Marco Borriello (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter Fake Melo
- Start date
I don't buy it that Borriello will be signed as a replacement for Toni, Amauri and Iaquinta. Those three are players we didn't use at all. He's being bought to be part of the 4 strikers that get to play. Pretty obvious that all three of Quag, Borri and Matri will fight for one single place in the starting XI, which is the center of the three men attack, a spot which even Vucinic can cover if needed. Borri's signing is imo a clear sign that Quag is not in Conte's plans. Will Borriello be signed in the summer is not known yet. I guess it will depend on his performances and the opportunities we will get on the market next summer. But Quag is gone, if not now then certainly in the summer.
Because unlike Quag Matri is actually capable of playing the prima punta role in a 4-3-3 which Quag won't provide, and as Alen pointed out Quag is also unable to play (at least in a desired level) as a winger in a 4-3-3-
So basically you have a realistically good player but don't have any (true) use for him in the team/starting lineup and is not good enough to warrant a tactical setup change to accomodate him, he would also block the signing of a player that IS suited to your formation if he were to stay.
So basically you have a realistically good player but don't have any (true) use for him in the team/starting lineup and is not good enough to warrant a tactical setup change to accomodate him, he would also block the signing of a player that IS suited to your formation if he were to stay.
It has been for decades this way and i wont change my mind because of Pep, i dont even consider hum a coach, unless he prooves himself with inferior players.Conte or anyone else trying to imitate those tactics are destined to fail, because Pep;s players are so much better, that can deliver anyways...
Except me, 90% of the Italian coaches still share the same concepts.
And at any case, the need to create and score a goal are still there, regardless of the tactical choices and we must not lack the tools for it. I dont want to see us implying the usual old tactics, but i want us to have the natural options open.
They are never at Matris line either, so that goes both ways, but just like i said they spend most of their time closer to the midfield, rather than the opposition box.
Pepe being a winger tends to start deeper, Vucinic being a forward tends to penetrate deeper.
They cant have the same roles, because they are different kinds of players and this causes an asymmetry.
Call them what you want, but they are different and it doesnt matter what we put them to do, their footballistic characteristics will prevail on the fields they are good at, thus resulting at not being as good on a specific asked role and the inevitable loss of their loss of optimal performance, according to their potential, because of that. (ex Pepe cant score what most of the SSs would and Vucinic cant defend as most of the wingers could)
This is a natural result for every player, being played out of position. Sometimes, those small individual compromises work well for the common good, as its our case, but if you have quite the dedicated tool for the right job, you can optimize the performance.
IMO wingers fielded as SSs in a 4-3-3 will cause finishing issues.
I ve always believed that and i see it happening every time we play... so this not just my impression and according to my logic the finishing will improve if you replace the winger with a SS who is able to score and Quaqs is just that!
Quaqs adapts to the teams needs because he is versatile, so does DP, DP can play as a straight CF if he is paired with a SS like Quaqs and a SS if he is paired with a CF like Treze.
Such gifted players maximize our performances and can fit into many schemes/roles.
This is why imo Quaq>Vucinic, Quaq can both create/support and score, but Vucinic is a terrible finisher.
He must be always paired with a finisher.
So i agree that Quaq can replace Matri but i disagree that he cant be paired with him.
You just underestimate his supporting capabilities.
And serving isnt everything, off the ball runs and creating havoc to make space elsewhere is.
In these goals we have 2 versatile forwards combing and doing great things, the aim for both is to score, why? because they both can and they help each other by creating a multidimensional front.
If one cannot score, like the goal waster Vucinic, he can only provide support and thus only by judged for that. BTW how many assist Vucinic had so far?
So as Vucinic, DP, Giacche and Quaqs can all work with a CF like Matri (who is also, imo versatile enough himself, as he can create and support, at least as good as he scores)
They can all co-exist and as they are versatile enough to adapt to our needs and focus were we need them, they could maximize their performance.
Ex Vucinic avoid tryind to score and focus at what he does best.
Matri mostly have an eye to score, but share that role with Quaq, so that it will be harder for the opposition to stop them simultaneously. And finally Quaqs, offering in the box what Pepe is trying hard but mostly cant offer.
Imagine having Quaqs taking all those shots Pepe wastes!
PS: I m telling you Allen, such a 4-3-3 would be an overkill and after they develop a teamwork, unstoppable.
It would also boost our need for another CF (Boriello) and more CMs (Pizarro, Montolivo) still offer more playing chances for DP and make Krasic and Elia totally unneeded.
Just make an effort to envision it!
Except me, 90% of the Italian coaches still share the same concepts.
And at any case, the need to create and score a goal are still there, regardless of the tactical choices and we must not lack the tools for it. I dont want to see us implying the usual old tactics, but i want us to have the natural options open.
They are never at Matris line either, so that goes both ways, but just like i said they spend most of their time closer to the midfield, rather than the opposition box.
Pepe being a winger tends to start deeper, Vucinic being a forward tends to penetrate deeper.
They cant have the same roles, because they are different kinds of players and this causes an asymmetry.
Call them what you want, but they are different and it doesnt matter what we put them to do, their footballistic characteristics will prevail on the fields they are good at, thus resulting at not being as good on a specific asked role and the inevitable loss of their loss of optimal performance, according to their potential, because of that. (ex Pepe cant score what most of the SSs would and Vucinic cant defend as most of the wingers could)
This is a natural result for every player, being played out of position. Sometimes, those small individual compromises work well for the common good, as its our case, but if you have quite the dedicated tool for the right job, you can optimize the performance.
IMO wingers fielded as SSs in a 4-3-3 will cause finishing issues.
I ve always believed that and i see it happening every time we play... so this not just my impression and according to my logic the finishing will improve if you replace the winger with a SS who is able to score and Quaqs is just that!
Quaqs adapts to the teams needs because he is versatile, so does DP, DP can play as a straight CF if he is paired with a SS like Quaqs and a SS if he is paired with a CF like Treze.
Such gifted players maximize our performances and can fit into many schemes/roles.
This is why imo Quaq>Vucinic, Quaq can both create/support and score, but Vucinic is a terrible finisher.
He must be always paired with a finisher.
So i agree that Quaq can replace Matri but i disagree that he cant be paired with him.
You just underestimate his supporting capabilities.
And serving isnt everything, off the ball runs and creating havoc to make space elsewhere is.
In these goals we have 2 versatile forwards combing and doing great things, the aim for both is to score, why? because they both can and they help each other by creating a multidimensional front.
If one cannot score, like the goal waster Vucinic, he can only provide support and thus only by judged for that. BTW how many assist Vucinic had so far?
So as Vucinic, DP, Giacche and Quaqs can all work with a CF like Matri (who is also, imo versatile enough himself, as he can create and support, at least as good as he scores)
They can all co-exist and as they are versatile enough to adapt to our needs and focus were we need them, they could maximize their performance.
Ex Vucinic avoid tryind to score and focus at what he does best.
Matri mostly have an eye to score, but share that role with Quaq, so that it will be harder for the opposition to stop them simultaneously. And finally Quaqs, offering in the box what Pepe is trying hard but mostly cant offer.
Imagine having Quaqs taking all those shots Pepe wastes!
PS: I m telling you Allen, such a 4-3-3 would be an overkill and after they develop a teamwork, unstoppable.
It would also boost our need for another CF (Boriello) and more CMs (Pizarro, Montolivo) still offer more playing chances for DP and make Krasic and Elia totally unneeded.
Just make an effort to envision it!
The main difference, I'd say, between Quagliarella and Matri and Borriello is that Quagliarella's movement tends to be to drop off - moving towards the midfield to get the ball and get involved in the play. While each do it differently, Matri and Borriello are both more inclined to move away from the ball and stretch the game (Borriello more a fixed target and Matri running into the channels).
If Conte trusts his three midfielders, as he ought to, I wouldn't blame him for focusing on a CF who opens up space rather than one who tends to drop into what is already a pretty congested area of the pitch (now that Juve are playing three in midfield, rather than two).
Still, I rather like that Quagliarella offers something different.
Or maybe Juve just plain don't trust Quagliarella's fitness.
If Conte trusts his three midfielders, as he ought to, I wouldn't blame him for focusing on a CF who opens up space rather than one who tends to drop into what is already a pretty congested area of the pitch (now that Juve are playing three in midfield, rather than two).
Still, I rather like that Quagliarella offers something different.
Or maybe Juve just plain don't trust Quagliarella's fitness.
He might as well be 
You're talking as if it's February already and we kept Quag in the team. It's January 1st, the window opened today If a decent offer comes, he's gonna be sold this month.
You're talking as if it's February already and we kept Quag in the team. It's January 1st, the window opened today
If a decent offer comes, he's gonna be sold this month.
That good offer has to be very good for Quag to be sold in January IMO. Guess we'll have to wait and see
Pep IS a coach and he did NOT invent 4-3-3, he also succeded with Barcelona B and while I agree that he's had the best players in the bussiness you still need to be a competent coach in order for the team to succeed. 2007-2008 Barcelona comes to mind, all amazing players but chocked hard, Rijkaard had lost the plot.
Quagliarella is not 1/4 as talented as Del Piero was in his heyday and does not provide the kind of quality DP used to, which guaranteed him success in whatever forward position he was deployed. Most of Quags creations are wondergoals done by himself but I fully he believe he doesn't have that killer eye for a pass/assist like DP and other players have.
He's not good enough to keep hold of a starting place at a top team that uses 4-3-3, he's a jack of all trades master of none type of players. He won't score 20+goals a season (hell, not even 15+) and won't assist 10+ goals a season.
He may be skilled and move around very well but you get to the point when you gotta ask yourself wether that is enough for a scudetto/CL football aspiring team.
He's also what? 28? at this age there's not much of a chance that he'll get much better than he is and with that latest injury added to his injury record this might be one of the last chances that you'll have to get a decent sum out of him. He might aswell end up permanently injured like Iaquinta as age catches on with his body.
By keeping Quag you're blocking yourself out of the possibility of getting a player better suited for your tactics and can provide more to the team than Quag.
That's of course, unless you want to keep stacking on attacking players and continue whining like you always do and enjoy.
Quagliarella is not 1/4 as talented as Del Piero was in his heyday and does not provide the kind of quality DP used to, which guaranteed him success in whatever forward position he was deployed. Most of Quags creations are wondergoals done by himself but I fully he believe he doesn't have that killer eye for a pass/assist like DP and other players have.
He's not good enough to keep hold of a starting place at a top team that uses 4-3-3, he's a jack of all trades master of none type of players. He won't score 20+goals a season (hell, not even 15+) and won't assist 10+ goals a season.
He may be skilled and move around very well but you get to the point when you gotta ask yourself wether that is enough for a scudetto/CL football aspiring team.
He's also what? 28? at this age there's not much of a chance that he'll get much better than he is and with that latest injury added to his injury record this might be one of the last chances that you'll have to get a decent sum out of him. He might aswell end up permanently injured like Iaquinta as age catches on with his body.
By keeping Quag you're blocking yourself out of the possibility of getting a player better suited for your tactics and can provide more to the team than Quag.
That's of course, unless you want to keep stacking on attacking players and continue whining like you always do and enjoy.
What do you call Mourinho's tactics when he won CL in 2010? It was presented as 4-2-3-1, while looking at what Pandev and Eto'o were doing on the pitch, it was more like 4-2-2-1-1
If you don't consider Pepe as an attacker in Conte's formation, will you not consider Eto'o and Pandev as wingers in Mourinho's formation? If Eto'o wasn't playing as a winger, why did he score like 3 times less than he scores usual and why did he complain like mad and said that he was a defender (or a fullback) in Mourinho's time?
So now we have Guardiola and Mourinho, the two coaches which won the last two CLs with pretty unortodox tactics, or by placing players where they don't really belong according to what "has been there for decades", as you put it.
And Mourinho is using your "typical SS Benzema" as a lone striker for Real.
In any case, I would love to have Robben playing there instead of Pepsi, but if he does, he will be given the same tasks that Pepe is given. Just that Robben will do things 100 times better. Both will be forwards in a 4-3-3, though.
Cesar
Maicon-Lucio-Samuel-Zanetti
Motta-Cambiasso
Pandev-------------------Eto'o
Sneijder
Milito
Maicon-Lucio-Samuel-Zanetti
Motta-Cambiasso
Pandev-------------------Eto'o
Sneijder
Milito
If you don't consider Pepe as an attacker in Conte's formation, will you not consider Eto'o and Pandev as wingers in Mourinho's formation? If Eto'o wasn't playing as a winger, why did he score like 3 times less than he scores usual and why did he complain like mad and said that he was a defender (or a fullback) in Mourinho's time?
So now we have Guardiola and Mourinho, the two coaches which won the last two CLs with pretty unortodox tactics, or by placing players where they don't really belong according to what "has been there for decades", as you put it.
And Mourinho is using your "typical SS Benzema" as a lone striker for Real.
In any case, I would love to have Robben playing there instead of Pepsi, but if he does, he will be given the same tasks that Pepe is given. Just that Robben will do things 100 times better. Both will be forwards in a 4-3-3, though.
... Jovetic, the current La Viola player and the future Juventus #10