Espanyol/Inter
Mattia Perin 1992 - Genoa
Marco Sportiello 1992 - Atalanta
Nicola Leali 1993 - Frosinone/Juve
Alessio Cragno 1994 - Cagliari
Pierluigi Gollini 1995 - Verona
Simone Scuffet 1996 - Como/Udinese
Alex Meret 1997 - Udinese
Gianluigi Donnarumma 1999 - Milan

There are some guys who are 19/20 who haven't played a game yet, the likes of Lezzerini or Audero, who are very highly rated.

I think Italy has unbelievable potential GK depth for the next 10-15 years even from this point, but to approach Buffon level you are looking at something special. Almost certainly none of these have it. Then you have to look at potential world class, maybe 2-3 do, several more could be very good.

Would you be happy with a keeper the level of someone like Lloris or De Gea? I think that's the best we can hope for, personally.
 

Hydde

Minimiliano Tristelli
Mar 6, 2003
38,985
I'm sure our scouts are aware of needing a GK soon. Gigi still looks in good shape so its hard to say when his decline will start and how quickly it will slide when it does start. When it does, we need to be ready.
:tup:

He could start declining even tomorrow.

We must be ready for that since yesterday
 

Osman

Koul Khara!
Aug 30, 2002
61,499
Just had a look over the Italian keepers who have come through in the last few years, some this season:

Alberto Brignoli 1991 - Samp/Juve
Luigi Sepe 1991 - Fiorentina/Napoli
Francesco Bardi 1992 - Espanyol/Inter
Mattia Perin 1992 - Genoa
Marco Sportiello 1992 - Atalanta
Nicola Leali 1993 - Frosinone/Juve
Alessio Cragno 1994 - Cagliari
Pierluigi Gollini 1995 - Verona
Simone Scuffet 1996 - Como/Udinese
Alex Meret 1997 - Udinese
Gianluigi Donnarumma 1999 - Milan

There are some guys who are 19/20 who haven't played a game yet, the likes of Lezzerini or Audero, who are very highly rated.

I think Italy has unbelievable potential GK depth for the next 10-15 years even from this point, but to approach Buffon level you are looking at something special. Almost certainly none of these have it. Then you have to look at potential world class, maybe 2-3 do, several more could be very good.

Would you be happy with a keeper the level of someone like Lloris or De Gea? I think that's the best we can hope for, personally.
Considering De Gea is great, fvck yeah I would be happy with that. Its insane to expect best ever goalie level, not just again, but as his replacement. I'm fine with a world class one. Preferly italian and young.
 

Hust

Senior Member
Hustini
May 29, 2005
93,703
Would you be happy with a keeper the level of someone like Lloris or De Gea? I think that's the best we can hope for, personally.
Pretty much. I think Milan are hyping Donnarumma as the next Buffon but I don't think anyone knew that a 16 year old Buffon was going to end up as the greatest GK of all time. Even our bench players for GK with Storari & Neto are done great, I never once was nervous with any GK in the net. But we have had years to prep for this inevitable replacement and I don't think we have a clue who the next long term GK is going to be. Not sure if I should be worried or not because I'm sure we can get an interim GK until we find one.

:tup:

He could start declining even tomorrow.

We must be ready for that since yesterday
It's amazing the shape that Gigi keeps himself in. I'd be curious to see what his daily workout regimen looks like. It's amazing the professionalism our main players have. Caceres & Vidal really threw a wrench in the system. :D
 

pavluska

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
7,339
Would you be happy with a keeper the level of someone like Lloris or De Gea? I think that's the best we can hope for, personally.
De Gea is a top-3 GK in the world, so anyone would be happy with him, but he's likely Real bound and will cost an arm and a leg.

We should scout and locate a good young GK with WC potential, sign and loan/groom him for a year or two. And I believe that's exactly what the club is in the process of doing.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
We can't take the best players off Napoli, Inter, Milan and Roma, it's a struggle even with Fiorentina and Lazio. Can you imagine us going to Napoli this summer and taking Higuain and Insigne, or Donnarumma from Milan? :lol: Serie A will never operate as Bayernliga, the politics and hatred runs too deeply, some players will simply not be seen dead in Juve colours, and presidents know they might as well be if they sell them.

Bayern are in a unique position as the overwhelmingly biggest club in a strong league.
Not the point i was trying to make.


In the 70ties and 80ties juventus had the grand majority of the italian talent in its rangs. During the 90ties and early00s, we saw alot of top clubs selling a top player to the other, cause they wanted to buy a different one. Inzaghi, Baggio, Vieri. We also saw for example Batistita go from highflying fiorentina to Roma cause he wanted to win a title.


Now today we arent really at that part where we can just go to Napoli and get Higuain. Not sure we'll ever get there.


But what we can do, is be the team that wins the majority of the domestic titles, and consistantly does great campaigns in europe, whilst Inter and Milan try to get their crap togheter, with Roma and Napoli putting up fight so different teams join juve in europe each year, hindering the development of 1 specific opponent.

We need build this reputation up. Continue to put ALOT of time and efford in getting the very best italian youth, or emerging stars. And when we continue to do our thing for a decade, we'll have increased our pull towards youngsters significantly.

And when a great generation stands up, we'll be reaping the benefits.



That was my point. Not that after a decade or so, we might be able to go all "madrid and figo" on our competition. Thats not how Beppe rolls. Altho Beppe would be proud about how Inter got Ronaldo from Barcelona :D
 

JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
74,937
TBH I didn't even read/see your point, Zach, I just picked up the tail end of the discussion. But we can never have that hegemony in Serie A. We could win 10 consecutive scudetti. We can't recreate the political, sporting or social conditions Bayern enjoy, we can't even take the best Italian players if they play for a hated rival. Which as Juventus is pretty much everyone. Bayern don't have real rivals, only bitches.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
I really don't recall that many top young Italian talents leaving the league in recent years, especially if bigger domestic clubs were interested. But let's stick to Juve and we pretty much snatched every promissing young Italian player of late, from Berardi, Rugani, Zaza, Sturaro, prolly Mandragora and Sensi soon, even foreign ones like Dybala. There will always be some exceptions so in the old days you had starting Azzurri RB Panucci playing for Real Madrid, or already mentioned Vieri for Atleti. But if Juve are keen on some young player from the minnows, we'll definitely be his preferred destination to England or Spain and we can pay fairly well as already seen this summer, if the player in question is seen as fitting.


Neither Italian club wanted Immobile.
Who left the league that was actually worth a shit, when we could afford it ?

Rossi, got stolen by manchester united before anyone in italy could give him a senior contract. Parma is still mad as fuck about it. However, he never was a big loss.

Verratti ? Special situation. His star rose in 10-11, and he confirmed 11-12 his exceptional potential.

What was the situation then ? after 10-11 we were in a crappy position and we needed players who could deliver right now. after 11-12 we had a solid base and started to secure the young talents. However, after 2 exceptional seasons, other clubs caught wind of it, and Napoli and PSG intervened. Wich is the death penalty.

What if its today ? Today we'd sign verratti after 10-11 and loan back to pescara. OR, we'd act like we did on dybala, and dish out a significant sum. Iirc there is talk of us spending 8-12 mil on some kid this january. Well this basically. Today we have that solid base, and we can go in early with cash for these, before they catch foreign attention.

Darmian ? Not worth his asking price for us. We decided that we'd continue with licht for the time beeing, while keeping tabs on several rb's in italy. Meanwhile, we bought Sandro who at worst is twice as good as Darmian.

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TBH I didn't even read/see your point, Zach, I just picked up the tail end of the discussion. But we can never have that hegemony in Serie A. We could win 10 consecutive scudetti. We can't recreate the political, sporting or social conditions Bayern enjoy, we can't even take the best Italian players if they play for a hated rival. Which as Juventus is pretty much everyone. Bayern don't have real rivals, only bitches.
There are only a few actual rivals that can do this. Milan, Inter and Roma. None of the other rivals have a serious draw for young talents (talking -20). its about dishing out for these kids before the others can.
its also interesting to note, juventus has fans in every town of italy. It used to be the big point on why we never sold out delle alphi. Well, this would certainly benefit from that.

You are 17 and juve comes. You'd need to be damn hotheaded to say no.


Hence if we went for maldini back in the day, early enough, we could have had him. And his father was a milan legend. But that huge draw of the 1978 azzurri side that was full of juve players
 

Bianconero_Aus

Beppe Marotta Is My God
May 26, 2009
80,969
We should create the Padania league with the likes of Juve, Inter, Milan and the other oop north clubs, a "Papal Lands" league lead the way by Roma and Lazio (which also acts as a buffer zone) and Napoli leading the way in the Bourbon inspired Kingdom of Two Sicilies league with the other terroni.
@JuveJay
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
We should create the Padania league with the likes of Juve, Inter, Milan and the other oop north clubs, a "Papal Lands" league lead the way by Roma and Lazio (which also acts as a buffer zone) and Napoli leading the way in the Bourbon inspired Kingdom of Two Sicilies league with the other terroni.
@JuveJay
Nah, go full hunger games.

Make Juventus the capitol and everything else the districts.
 

Emmet

Senior Member
Apr 5, 2006
3,938
We couldn't even buy Cuadrado from Viola, we had to get him on loan via Chelsea because the rats wouldn't sell him to us.

Rival clubs will never ever sell their best players to us unless we offer PSG style money which we will never do.
 

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