Giuseppe Marotta (92 Viewers)

[Post Ironic]

I understand that, but I was thinking about players like Zidane, Ronaldo and Bale that Real Madrid got.

And it seems that we misunderstood eachother in this thread.

And to be honest as much I would enjoy buying an established WC player, I still prefer getting a player like Vidal and make him WC in 1-2 years.

It was largely my fault. I was reading a little further back in the thread where people were talking about how we didn't really spend all that much on top players at any point in our history. And I assumed the conversation was continuing along those lines.

I'd say we have always bought stars, the ones just below the very top echelon of world class/superstar players. We've never really bought the Ronaldo, Messi, Bale in the prime of their career type. Those players didn't often get sold until Zidane happened. We did once or twice, but not often. I'd like us to be able to buy the young stars still, who have already shown something, but have the potential to be developed even further here. That's the best model imo.

 

Buy on AliExpress.com

[j0ker]

It was largely my fault. I was reading a little further back in the thread where people were talking about how we didn't really spend all that much on top players at any point in our history. And I assumed the conversation was continuing along those lines.

I'd say we have always bought stars, the ones just below the very top echelon of world class/superstar players. We've never really bought the Ronaldo, Messi, Bale in the prime of their career type. Those players didn't often get sold until Zidane happened. We did once or twice, but not often. I'd like us to be able to buy the young stars still, who have already shown something, but have the potential to be developed even further here. That's the best model imo.

 

[Pirlo's Beard]

Yes, we can't really afford ready made stars in their prime

But I refuse to believe we can't buy a player in the 30-35M range who's in his early 20s and is a gamble, albeit one who has every chance of success.

 

[Suns]

What is world class though? You could easily compare Bale signing to Buffon when we bought him. Both seen as exceptional stars in smaller teams bought expensive by big teams. If Bale was a star when Real bought him then Buffon was a star when we bought him.

Di Maria, James, Khedira, Ramos, Benzema etc etc could all fall into the Trezeguet type of signing. Young up and coming future star who did well in a smaller team and a big team paid big money to get him.

 

[Hydde]

Charles, Platini, Baggio, Emerson?

4 WC players over a 50 year period?

Real Madrid buys 2-3 per season.

Thats why i said they do the same thing on a galactic level. We were momma´s childs in comparison. But is the same principle.

 

[JuveJay]

What is world class though? You could easily compare Bale signing to Buffon when we bought him. Both seen as exceptional stars in smaller teams bought expensive by big teams.

Di Maria, James, Khedira, Ramos, Benzema etc etc could all fall into the Trezeguet type of signing. Young up and coming future star who did well in a smaller team and a big team paid big money to get him.

Buffon is undoubtedly world class and was when we signed him. As were Thuram and Nedved.

James is like Bale (or Pogba, for that matter), pretty much world class but still young enough to take another step to prove it.

The last established world class player we signed was actually the last notable one under Moggi - Vieira (even if he was declining), but before that there were not many. Ibrahimovic wasn't at the time.

 

[Suns]

Buffon is undoubtedly world class and was when we signed him. As were Thuram and Nedved.

James is like Bale (or Pogba, for that matter), pretty much world class but still young enough to take another step to prove it.

The last established world class player we signed was actually the last notable one under Moggi - Vieira (even if he was declining), but before that there were not many. Ibrahimovic wasn't at the time.

We need to distinguish between world class and established world class players. Buying for example Shaqiri or Griezmann for 23m doesn't mean buying a world class player, it still falls under the good ol' Juve strategy of making stars. Calling Barcelona and asking them to sell you Iniesta, that would mean buying a established world class player.

 

[JuveJay]

I agree. Terminology is subjective but I use 'world class' for the real established stars of the game, and 'top class' for those with the ability and just lacking a few years of exposure. Above them a small band of 'legendary', active players who always were predestined to be considering all-time greats (currently Messi and Ronaldo).

 

[Hydde]

Buffon was VERY famous at the time we bought him. He could easily be touted as a "galactico" signing because he was the best goalkeeper around with 23 years ffs. You cant get better than that.

Thuram was already WC champion. He was very rated.

Nedved was not so rated outside of Italy,not like Buffon at least, hence he was not on a "galactico" level internationally... but the ones who followed serie A at the time know he was already top notch in Lazio. Then he came to Juve and reached his prime, turning into a galactico style player after that superb season with us. I remember he was a total nightmare for us everytime we faced lazio.

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

Buffon was VERY famous at the time we bought him. He could easily be touted as a "galactico" signing because he was the best goalkeeper around with 23 years ffs. You cant get better than that.

Thuram was already WC champion. He was very rated.

Nedved was not so rated outside of Italy,not like Buffon at least, hence he was not on a "galactico" level internationally... but the ones who followed serie A at the time know he was already top notch in Lazio. Then he came to Juve and reached his prime, turning into a galactico style player after that superb season with us. I remember he was a total nightmare for us everytime we faced lazio.

WAT

 

[ALC]

I'm a Real Madrid fan now, because I'm a realist about Juventus' spending history. Until the last 10 years, we were one of the highest spending clubs in all of Europe. From the late 70s until 2004 we were one of the highest spending clubs in all Europe.

People need to stop parading this myth that we never spent big and only developed homegrown talent with very occasional big signings. It's just not true. We never bought a lot of 28-30 year old stars, but we spent big on a huge number of James Rodriguez, Toni Kroos, Isco, type and age players. We bought a lot of early to mid twenties stars (with potential to become world-class) for large fees.

You want the evolution of the transfer record...

In 1957 we broke it with Sivori.

In 1968 we broke it with Anastasi.

In 1976 we broke it with Rossi.

In 1990 we broke it with Baggio.

In 1992 we broke it with Vialli.

SO what about Madrid breaking the record twice in 5 years. We broke it twice in 3 years.

From 1952 to 2000 the transfer record was set 22 times. Italian clubs set it 18 of those times. Hence the reason Italy was so successful in European football for that period of time. Especially the late 70s to mid 2000s.

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PS. The summer we sold Zidane, we spent over 177 million on transfers. We brought in 135 mil by selling Zidane and Inzaghi at big profits and Kovacevic at a loss. And then spent quite a bit more.

The biggest mistake we made in that window was selling Inzaghi to Milan for 37 mil and then spending 25 mil on Salas. So stupid. We could have kept Inzaghi, and not gone for Salas. All for a measly 12 mil.

Juve was like United. Serie A now just has no money, it's not like money just appeared out of nowhere and only English and Spanish teams are getting it.

I understand that, but I was thinking about players like Zidane, Ronaldo and Bale that Real Madrid got.

It seems that we misunderstood eachother in this thread.

And to be honest as much I would enjoy buying an established WC player, I still prefer getting a player like Vidal and make him WC in 1-2 years, and keep him of course.

Except that Vidal's not even close to the world class players we're mentioning

 

[Hydde]

"NOT LIKE BUFFFON”

 

[Zacheryah]

The sad part is that unlike real madrid we never managed to get impossibly far ahead of the rest

 

[Post Ironic]

The sad part is that unlike real madrid we never managed to get impossibly far ahead of the rest

We went to 3 CL finals in a row, and won like 12 International trophies in 20 or so years. We had bad luck in CL finals otherwise we would be considered one of the most successful CL clubs of all time. That 20 year period won us all our European trophies which places us at fourth all time in the number won.

When has Madrid gone to 3 CL finals (aside from the 50s of course) in a row? We were certainly on level from 83-86 and 96-98 of where Madrid is now.

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Buffon was VERY famous at the time we bought him. He could easily be touted as a "galactico" signing because he was the best goalkeeper around with 23 years ffs. You cant get better than that.

Thuram was already WC champion. He was very rated.

Nedved was not so rated outside of Italy,not like Buffon at least, hence he was not on a "galactico" level internationally... but the ones who followed serie A at the time know he was already top notch in Lazio. Then he came to Juve and reached his prime, turning into a galactico style player after that superb season with us. I remember he was a total nightmare for us everytime we faced lazio.

Nedved cost us 41 million 12 years ago. The only bigger transfers I can think of by Madrid right now are Bale, C Ronaldo, James, Kaka, Zidane, Ronaldo (only 4 mil more than Nedved year after). Pretty select company. We could easily have bought players like Isco and Sanchez in the 90s and early 00s and we did. Frequently.

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

Juve was like United. Serie A now just has no money, it's not like money just appeared out of nowhere and only English and Spanish teams are getting it.



Except that Vidal's not even close to the world class players we're mentioning

Nonsense

14/15
Transfers Expenses

Serie A - 283.687.360 £
Bundesliga - 250.672.400 £
La Liga - 422.731.760 £
Premier League - 916.608.000 £
Ligue 1 - 117.968.400 £

13/14
Serie A - 461.133.200 £
Bundesliga - 264.598.400 £
La Liga - 361.988.000 £
Premier Leauge - 805.525.600 £
Ligue 1 - 381.198.400 £

 

[Zacheryah]

We went to 3 CL finals in a row, and won like 12 International trophies in 20 or so years. We had bad luck in CL finals otherwise we would be considered one of the most successful CL clubs of all time. That 20 year period won us all our European trophies which places us at fourth all time in the number won.

When has Madrid gone to 3 CL finals in a row? We were certainly on level from 83-86 and 96-98 of where Madrid is now.

I dont mean sportive wise, i mean financialwise. Juve broke records when the fee's were still relatively small (newcastle for example broke it with shearer at some point).

But when the numbers vastly increased, We completely stopped beeing a big spender. When the numbers exploded, we didnt really follow along. Check our spending between '95 and now.

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Nonsense

14/15
Transfers Expenses

Serie A - 283.687.360 £
Bundesliga - 250.672.400 £
La Liga - 422.731.760 £
Premier League - 916.608.000 £
Ligue 1 - 117.968.400 £

13/14
Serie A - 461.133.200 £
Bundesliga - 264.598.400 £
La Liga - 361.988.000 £
Premier Leauge - 805.525.600 £
Ligue 1 - 381.198.400 £

where the hell is that 461mil pound comming from

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

I dont mean sportive wise, i mean financialwise. Juve broke records when the fee's were still relatively small (newcastle for example broke it with shearer at some point).

But when the numbers vastly increased, We completely stopped beeing a big spender. When the numbers exploded, we didnt really follow along. Check our spending between '95 and now.

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where the hell is that 461mil pound comming from

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/serie-a/transfers/wettbewerb/IT1/saison_id/2013


Serie A has no money they say

There are only 2 problems with serie a - poor stadiums and ridiculous tax system when you are forced to pay 5m as taxes to government if you pay the same amount of money to player for his salary

 

[Post Ironic]

I dont mean sportive wise, i mean financialwise. Juve broke records when the fee's were still relatively small (newcastle for example broke it with shearer at some point).

But when the numbers vastly increased, We completely stopped beeing a big spender. When the numbers exploded, we didnt really follow along. Check our spending between '95 and now.

- - - Updated - - -



where the hell is that 461mil pound comming from

Agreed, aside from about 3 years in the 95 to 2006 period when we did spend a lot. I mean, I'm pretty sure our 177 million euro window in 2002 was a record at the time.

That 461 from Rus is right I think, but what that doesn't take into account is the massive amount of money brought in from player sales to clubs outside of Serie A. Serie A sold huge that year and the expenditure was due to so many teams having to replace players. Napoli spent over 100mil alone.

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http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/serie-a/transfers/wettbewerb/IT1/saison_id/2013


Serie A has no money they say

There are only 2 problems with serie a - poor stadiums and ridiculous tax system when you are forced to pay 5m as taxes to government if you pay the same amount of money to player for his salary

The only reason Serie A was able to spend that much is because of all the star players that left Serie A that offseason to clubs outside Italy. The reason the expenditures dropped drastically this year is because teams tried to keep hold of their stars. The Premier League and La Liga don't have to sell in huge numbers to foreign clubs so as to be able to spend that kind of money.

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

Agreed, aside from about 3 years in the 95 to 2006 period when we did spend a lot. I mean, I'm pretty sure our 177 million euro window in 2002 was a record at the time.

That 461 from Rus is right I think, but what that doesn't take into account is the massive amount of money brought in from player sales to clubs outside of Serie A. Serie A sold huge that year and the expenditure was due to so many teams having to replace players. Napoli spent over 100mil alone.

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The only reason Serie A was able to spend that much is because of all the star players that left Serie A that offseason to clubs outside Italy. The reason the expenditures dropped drastically this year is because teams tried to keep hold of their stars. The Premier League and La Liga don't have to sell in huge numbers to foreign clubs so as to be able to spend that kind of money.

Serie A has no money
14/15
Tranfer expenses: 283.687.360 £
13/14
Tranfer expenses: 461.133.200 £
12/13
Tranfer expenses: 490.108.960 £
11/12
Tranfer expenses: 546.858.840 £
10/11
Tranfer expenses: 399.971.440 £
09/10
Tranfer expenses: 474.098.240 £
08/09
Tranfer expenses: 503.329.200 £
07/08
Tranfer expenses: 369.478.783 £
06/07
Tranfer expenses: 214.029.200 £
05/06
Tranfer expenses: 156.017.840 £

 

[Zacheryah]

Serie A has no money
14/15
Tranfer expenses: 283.687.360 £
13/14
Tranfer expenses: 461.133.200 £
12/13
Tranfer expenses: 490.108.960 £
11/12
Tranfer expenses: 546.858.840 £
10/11
Tranfer expenses: 399.971.440 £
09/10
Tranfer expenses: 474.098.240 £
08/09
Tranfer expenses: 503.329.200 £
07/08
Tranfer expenses: 369.478.783 £
06/07
Tranfer expenses: 214.029.200 £
05/06
Tranfer expenses: 156.017.840 £

RUS, expenses mean jack shit

Bring the net spend.