Giuseppe Marotta (41 Viewers)

[Juliano13]

maybe it's just the language barrier, I dunno, I think we might agree in general, we just call things different. if your goal is to win something, success is 1st place. if you end up doing better than others good for you, but don't call that success, because ultimately you didn't achieve your goal.

I said we've been more successful than Bayern in the last 4 years. That means relative to them. In what way were they more successful then us? Their best result is a semi-final and they got completely fucked by Barca and Real and were eliminated by Atletico. They never came close or looked good enough to win. The only reason people still jerk off to Bayern is because of that 2013 title, which was 5 seasons ago and is completely irrelevant now.

 

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[pitbull]

On one side we have the whole "vincere non è importante" thing, and then on the other there is rubbishing the achievements of players and staff to work an angle.

I did not rubbish anything, I just dislike that he used the word successful. we haven't had one truly successful season in Europe since 1996, we've had good, great (such as the last one), nerve-wrecking, entertaining and horrible seasons, but the last time we tasted CL success was more than 20 years ago. success is reaching your goal and we haven't done that in a long time.

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I said we've been more successful than Bayern in the last 4 years. That means relative to them. In what way were they more successful then us? Their best result is a semi-final and they got completely fucked by Barca and Real and were eliminated by Atletico. They never came close or looked good enough to win. The only reason people still jerk off to Bayern is because of that 2013 title, which was 5 seasons ago and is completely irrelevant now.

there are 2 clearly successful teams in Europe in the last 4 years - Real and Barcelona.

I disagree with the bolded part, Bayern got robbed this season against Real and last seasons duel with Atletico was very puzzling as well, did you see the games? They looked clearly superior to Aletico, just couldn't put it on the scoresheet, similar to that final with Chelsea

 

[Juliano13]

I did not rubbish anything, I just dislike that he used the word successful. we haven't had one truly successful season in Europe since 1996, we've had good, great (such as the last one), nerve-wrecking, entertaining and horrible seasons, but the last time we tasted CL success was more than 20 years ago. success is reaching your goal and we haven't done that in a long time.

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there are 2 clearly successful teams in Europe in the last 4 years - Real and Barcelona.

I disagree, Bayern got robbed this season against Real and last seasons duel with Atletico was very puzzling as well, did you see the games? They looked clearly superior to Aletico, just couldn't put it on the scoresheet, similar to that final with Chelsea

They looked superior to Atletico only in the second game, not the first one. And I remember that we looked clearly superior to Bayern in Munich and were qualifying until the last minute.

 

[JUVEMOOD]

Big if, but if Vidal was the one, why generalize and say every player will turn out causing problems? If you keep a player and want him to respect his contract, make him feel important and stay competitive and the player in question will know his place and get over it. Perhaps change his mind as well

Madrid, Bayern, etc. all of them do this

its simple and easy in principle as u put it here.
you can make all players feel important all you want, but to change his mind you shoud offer better wages and compete year in year out for CL, otherwise players will leave eventually.

 

[Afghan_juventus]

How can we be behind Juventus if you talk about the last 5 years? In 2012 we reached the final, 2013 won a treble, 2014 SF, 2015 SF, 2016 SF, 2017 QF.

Also have in mind that Juventus didnt go far in the CL in 2012 and 2014 where we played in a final and SF. Not saying this to be arrogant or talk Juventus' achivements down, but if you compare the last 5 years its Real and Bayern, then Barca and Juventus.

If you talk the last 3 years (2015-2017), its Real Madrid, Juventus and Barcelona/Bayern Munich

I put us and barca at the same level.

 

[JUVEMOOD]

Last 5 years:
Real, Bayern, Barca, Juve.


2017/18 expectations
Italy: Juve
Spain: Barca
Germany: Bayern
England: Man City

Europe: Spainish teams to fail, Real will not reach SF.
Juve & Bayern to reach SF and then anything can happen.

and fuck "if the player want to leave" policy...

 

[edgardavids2608]

we just have different standards I guess. you think losing a final is a success, I think there is just one winner. I don't consider Roma or Napoli succesful

How do you consider Bayern successful if they havnt won in 6 years which is your only criteria?

 

[pitbull]

How do you consider Bayern successful if they havnt won in 6 years which is your only criteria?

Bayern last won in 2012/13 and I dont consider them succesful in Cl in the last few seasons.

 

[Vialli_92]

And how many times did they reach the CL final?

A CL final is not a trophy. The only thing that matters in a final is winning it and we didn't do it

 

[Zacheryah]

A CL final is not a trophy. The only thing that matters in a final is winning it and we didn't do it

Read the conversation before adding a useless reply

 

[Vialli_92]

Read the conversation before adding a useless reply

I don't have to. Using a CL final as an argument as to why we have been more successful than other clubs is a loser mentality

 

[Zacheryah]

I don't have to. Using a CL final as an argument as to why we have been more successful than other clubs is a loser mentality

If we would be satisfied with it, it would be loser mentality.

If we use it to measure how far we go, its a good benchmark.


You dont suddenly end up in a final. You will have beaten at least one of the other 3 big ones along the way

2015 : kicked out madrid
2016 : nearly kicked out bayern but instead they did it with us
2017 : kicked out barcelona


We have 3 main challengers. You will have to beat 1 along the way. Its a benchmark that you managed to do that twice in 3 years.



Lets reverse your bullshit. Real Madrid won 3 finals in 4 years. The one time they didnt, was 2015. When we kicked them out.

 

[il brutto]

I think there's a bit of a misconception about the loser mentality on this forum.

• Loser mentality is if one thinks that because we have lost some finals we will lose one again when we get there and there is nothing we can do about it.
• Loser mentality is if one feels that they are owed a CL win for some reason.
• Loser mentality is when you cry at the start or midway through a season that we have no chance of winning the CL because we're shit.

Believing that we are close to winning the CL because we've made the final two times in three years is the absolute opposite of loser mentality.

 

[The Quazis]

I think there's a bit of a misconception about the loser mentality on this forum.

• Loser mentality is if one thinks that because we have lost some finals we will lose one again when we get there and there is nothing we can do about it.
• Loser mentality is if one feels that they are owed a CL win for some reason.
• Loser mentality is when you cry at the start or midway through a season that we have no chance of winning the CL because we're $#@!.

Believing that we are close to winning the CL because we've made the final two times in three years is the absolute opposite of loser mentality.

Bitches gonna be bitch, you can do nothing about it.

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[edgardavids2608]

Here is a fact
Bayern has not won the champions league in the last 5 seasons. Pep had 4 years and Ancelotti 1 and they did not do it. That puts them in the same boat as everyone else in the entire world of football unless you measure how far you go in the CL. I get that we

 

[Post Ironic]

I think there's a bit of a misconception about the loser mentality on this forum.

• Loser mentality is if one thinks that because we have lost some finals we will lose one again when we get there and there is nothing we can do about it.
• Loser mentality is if one feels that they are owed a CL win for some reason.
• Loser mentality is when you cry at the start or midway through a season that we have no chance of winning the CL because we're shit.

Believing that we are close to winning the CL because we've made the final two times in three years is the absolute opposite of loser mentality.

People seem to be entirely delusional about what a "loser mentality" actually is. The very definition of it is all the people bitching and moaning each and every summer, autumn, and early winter that we have absolutely no chance in Europe.

Even the "objective" Tuz mod X, said he didn't see us getting to a CL final again any time soon after we lost to Barca in 2015. And yet he we were again, in the CL final 2 years later.

We're as close as you can get without winning the CL over the past 3 years, so there's obviously good reason to be optimistic.

Bayern lost in the CL final in both 2010 and 2012. Won in 2013. Now, I don't think our team is as strong as Bayern 2012-13. That team what absolutely ferocious, but only a complete fool and someone with a massive loser mentality & inferiority complex would say we have no chance next year after the 3 years we have had.

 

[campionesidd]

I don't have to. Using a CL final as an argument as to why we have been more successful than other clubs is a loser mentality

Why don't you haul yourself off to red cafe? You're a perfect fit there.

 

[JuveJay]

Here is a fact
Bayern has not won the champions league in the last 5 seasons.

2016-17 Real Madrid (ONE)
2015-16 Real Madrid (TWO)
2014-15 Barcelona (THREE)
2013-14 Real Madrid (FOUR)
2012-13 Bayern Munich (FIVE)

 

[j0ker]

So much for facts.

 

[ALC]

its simple and easy in principle as u put it here.
you can make all players feel important all you want, but to change his mind you shoud offer better wages and compete year in year out for CL, otherwise players will leave eventually.

If I was a pro, I honestly don't think I'd wanna play for Juve. Torino seems like a boring city. I'm going with Barca, Real, PSG, Monaco, or best of all someplace with very nice beaches. Plus, I'd probably play for the team that offered the most money and Juve just doesn't match some of the big guys in that regard.

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2016-17 Real Madrid (ONE)
2015-16 Real Madrid (TWO)
2014-15 Barcelona (THREE)
2013-14 Real Madrid (FOUR)
2012-13 Bayern Munich (FIVE)

I like the way you presented this. Takes away all doubt.