Lorenzo Ariaudo (15 Viewers)

[Hust]

This has to be the most stupid thing if we send him on loan

Thank you.

Who gives a RAT FUCK about experience?

Haven't you people ever heard of something called BUILDING A TEAM?

If you loan out your players constantly, how the hell are you going to get them used to being part of the team, forming partnerships with the players on said team, and building for the future? How are they going to even feel like they're part of the team if you always loan them out? It makes no sense whatsoever.

Again, the clubs in Europe with the best youth systems never loan out their young starlets. Never. Hmm, wonder why.

Even Inter don't loan out Balotelli and Santon.

But it's only the idiots at Juventus(z) who approve of this nonsense.

Probably one of my most favorite posts. Ever. I may as well highlight the entire thing in bold, perfect. All of it.

Marchisio and Giovinco played in Serie B, showing their were capable.

Perhaps if we had kept them they'd be better off by being used regularly in our own team.

Yep, if we had kept them and played them regularly they would be more cemented into our team than they are now and maybe we would see a more effective youth system. All our talents waste away at some smaller club where we have no hand in their development or playing time only to come back to find we spent 20million dollars on a player in their position. Happened to every singled player we have that has mass potential. What is the point in having a youth system and develop great talents if your only going to import a player to take their spot?

I bet some of you would make awful awful parents.

I am going to have 6 kids, raise them for 5 years each, then send each to different foster parents for a year and hope they get real life experience from their foster parents and bring them back and hope for the best. Actually, I am going to send them out, adopt 6 to replace the 6 that were mine, bring back my 6 and keep the ones I like and sell the ones I don't like. That way, I have 6 that make me the most happy.

That is such a random thing to say. It's not even close, tbh. None of us here can honestly say that we'd feel even remotely safe having Ariaudo starting for us against a tough opponent. Kid is talented but still very raw, and from what we saw last season there is a lot that he needs to learn. There's only one way to do that; by playing consistently against Serie A opposition.

To me, it's incomprehensible that you two are still obsessing about this no loaning whatsoever thing, because I don't take you for fools otherwise. Maybe just swallow that pride and admit that loaning out in some cases makes sense? :smile:

This post (your reply) is absolutely thoughtless. You say Ariaudo is raw but when has he made a mistake? When has he messed up that resulted in a goal or a FK close to our goal? How many times has Chiellini fucked up? Why don't we send Chiellini on loan to Livorno with Ariaudo to gain more experience so he doesn't make stupid ass mistakes that cost us in big games? Dude, we haven't even given him a chance yet to even show us how raw he is.

I would start him in a heart beat. I would certainly sub him in games to get him PT. What exactly did you see from him where you ascertained the inclination he needed to learn a lot? How many times did you see Chiellini make a mistake? Or legro? Or grygera? Or Moli? It is insane to say he is too raw but our current crop at defense makes plenty of mistakes themselves.

And the only way is to play a lot of serie A competition you say? He would play with us, and what makes you so certain he will play at another club? Maybe the pressure there at being a foreigner at another club will make him crumble. Maybe being the young kid that no one there wants will get to him? Whatever team he goes to, he will be surrounded by players that are part of a project...part of a bigger picture, except him. How do you think that makes a young player feel? "Well, the club I played for my whole life doesn't think I'm good enough, they don't want me, the team I play for on loan is awkward because I don't feel part of the project...etc. etc." Look what happened to Criscito. He got tired of being a fucking pawn in a chess game and now he is loving life at a club that believed in him. Your post was random piece of thoughtlessness.

No, it makes no sense at all when:

1) You have no control over the kid's training regime for the season.
2) You cannot have your own coaches train the kid.
3) You're trying to build a team for the future, developing relationships on and off the pitch with individuals on said team.
4) You don't even know if the kid will get playing time at the other club.

Basically, this loaning thing is nothing more that freeing up space on the team sheet. Everything else is bullshit, including experience. Nobody factors in the experience the kid gets while training with the team, playing in reserve matches, playing Coppa, et cetera. Totally forgetting that experience also includes playing with your teammates here... it's not like this is singles tennis.

If he stays, he will learn from his entire surrounds and all the while he will feel part of a project. Its a family, and going on loan you can't help but feel like the adopted kid. Its better to stay, learn from YOUR coach and YOUR team.

Yeah, which he can do, practicing every day with our own team.

The experience which a player gets solely through training with great players, great coaches, and practice matches is obviously of high importance to development. But there comes a time when young players need truly competitive action, to cement what they have learned, and to improve under pressure. If they cannot get that at their own club, it makes sense for them to get it elsewhere as long as the training facilities and personnell at the LOAN club are of a decent standard. I doubt very much that Ciro would let any of our young players head to clubs where he thought their involvement in training and proper matches could prove at all detrimental to their development. Also, if a player does go out on loan and doesn't get a game, they can be recalled, as long as that is stipulated in the loan agreement. Same applies if we lose two centrebacks to a random Wolverine attack...

Giovinco would not be a first team regular now had he stayed with us, rather than gone to empoli, because we had a coach who was uninterested in using him in his natural position.

Our coaches can not teach a player what competitive action can teach them. Its that simple.

Ariaudo himself would surely be more confident and useful to us if he plays a season at Livorno, does well, develops his own game through the hustle and bustle of competitive, meaningful matches where there is always much at stake...than if he spends the whole season at Juve, playing perhaps a couple of coppa games, unless we face anyone decent in the early rounds. He is now sitting behind Chiellini, Cannavaro, Legro and Caceres. I can imagine problems with Canna and Legro, but then Caceres will play. At left back, we have 3 players...Right back, two.

Yes its a risk...but I think that Ciro has a decent understanding of how young players are trained at our club and other clubs, and also, of the importance of first team action in regards to player development. I trust him.

How can you be so sure Gio wouldn't be a first team regular if he hadn't been loaned? Maybe if he would have stayed, started over an over the hill nedved and tired DP then maybe he would be our starter and we wouldn't have needed to spend 25m dollars on an import. Gio never played as much as he should have last season, we all begged for it but it never happened. We all knew he was capable of it. Now we all seem to be ok with him riding the bench and getting 15 mins here and there, like last year. Why the turn around with everyone? Now we have Melo to do the same for Marchisio. So why don't we just sell our youths and make money off of them instead of loaning and wasting on the bench as backups.

Maybe Ariaudo will be more confident coming in off the bench or starting some games with Buffon behind him guiding him, Chiellini, Zebina, Caceres and Cannavaro along side him (and Legro) all the while Ciro teach day in and day out in training versus some no named below average players and coaches teaching him at some smaller club? Answer that for me if all the games he plays at a small club, losing 75% of the games, allowing goal after goal to better teams against better players making the his loan team look bad when he could be playing for a better team, better players, winning games with a more positive winning atmosphere. How is that good for him at a small, lower level team? I would not find playing for a team that loses and concedes more often than score very beneficial to my development.

Do you folks who are so against the idea of loaning out some of our youngsters seriously think that Ciro would let any player he valued as a potential first team player, of the future, get lost in a team of hacks and become bench fodder????

If you think that, you clearly have little faith in our manager.

For older players, loans are more often than not, arranged to get a player off a club's books, to give him the chance to earn a new contract elsewhere, or for him to shine brightly and prove a point to the manager of his official club.

For young players, it gives them the chance to develop under competitive match conditions, and to in the process, show their true manager what they can do, that they are ready.

I have zero suspicion that any of our youngsters who are loaned out, will be left to rot, and not checked out, regularly by scouts or our youth coaches. Especially, if they are earmarked for a future possible first team role. That would be unproffesional and failing to work towards the club's best interests.

There are obvious benefits of staying with us, but there are also benefits of going to another team, improving under match conditions, and putting their Juve training into practice.

Wherever any of our youngsters go, they will be watched. Their links with Juve will not be severed, at all. Not under Ciro.

Ciro, like all of our coaches is too busy focusing on his team winning. The club just spent in excess of 50m and the pressure is on him to develop. I think he needs to clear out room in the locker room. Sure, he helped developed him as a youth, but I see Ciro as more than a coach that loans like Ranieri was. But, regardless Ciro is under pressure to win now, that is his priority. Hopefully Ariaudo stays, I will be sad if Ciro allows him to go on loan.

Yeah, and all that pressure mounts on the player as well because he knows if he flops, he has no future in his original team.

And we saw how great loaning out Criscito was, too. Now he'd rather not come back.

People are too focused on Serie A playing experience and overlook other areas of player development. Again, if this is such a great way to train youngsters, then why don't Barcelona or Arsenal treat their starlets the same way?

We all know the answer, but people don't want to admit it.

EXACTLY. Ariaudo the whole time will be thinking I better not fuck up because Juve won't want me back and in his mind he will be telling himself "I hope I don't end up like Criscito."

Carlos Vela was loaned out and he has heeps of potential not forgetting kieron gibbs last year,senderos,traore and injanuary alone they loaned out 5 youngsters

barca dont loan out youngsters but look at what that has done to the likes of giovanni dos santos and caceres who have found a lot of quality and established players ahead of them

and ppl keep bitching bout loans...we had fukin ruineri who was as dumb as a fukin ant but with ciro weve already seen how hes integrated marchisio,giovinco and to a lesser extent marrone into the first team

if ciro thinks this is the right move then im all for it

He hasn't integrated Gio/Marchisio any more than Ranieri has. Marrone has played a few minutes yes, but so did Ariaudo last season so its not really any different than last year.

 

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[Juve Libnan]

maybe hustini and letsbrushurteeth should take the reins at juventus

u gusy seem to think that no one here understands anything but you guys do

so why arent you guys in charge of juve then

 

[Hust]

Basically it comes down to this between Andy and myself and the rest of you:


Andy and my argument is this and why its bad to loan. Here are our reasons:

1.) No control over how much he plays at another club.
2.) No control about what he is being taught.
3.) No control if its a winning or LOSING team and most times its a losing team. I never heard of a player being loaned in Serie A to a winning top 3 team. Ex. Balotell would never be loaned to Juve.
4.) Shows no confidence from Juve towards the player at all.
5.) Makes the player feel like not part of the project.
6.) Makes the player be forced to develop under immense pressure of not having to screw up or else his club won't want him back.
7.) Be forced to be part of a team (loan team) where he isn't part of the big picture or long term project. Basically a quick fix.
8.) Surrounded by worse players.
9.) Surrounded by worse coaches.
10.) Playing for losing or below average club, how the hell is that beneficial.
11.) He isn't able to feel a part of the team (juve). To leave then come back knowing your club is already looking or already has bought a player in your position, thus making you wonder what the hell the loan was even for.
12.) You don't have any control of how the kid trains or what his training regime is.
13.) Unmotivates our current primavera knowning they will get loaned eventually.
14.) You get instances like Criscito where we (juve) end up getting fucked.



And all you guys that agree to loans, this is all you can come up with:

1.) Gain expereince.






Brilliant, well Andy and myself can go on and on why loans are so bad, this is just some of the reasons. Let me or him know if you guys come up with something other than that ONE reason.

 

[Hust]

maybe hustini and letsbrushurteeth should take the reins at juventus

u gusy seem to think that no one here understands anything but you guys do

so why arent you guys in charge of juve then

Ask Barcelona why they never loaned out their players and what it was like winning the treble last year with players they developed and produced day in and day out. Let me know what they say.

 

[Bjerknes]

Thank you.

Probably one of my most favorite posts. Ever. I may as well highlight the entire thing in bold, perfect. All of it.

Yep, if we had kept them and played them regularly they would be more cemented into our team than they are now and maybe we would see a more effective youth system. All our talents waste away at some smaller club where we have no hand in their development or playing time only to come back to find we spent 20million dollars on a player in their position. Happened to every singled player we have that has mass potential. What is the point in having a youth system and develop great talents if your only going to import a player to take their spot?

I am going to have 6 kids, raise them for 5 years each, then send each to different foster parents for a year and hope they get real life experience from their foster parents and bring them back and hope for the best. Actually, I am going to send them out, adopt 6 to replace the 6 that were mine, bring back my 6 and keep the ones I like and sell the ones I don't like. That way, I have 6 that make me the most happy.

This post (your reply) is absolutely thoughtless. You say Ariaudo is raw but when has he made a mistake? When has he messed up that resulted in a goal or a FK close to our goal? How many times has Chiellini fucked up? Why don't we send Chiellini on loan to Livorno with Ariaudo to gain more experience so he doesn't make stupid ass mistakes that cost us in big games? Dude, we haven't even given him a chance yet to even show us how raw he is.

I would start him in a heart beat. I would certainly sub him in games to get him PT. What exactly did you see from him where you ascertained the inclination he needed to learn a lot? How many times did you see Chiellini make a mistake? Or legro? Or grygera? Or Moli? It is insane to say he is too raw but our current crop at defense makes plenty of mistakes themselves.

And the only way is to play a lot of serie A competition you say? He would play with us, and what makes you so certain he will play at another club? Maybe the pressure there at being a foreigner at another club will make him crumble. Maybe being the young kid that no one there wants will get to him? Whatever team he goes to, he will be surrounded by players that are part of a project...part of a bigger picture, except him. How do you think that makes a young player feel? "Well, the club I played for my whole life doesn't think I'm good enough, they don't want me, the team I play for on loan is awkward because I don't feel part of the project...etc. etc." Look what happened to Criscito. He got tired of being a fucking pawn in a chess game and now he is loving life at a club that believed in him. Your post was random piece of thoughtlessness.

If he stays, he will learn from his entire surrounds and all the while he will feel part of a project. Its a family, and going on loan you can't help but feel like the adopted kid. Its better to stay, learn from YOUR coach and YOUR team.



How can you be so sure Gio wouldn't be a first team regular if he hadn't been loaned? Maybe if he would have stayed, started over an over the hill nedved and tired DP then maybe he would be our starter and we wouldn't have needed to spend 25m dollars on an import. Gio never played as much as he should have last season, we all begged for it but it never happened. We all knew he was capable of it. Now we all seem to be ok with him riding the bench and getting 15 mins here and there, like last year. Why the turn around with everyone? Now we have Melo to do the same for Marchisio. So why don't we just sell our youths and make money off of them instead of loaning and wasting on the bench as backups.

Maybe Ariaudo will be more confident coming in off the bench or starting some games with Buffon behind him guiding him, Chiellini, Zebina, Caceres and Cannavaro along side him (and Legro) all the while Ciro teach day in and day out in training versus some no named below average players and coaches teaching him at some smaller club? Answer that for me if all the games he plays at a small club, losing 75% of the games, allowing goal after goal to better teams against better players making the his loan team look bad when he could be playing for a better team, better players, winning games with a more positive winning atmosphere. How is that good for him at a small, lower level team? I would not find playing for a team that loses and concedes more often than score very beneficial to my development.

Ciro, like all of our coaches is too busy focusing on his team winning. The club just spent in excess of 50m and the pressure is on him to develop. I think he needs to clear out room in the locker room. Sure, he helped developed him as a youth, but I see Ciro as more than a coach that loans like Ranieri was. But, regardless Ciro is under pressure to win now, that is his priority. Hopefully Ariaudo stays, I will be sad if Ciro allows him to go on loan.

EXACTLY. Ariaudo the whole time will be thinking I better not fuck up because Juve won't want me back and in his mind he will be telling himself "I hope I don't end up like Criscito."


He hasn't integrated Gio/Marchisio any more than Ranieri has. Marrone has played a few minutes yes, but so did Ariaudo last season so its not really any different than last year.

Top notch stuff, Cam.

Claiming that Giovinco wouldn't get any playing time now if he was not loaned out is simply ludicrous. Either way, imbecile Ranieri wouldn't have played him, but at least Seba would have more years under his belt at Juve.

And at your kids idea. That's basically what this turns out to be.

maybe hustini and letsbrushurteeth should take the reins at juventus

u gusy seem to think that no one here understands anything but you guys do

so why arent you guys in charge of juve then

Or perhaps you shouldn't participate in this forum if you can't handle a discussion, what this place is all about.

 

[Bjerknes]

6.) Makes the player be forced to develop under immense pressure of not having to screw up or else his club won't want him back.
7.) Be forced to be part of a team (loan team) where he isn't part of the big picture or long term project. Basically a quick fix.
8.) Surrounded by worse players.
9.) Surrounded by worse coaches.
10.) Playing for losing or below average club, how the hell is that beneficial.

These are also problems.

Honestly, these loans are starting to become more insane the more I think about them.

 

[Hust]

Top notch stuff, Cam.

Claiming that Giovinco wouldn't get any playing time now if he was not loaned out is simply ludicrous. Either way, imbecile Ranieri wouldn't have played him, but at least Seba would have more years under his belt at Juve.

And at your kids idea. That's basically what this turns out to be.



Or perhaps you shouldn't participate in this forum if you can't handle a discussion, what this place is all about.

Grazie, sorry it took me so long to respond, I was at work. I am pleased to see you held shit down while I was away...so I had BLOOM post to catch up.

 

[Hust]

These are also problems.

Honestly, these loans are starting to become more insane the more I think about them.

Yeah...their 1 is pretty important though, apparently we missed that boat.

 

[Lo-Pan]

Hustini, you make sense, and your own comments are logical. Teeth though, has this aggressive tendency to use insults to add weight to his arguments...which always, renders his points, less forceful and worthy of consideration than they would be, without the personal criticisms of the posters, more than the points he is fighting against.

There are clearly Pros and Cons to The Loan Routine.

To me, its often a good move. As its a lot easier for a manager to see what a player is truly capable of, if that player is playing competitive games than if he is not, than if he is waiting for 5 players in front of him the pecking order for his particular position to get injured or suspended, all at the same time, forcing his manager into chucking him into the deep end.

Yes, I like the idea of lets say Ariuado, staying and getting the odd 10-15 minutes here and there. But I also like the idea of him going to a club and gaining a competitive edge that he simply cannot gain without playing competitive matches.

Its a lovely idea to draw parallels between a human child and its natural parents, but its also wide of the mark, because some of these loaned players will see a loan move as a chance to show their true club what they can do if they are given the chance in competitive action.

I don't think that marchisio and giovinco are worse for wear as a result of their time at empoli...

You can use barca as an example of an ultra succesful club, who never loans their players, who are about to loan us a very bright defensive prospect...hohoho!

And I can use Manchester United, an example of an ultra successful club who loan players regularly, especially their young guns.

Pros and Cons. Not one side of this argument is obviously Right. So, I can understand and accept your concerns, and hope that whatever happens, in this case, with Ariuado, its in his best interests and the clubs.

 

[Hust]

Hustini, you make sense, and your own comments are logical. Teeth though, has this aggressive tendency to use insults to add weight to his arguments...which always, renders his points, less forceful and worthy of consideration than they would be, without the personal criticisms of the posters, more than the points he is fighting against.

There are clearly Pros and Cons to The Loan Routine.

To me, its often a good move. As its a lot easier for a manager to see what a player is truly capable of, if that player is playing competitive games than if he is not, than if he is waiting for 5 players in front of him the pecking order for his particular position to get injured or suspended, all at the same time, forcing his manager into chucking him into the deep end.

Yes, I like the idea of lets say Ariuado, staying and getting the odd 10-15 minutes here and there. But I also like the idea of him going to a club and gaining a competitive edge that he simply cannot gain without playing competitive matches.

Its a lovely idea to draw parallels between a human child and its natural parents, but its also wide of the mark, because some of these loaned players will see a loan move as a chance to show their true club what they can do if they are given the chance in competitive action.

I don't think that marchisio and giovinco are worse for wear as a result of their time at empoli...

You can use barca as an example of an ultra succesful club, who never loans their players, who are about to loan us a very bright defensive prospect...hohoho!

And I can use Manchester United, an example of an ultra successful club who loan players regularly, especially their young guns.

Pros and Cons. Not one side of this argument is obviously Right. So, I can understand and accept your concerns, and hope that whatever happens, in this case, with Ariuado, its in his best interests and the clubs.

I just tried to think of the most extreme far-fetched example I could think ofumpkin:

 

[Juve Libnan]

Hustini, you make sense, and your own comments are logical. Teeth though, has this aggressive tendency to use insults to add weight to his arguments...which always, renders his points, less forceful and worthy of consideration than they would be, without the personal criticisms of the posters, more than the points he is fighting against.

There are clearly Pros and Cons to The Loan Routine.

To me, its often a good move. As its a lot easier for a manager to see what a player is truly capable of, if that player is playing competitive games than if he is not, than if he is waiting for 5 players in front of him the pecking order for his particular position to get injured or suspended, all at the same time, forcing his manager into chucking him into the deep end.

Yes, I like the idea of lets say Ariuado, staying and getting the odd 10-15 minutes here and there. But I also like the idea of him going to a club and gaining a competitive edge that he simply cannot gain without playing competitive matches.

Its a lovely idea to draw parallels between a human child and its natural parents, but its also wide of the mark, because some of these loaned players will see a loan move as a chance to show their true club what they can do if they are given the chance in competitive action.

I don't think that marchisio and giovinco are worse for wear as a result of their time at empoli...

You can use barca as an example of an ultra succesful club, who never loans their players, who are about to loan us a very bright defensive prospect...hohoho!

And I can use Manchester United, an example of an ultra successful club who loan players regularly, especially their young guns.

Pros and Cons. Not one side of this argument is obviously Right. So, I can understand and accept your concerns, and hope that whatever happens, in this case, with Ariuado, its in his best interests and the clubs.

this is how a discussion is held.i really like your posts man..good stuff

and to teeth,weedguru is so fkn right.u always try to insult ppl when replying yet i dont see anyone else resorting to such a tactic when trying to explain their thoughts

and you keep giving barcelona as an example..weddguru said it look at man utd,chelsea(just loaned di santo whos a bright prospect),even real gave away negredo and granero who i hold in high reagrd and im sure both wouldnt have been anywhere near successful had they stayed and rotted on madrids bench

even ac milan who are fuking retarded for losing gourcoff but still he didnt show his true value until he was playin week in week out with bordeaux which ancelotti refused to grant him

with inter u said they didnt loan santon or balotelli but you cant really compare ariaudo to those two when those two have shined in big games several times

i mean ariaudos loan has its pro and cons like ehting in life does but srsly what has he done for you guys to say he deserves to stay and not get lloaned out...

 

[Hust]

@Weeds: Your're probably one of the few members that I will consisder reading through their entire posts. Though we may disagree on this respect, I do enjoy your well written posts. I must say, you have a colorful vocabulary.


Usually we agree, which in this case we share differing opinions

 

[Hust]

this is how a discussion is held.i really like your posts man..good stuff

and to teeth,weedguru is so fkn right.u always try to insult ppl when replying yet i dont see anyone else resorting to such a tactic when trying to explain their thoughts

and you keep giving barcelona as an example..weddguru said it look at man utd,chelsea(just loaned di santo whos a bright prospect),even real gave away negredo and granero who i hold in high reagrd and im sure both wouldnt have been anywhere near successful had they stayed and rotted on madrids bench

even ac milan who are fuking retarded for losing gourcoff but still he didnt show his true value until he was playin week in week out with bordeaux which ancelotti refused to grant him

with inter u said they didnt loan santon or balotelli but you cant really compare ariaudo to those two when those two have shined in big games several times

i mean ariaudos loan has its pro and cons like ehting in life does but srsly what has he done for you guys to say he deserves to stay and not get lloaned out...

Well...1) Milan lost Gourcoff and 2.)Balotelli and Santon were given a chance to shine in big games, tell me what big games Ariaudo has been given a chance to shine in. What big games was Criscito given a chance to shine in before Ranieri decided to loan him the first AND second time. Ariaudo won't be able to be given that chance to shine for Juve when he is at Livorno.

 

[Bjerknes]

this is how a discussion is held.i really like your posts man..good stuff

and to teeth,weedguru is so fkn right.u always try to insult ppl when replying yet i dont see anyone else resorting to such a tactic when trying to explain their thoughts

You are absolutely nobody to talk. I mean, you actually posted that you'd love to kill me.

People may not enjoy my posting style, but that's too bad. Most of the time people are not paying attention to what I wrote or they said something insanely stupid. To the people I have a good understanding with, we get along pretty well.

You have no chance of that.

 

[Hust]

You are absolutely nobody to talk. I mean, you actually posted that you'd love to kill me.

People may not enjoy my posting style, but that's too bad. Most of the time people are not paying attention to what I wrote or they said something insanely stupid. To the people I have a good understanding with, we get along pretty well.

You have no chance of that.

I'm not sure we have ever disagreed on anything, have we?


(Minus Cannavaro coming back)....

 

[Bjerknes]

I'm not sure we have ever disagreed on anything, have we?


(Minus Cannavaro coming back)....

We've probably disagreed with things, but I can respect you for obvious reasons, just like many others here. You're not full of crap.

 

[Juve Libnan]

Well...1) Milan lost Gourcoff and 2.)Balotelli and Santon were given a chance to shine in big games, tell me what big games Ariaudo has been given a chance to shine in. What big games was Criscito given a chance to shine in before Ranieri decided to loan him the first AND second time. Ariaudo won't be able to be given that chance to shine for Juve when he is at Livorno.

you forgetting how totti completely owned criscito in our early days back in serie a...he was a big disappointment for us and was becnhed after having 4-5 starts cuz he simply wasnt playing at an acceptable level

 

[Juve Libnan]

You are absolutely nobody to talk. I mean, you actually posted that you'd love to kill me.

People may not enjoy my posting style, but that's too bad. Most of the time people are not paying attention to what I wrote or they said something insanely stupid. To the people I have a good understanding with, we get along pretty well.

You have no chance of that.

dude ur so full of urself thinking ur some great football manager in the making...

id love to beat the shit out of you after you tried time and time again to insult me by making fun of where i came from when several members on this forum share the same nationality i do

if im not mistaken you wanted rossi's legs broken..so ur no one to talk either and trust me i aint losing sleep over how we dont get along

hell i never wana get along with some racist dung shit...

 

[Hust]

you forgetting how totti completely owned criscito in our early days back in serie a...he was a big disappointment for us and was becnhed after having 4-5 starts cuz he simply wasnt playing at an acceptable level

Totti has owned the best defenders in the world. Hell, Pellisier owned chiellini with a hat trick last year so should we loan him for that and the countless errors he has made in the last 2 seasons? So maybe we should have loaned Tiago then after 2 horrible seasons? Nah, he was able to stay and earn is spot after TWO WHOLE SEASONS nevermind Ariaudo with 2 games last year and a couple friendlies. Great chance there to prove himself. Criscito did not have a horrible games by the way. Dude, Totti owned him yes, but the best players in the world own people all the time. So by your argument, all those people that got owned by world class talents should be loaned? PUHLEASE

 

[Hust]

Maybe he had a dumb ass coach that would never give him the proper guidance, position, or chances.