Kingsley Coman (16 Viewers)

KB824

Senior Member
Sep 16, 2003
31,671
- scored a goal in a Champions League final (a header lol)

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He wanted to go to Bayern. Makes perfect sense for his way of playing. That's it.

Thread is cancer.

Just because you disagree does not mean the thread is "Cancer"

Say what you want about how good he is or isn't but the fact remains that Bayern trusted him enough to start in a CL final, and he delivered.

What is "cancer" though, is our policy of having no patience with any of our youth. That is much more problematic than a player that we let get away.

I'm curious though as to what exactly we did with that 28 million.
 

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JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
72,276
Just because you disagree does not mean the thread is "Cancer"

Say what you want about how good he is or isn't but the fact remains that Bayern trusted him enough to start in a CL final, and he delivered.

What is "cancer" though, is our policy of having no patience with any of our youth. That is much more problematic than a player that we let get away.

I'm curious though as to what exactly we did with that 28 million.
There are lots of mediocre players who have started a CL final. It's not the holy grail of determining a player's worth. Bayern are a top team with lots of players more important than Coman. We have become absolutely obsessed with anything and everything around this competition. And the final is 90 minutes of football.

It's cancer because it's the shoulda, woulda, coulda hindsight bs that to me isn't even relevant when a player wanted to leave. A 19 year old who has played a handful of games and wants to leave - thanks and goodbye.

The thread was dead before he scored that goal, then all of a sudden it's a grave mistake again. Please...

Our policy is pretty trash, I agree with that, but then it's always been a bit more difficult here than in Germany to use young players. It's the same across all top teams. Coman seemed like a big talent even if a little rough and overrated, but his career has not been that great for several reasons. Now he can dine out on that goal for the rest of his career now so he doesn't care. However Juve's part in his story is not going to be re-written because of it.
 

DAiDEViL

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2015
62,568
There are lots of mediocre players who have started a CL final. It's not the holy grail of determining a player's worth. Bayern are a top team with lots of players more important than Coman. We have become absolutely obsessed with anything and everything around this competition. And the final is 90 minutes of football.

It's cancer because it's the shoulda, woulda, coulda hindsight bs that to me isn't even relevant when a player wanted to leave. A 19 year old who has played a handful of games and wants to leave - thanks and goodbye.

The thread was dead before he scored that goal, then all of a sudden it's a grave mistake again. Please...
:heart:
 

pavluska

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
7,339
Yesterday I found out I'm an Allegri hater (lmao).

Today I'm finding out Coman was sold not because he wanted to leave due to lack of playing time but because he wasn't good enough.

Wonder what's in store for tomorrow.
 

KB824

Senior Member
Sep 16, 2003
31,671
There are lots of mediocre players who have started a CL final. It's not the holy grail of determining a player's worth. Bayern are a top team with lots of players more important than Coman. We have become absolutely obsessed with anything and everything around this competition. And the final is 90 minutes of football.

It's cancer because it's the shoulda, woulda, coulda hindsight bs that to me isn't even relevant when a player wanted to leave. A 19 year old who has played a handful of games and wants to leave - thanks and goodbye.

The thread was dead before he scored that goal, then all of a sudden it's a grave mistake again. Please...

Our policy is pretty trash, I agree with that, but then it's always been a bit more difficult here than in Germany to use young players. It's the same across all top teams. Coman seemed like a big talent even if a little rough and overrated, but his career has not been that great for several reasons. Now he can dine out on that goal for the rest of his career now so he doesn't care. However Juve's part in his story is not going to be re-written because of it.
And it's because of this that we are now in the situation that we are in, whereas our earlier successes were built on smart purchases, and patience. 2 CL finals under this approach.

Now, even WITH arguably the greatest of all time on this squad, we are actually further away from that than when we were before. And this isn't about trying to re-write anyone's history at Juve. He never got a chance for it to be written.

- - - Updated - - -

And you also state that it is "easier" in Germany to do this. It might be because this is a process that they have always followed, and that goes for the whole of Bundesliga, not just the Bayern's or Borussia's of the league.

Italy is doing themselves a disservice by not at least trying to follow some sort of similar model

Take a look at some of the top teams in the world right now, and take a look at how many young players are being used. It's not some anomaly, or restricted to one league.
 

Cerval

Senior Member
Feb 20, 2016
26,829
I don't get this masochistic habit from Tuz to revisit past team player thread when they do good and torturing themselves with 'what ifs'

Let it go. Coman is nothing special, at least do that with a great player.

Had Molinaro or Matuidi scored a CL final goal we'd witness the same thing
 

Zzak

Senior Member
Sep 11, 2014
523
It was the right decision to sell him. He's no world beater and has no end product. Pereyra type of player.
Apart from the goal and that penalty claim when the dribbled on the outside he was nothing special last night.
Pacey and technically gifted but really low footballing IQ.
 

Boksic

Senior Member
May 11, 2005
13,380
Take the final out of the equation.

Out of the deal we got one season with Benatia as a starter (which he did very well in) and a season and a half as a backup. Then sold him for 8m.

Coman has not developed as much as I would have thought but was clearly in the upward trend in his career and Benatia the opposite.

Given their values today, our lack of wingers and how much we used Benatia it was a poor deal and another example of our short term thinking.
 

Juliano13

Senior Member
May 6, 2012
5,016
It was the right decision to sell him. He's no world beater and has no end product. Pereyra type of player.
Apart from the goal and that penalty claim when the dribbled on the outside he was nothing special last night.
Pacey and technically gifted but really low footballing IQ.
So, he scored a goal and had a legit penalty claim but other than that..
 

jukazem

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2007
4,757
There are lots of mediocre players who have started a CL final. It's not the holy grail of determining a player's worth. Bayern are a top team with lots of players more important than Coman. We have become absolutely obsessed with anything and everything around this competition. And the final is 90 minutes of football.

The thread was dead before he scored that goal, then all of a sudden it's a grave mistake again. Please...
CL final (90 minutes of football) is most certainly the holy grail of determining a player's worth. It also highlights preferences a lot when many Juve fans were confused why Perisic didn't start ahead of him.
 

JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
72,276
And it's because of this that we are now in the situation that we are in, whereas our earlier successes were built on smart purchases, and patience. 2 CL finals under this approach.

Now, even WITH arguably the greatest of all time on this squad, we are actually further away from that than when we were before. And this isn't about trying to re-write anyone's history at Juve. He never got a chance for it to be written.

- - - Updated - - -

And you also state that it is "easier" in Germany to do this. It might be because this is a process that they have always followed, and that goes for the whole of Bundesliga, not just the Bayern's or Borussia's of the league.

Italy is doing themselves a disservice by not at least trying to follow some sort of similar model

Take a look at some of the top teams in the world right now, and take a look at how many young players are being used. It's not some anomaly, or restricted to one league.
There are other teams in Italy trying to follow this model, but we struggle with it. We need 19 year old ready-made champions. Pogba, De Ligt, probably Kulusevski next year. Maybe that's because now we feel like we are entitled to win the scudetto each season, we cannot take a step back to take two forward, so we take these little steps with young players and fill most of the squad with players 27 or older. But there is also clear evidence that Serie A is a league where you can play for longer, it's less physical and more tactical, and the level has dropped in the last 15 years. So it becomes an easier option to take this choice. For me it's stupid, because you are not creating book value on the playing staff. Even if we sold a player like Coman every couple of seasons for big plusvalenza that makes far more sense to inject cash into the club.

We should judge players as individuals as well, rather than just say 'oh it's just Juve not giving a kid a chance'. That is an easy response, but Coman wanted to leave. I noticed Capello saying before the final that Coman was the same mistake Juve made with Henry. Coman and Henry, jesus christ, what a comparison. It's chalk and cheese comparing a legend from an era gone by. Look at that Juve team then. As if relic Capello would have played Coman himself. It's an easy comment to make without really thinking about it.

Would be nice to see Juve transform into a team who produces a few young players to compliment the first team, but that model is very much in its infancy in regards to the Primavera and U23. Maybe we'll see the benefits a few more years down the line. What we should be doing is trying for more of the better young players before they become expensive wonderkids, because this is another problem - we don't have the money to keep signing them. We are hundreds of millions short of your Bayerns, Barfas, Yanited etc, and we don't develop our own players like they do either.

I don't think it's an easy job to put a Juve team together that wants to remain competitive and future-proof. I think other teams have far better conditions for it. But Paratici and co get the big bucks to do that. When I see the signings we make I don't have great confidence. They can't all be De Ligt or Kulusevski or Berna (yes he was a top prospect at the time) but we seem to have no structure to what we are doing, and the coaching changes don't aid that.
 

BayernFan

Senior Member
Feb 17, 2016
6,805
He won us the big ears trophy yesterday but he's still lacking brain on the final third.

I'll forever be grateful to him for this goal but else I can't say he's a special player. He looked very good under Don Jupp where it seemed he was about to turn into a great player but it never happened.
 
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JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
72,276
I don't get this masochistic habit from Tuz to revisit past team player thread when they do good and torturing themselves with 'what ifs'

Let it go. Coman is nothing special, at least do that with a great player.

Had Molinaro or Matuidi scored a CL final goal we'd witness the same thing
The Kean thread is quiet simply because he's been pretty crap for Everton. As if Everton is Juve is Bayern. We can only really judge what is in front of us at the time.
 

Juventinoo

Ertuğrul Oğlu Osman
Oct 20, 2004
3,647
He won us the big ears trophy yesterday but he's still lacking brain on the final third.

I'll forever be grateful to him for this goal but else I can't say he's a special player. He looked very good under Don Jupp where it seemed he was about to turn into a great player but it never happened.
How it feels wining the CL ? :depressed::moan::sigh:
 

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