In the category 'redundant': Catholicism (7 Viewers)

[Slagathor]

Nice

Actually, it may go along with that, yeah. As we start to slow down, it suddenly dawns on one that one is not immortal (at least not in an earthly sense ). You see too much to be able to ignore Divine intervention. Or miracles (trust me on that one).

I think that would require a religious upbringing/background though

 

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[Bjerknes]

Much like President Bush is the representitive of my country the fact does not resign me to agreeing with the man and does not make me feel ashamed about where I'm from and about my country. And for people who question what exactly I stand for...I was hoping that a younger, more progressive candidate would have been named the new Pope, obviously in concurance with what I believe..

 

[Bjerknes]

IMO that's because you become religious because you're scared.

I'm sorry but that's utter crap. You use that as an argument every time yet it's an extremely unfair statement and smacks of superiority. It has nothing to do with fear..

 

[Tifoso]

IMO that's because you become religious because you're scared. It sounds logical to me you suddenly start believing in God. Because if there turns out to be one and you're wrong, that'll pretty much suck.

However there's another reason to be agnostic:

When you're a christian for example, a great deal of your life will basically consist of suffering, since you can't do certain things. Then when you get up there in heaven it turns out you were wrong. So you'll be made to suffer for all eternity. The odds of you picking out the right religion are pretty slim, so being agnostic is a safer bet.

Of course it consists of suffering. It consists of suffering for everyone actually. For the believer it is redemptive, however.

Muggeridge said it perfectly: "As I look back on my life (he was an agnostic who converted to RC in his 80's, I believe) I am struck that I have only learned through suffering". I think he was correct.

 

[Seven]

IMO that's because you become religious because you're scared.

I'm sorry but that's utter crap. You use that as an argument every time yet it's an extremely unfair statement and smacks of superiority. It has nothing to do with fear..

I'm not alone in that opinon. It's not utter crap. I explained why I thought so. If you say it's utter crap I'd like you to dismiss my arguments. Simply stating I'm wrong is not sufficient, Andy.

 

[Seven]

Of course it consists of suffering. It consists of suffering for everyone actually. For the believer it is redemptive, however.

Muggeridge said it perfectly: "As I look back on my life (he was an agnostic who converted to RC in his 80's, I believe) I am struck that I have only learned through suffering". I think he was correct.

Yeah? So what if you didn't suffer but have fun? What's bad about that?

 

[Bjerknes]

IMO that's because you become religious because you're scared.

I'm not alone in that opinon. It's not utter crap. I explained why I thought so. If you say it's utter crap I'd like you to dismiss my arguments. Simply stating I'm wrong is not sufficient, Andy.

Its simple...faith is not found because of fear and believing in some form of a heavenly being is no more ridiculous than what you or other athiests believe in. It makes as little sense as me stating those who move away from the church are weak because they cannot adhere to the rules of the chruch. Most catholics I know don't live their lives in fear and live good lives, in which they do no harm to anybody else in this world. That is what this religion is about...and it starts with Baptism.

 

[Tifoso]

I think that would require a religious upbringing/background though

It didn't for the first Christians (other than the Jews, of course) who were mostly pagans.

Which, interestingly enough, is kinda where many countries find themselves today.

 

[Seven]

Its simple...faith is not found because of fear and believing in some form of a heavenly being is no more ridiculous than what you or other agnostics believe in. It makes as little sense as me stating those who move away from the church are weak because they cannot adhere to the rules of the chruch. Most catholics I know don't live their lives in fear and live good lives, in which they do no harm to anybody else in this world. That is what this religion is about...and it starts with Baptism.

You do know what an agnostic is? We don't know what's out there and with the means we have, we came to the only possible conclusion: namely "we don't have a clue."

 

[Seven]

It didn't for the first Christians (other than the Jews, of course) who were mostly pagans.

Which, interestingly enough, is kinda where many countries find themselves today.

I told you once and I will tell you once again, the reason for the first Christians to be Christian is far less noble than you believe.

 

[Tifoso]

Yeah? So what if you didn't suffer but have fun? What's bad about that?

Christians don't like suffering, we accept suffering as part of the human condition.

Difference is that the suffering doesn't eat us up.

I'd rather be happy, too, of course (which I am).

 

[Seven]

Christians don't like suffering, we accept suffering as part of the human condition.

Difference is that the suffering doesn't eat us up.

I'd rather be happy, too, of course (which I am).

I accept suffering as port of the human condition as well.

What I really meant with "suffering" is having to live by certain rules. And feeling bad about it when you don't succeed in doing so.

 

[Bozi]

as a catholic born to a mixed religion family and working with muslims for years i have never felt that religion decides what makes a person who he is,rather their upbringing. instead of pointing fingers at religious beliefs look at the parents. if someone is intolerant to sexuality,race or beliefs then dont believe that it is the fault oof religion

 

[Tifoso]

I accept suffering as port of the human condition as well.

What I really meant with "suffering" is having to live by certain rules. And feeling bad about it when you don't succeed in doing so.

But when you live by the rules you suffer less. It's just the way it is.

 

[Espectro]

hummm, a discussion about religion... this should end well

 

[Bjerknes]

You do know what an agnostic is? We don't know what's out there and with the means we have, we came to the only possible conclusion: namely "we don't have a clue."

Yes I do and I meant to say athiests.

 

[Tifoso]

as a catholic born to a mixed religion family and working with muslims for years i have never felt that religion decides what makes a person who he is,rather their upbringing. instead of pointing fingers at religious beliefs look at the parents. if someone is intolerant to sexuality,race or beliefs then dont believe that it is the fault oof religion

Exactly.

Put another way....intolerance amongst, say, RC's is not the result of living their religion, but of not living it

 

[Respaul]

It makes as little sense as me stating those who move away from the church are weak because they cannot adhere to the rules of the chruch..

See the problem there is that very few catholics follow their religion either... You dont and i doubt you know anyone short of your priest that does... the only real difference between the average catholic and agnostic, protestant etc is the tag they wish to wear

 

[Seven]

Yes I do and I meant to say athiests.

Oh that entirely changes your point TBH. I'll read your post again.

 

[Seven]

But when you live by the rules you suffer less. It's just the way it is.

In your opinion that is. In my opinion I'd suffer more. And like I said, the likeliness of having to suffer in the afterlife as well is too big.