Felipe Melo (56 Viewers)
- Thread starter Zé Tahir
- Start date
Rash decisions don't have to be "red cards". IMO Melo makes stupid challenges in the wrong places of the field, tries to do passes he has no business trying and losing possession. If Melo could control these things and just make the simple passes and just win the ball like he is supposed to then I'd not have a problem with him.
This doesn't mean what you seem to think it does.
Why compare the two? Well, they're both midfield players ideally competing (rather, Melo had his place assured, while Aquilani forced Marchisio out of his) for a spot in the same area of the field, while each brings something a little different to the table. They're on similar contracts with similar wages. They, supposedly, carry similar market values. Need I continue?
On stats: I don't know to whom you're referring as "shying away", but here's the thing - if you're going to bring stats to a discussion about two comparable players, albeit in different roles, bring them all and compare them all. Don't start cherry picking and saying things like "Marchisio scored 4 goals, Melo got however many yellow cards." No one necessarily said something to that extent, but you get my point I imagine. Judging "overall impact" is tricky, because its too nebulous a term to really mean anything, and it'll have to be more specific in this case as warranted by their different roles (the impact, that is); things like "defensive impact", "offensive impact", whatever, and from there it's really very subjective as to which someone prefers and sees as being more important.
So what I'm saying, really, is that the two can be compared, and if you're going to use stats, do so in a proper way.
This is not a point at all. Marchisio could just as easily be labeled as "highly overrated."
Four goals is a rather meager amount even for a supposed "all-around player". For some perspective, on this very board, an Aquilani in direct competition for a CM slot that had two goals and five assists, to Marchisio's four and four, was lambasted to hell and back for being a "non-entity", "a ballerina", "the Italian Tiago". Interestingly enough to note, Aquilani was also better than Marchisio in just about every aspect (most defensive categories, offensively minus the two extra goals, discipline, maintaining possession, and so forth). I only bring this up because Aquilani sure as hell didn't have a brigade of loyal followers backing him in the same way Marchisio did, and does, despite being, pretty unquestionably, the more productive player for us. As the two had essentially the same role, it's an apt comparison, I think. Yet, Aquilani "had little to no impact."
So, anyway, with that context, excuse me If I fail to get excited by four goals, two "clutch" goals notwithstanding. By the way, since when is scoring "two clutch goals" enough to categorize a player as such? Is that really enough? Playing devil's adcocate, why aren't they just considered anomalies?
I can't rightly find any stats that'll tell me how many times players were tackled, had balls stolen from them, and so forth. So for "ball retention", I can only look to successful passing rates. Melo edges Marchisio here.
Meaningless anecdotal "evidence", let's be honest. If someone had the time and inclination I'm sure an entire youtube collage could be put together of Marchisio losing the ball at inopportune times.
See above for "ball retention skills."
Are you kidding? That's exactly what you were trying to do with the "half his skills" comment.
Meanwhile, I've seen plenty of great long passes from the guy. Actually, I'd say he was one of the main people releasing Krasic.
Switch play in what sense? Switching flank? Going from defense to attack? If it's the latter, funnily enough, that's another category Melo has Marchisio beat. By a lot. See the stats pages I've posted a couple of pages back or whatever. If you're already aware of that, though, it's not surprising you'd be so quick to discount them as "really easy to do" since they favour Melo.
Indeed he is. Sounds like you rate his "impact" very well. Can't say I share the sentiment about Marchisio. In any facet, really.
I'm curious, but were you also expecting Emerson to get forward as well? Melo's been deployed as a destroyer, sitting back, and operating in the role almost to a T. That he's actually able to contribute so positively as it is going forward is a plus in my book. Not a minus.
So, is that what it's come to? That he "tries"? Regardless of whether actually succeeds (to the same extent as others)? I don't like getting into this area of talk because it starts skirting the whole "spit blood for the shirt", "future captain", "grinta personfied" bullshit that's been dumped on Marchisio so wrongly and used to praise him in spite of his legitimate defects as a player. Besides which, if you're going to talk about "spirit" and all that, how can you not at the same time praise Melo?
We'll never know. I'd say Melo did his job admirably in most cases and provided a very much felt defensive contribution. In my opinion, not having a class (true) left winger held us back a lot more, and as such, if Marchisio hadn't been aimlessly taking up space on the field, we could have earned a lot more points. Can't really hate him for that, though, as management screwed the transfer policy that summer, and its more their failing than his (Marchisio's).
I'm sorry, but FUCK NO.
Sissoko for two years now has been an absolutely liability; clumsily bounding about the pitch, losing the ball at every half-step, recklessly crashing into people (remember that crazy diving tackle in the box near the end of one match this season?), all sorts of nonsense.
Yes.
Melo's action can't really be justified, but, shouldn't the guy you're championing (and ironically the weaker player we've chosen to keep this season) been able to deputize faithfully? In his "natural central position" no less?
If he's on Melo's level, Melo shouldn't have been missed, at all, minus depth purposes.
By putting so much blame on Melo's suspension for conditioning our campaign negatively you inadvertently highlight his importance as a key player.
Was that your intent? Lol...
I believe he was responding to unwarranted criticism when he stated that he, personally, had a good season, and people should get off his back. Quite right, in my opinion.
Oh, your boy's taken to whining on facebook a couple of times too, so...you know...whatever.
Why compare the two? Well, they're both midfield players ideally competing (rather, Melo had his place assured, while Aquilani forced Marchisio out of his) for a spot in the same area of the field, while each brings something a little different to the table. They're on similar contracts with similar wages. They, supposedly, carry similar market values. Need I continue?
On stats: I don't know to whom you're referring as "shying away", but here's the thing - if you're going to bring stats to a discussion about two comparable players, albeit in different roles, bring them all and compare them all. Don't start cherry picking and saying things like "Marchisio scored 4 goals, Melo got however many yellow cards." No one necessarily said something to that extent, but you get my point I imagine. Judging "overall impact" is tricky, because its too nebulous a term to really mean anything, and it'll have to be more specific in this case as warranted by their different roles (the impact, that is); things like "defensive impact", "offensive impact", whatever, and from there it's really very subjective as to which someone prefers and sees as being more important.
So what I'm saying, really, is that the two can be compared, and if you're going to use stats, do so in a proper way.
This is not a point at all. Marchisio could just as easily be labeled as "highly overrated."
Four goals is a rather meager amount even for a supposed "all-around player". For some perspective, on this very board, an Aquilani in direct competition for a CM slot that had two goals and five assists, to Marchisio's four and four, was lambasted to hell and back for being a "non-entity", "a ballerina", "the Italian Tiago". Interestingly enough to note, Aquilani was also better than Marchisio in just about every aspect (most defensive categories, offensively minus the two extra goals, discipline, maintaining possession, and so forth). I only bring this up because Aquilani sure as hell didn't have a brigade of loyal followers backing him in the same way Marchisio did, and does, despite being, pretty unquestionably, the more productive player for us. As the two had essentially the same role, it's an apt comparison, I think. Yet, Aquilani "had little to no impact."
So, anyway, with that context, excuse me If I fail to get excited by four goals, two "clutch" goals notwithstanding. By the way, since when is scoring "two clutch goals" enough to categorize a player as such? Is that really enough? Playing devil's adcocate, why aren't they just considered anomalies?
I can't rightly find any stats that'll tell me how many times players were tackled, had balls stolen from them, and so forth. So for "ball retention", I can only look to successful passing rates. Melo edges Marchisio here.
Meaningless anecdotal "evidence", let's be honest. If someone had the time and inclination I'm sure an entire youtube collage could be put together of Marchisio losing the ball at inopportune times.
See above for "ball retention skills."
Are you kidding? That's exactly what you were trying to do with the "half his skills" comment.
Meanwhile, I've seen plenty of great long passes from the guy. Actually, I'd say he was one of the main people releasing Krasic.
Switch play in what sense? Switching flank? Going from defense to attack? If it's the latter, funnily enough, that's another category Melo has Marchisio beat. By a lot. See the stats pages I've posted a couple of pages back or whatever. If you're already aware of that, though, it's not surprising you'd be so quick to discount them as "really easy to do" since they favour Melo.
Indeed he is. Sounds like you rate his "impact" very well. Can't say I share the sentiment about Marchisio. In any facet, really.
I'm curious, but were you also expecting Emerson to get forward as well? Melo's been deployed as a destroyer, sitting back, and operating in the role almost to a T. That he's actually able to contribute so positively as it is going forward is a plus in my book. Not a minus.
So, is that what it's come to? That he "tries"? Regardless of whether actually succeeds (to the same extent as others)? I don't like getting into this area of talk because it starts skirting the whole "spit blood for the shirt", "future captain", "grinta personfied" bullshit that's been dumped on Marchisio so wrongly and used to praise him in spite of his legitimate defects as a player. Besides which, if you're going to talk about "spirit" and all that, how can you not at the same time praise Melo?
We'll never know. I'd say Melo did his job admirably in most cases and provided a very much felt defensive contribution. In my opinion, not having a class (true) left winger held us back a lot more, and as such, if Marchisio hadn't been aimlessly taking up space on the field, we could have earned a lot more points. Can't really hate him for that, though, as management screwed the transfer policy that summer, and its more their failing than his (Marchisio's).
I'm sorry, but FUCK NO.
Sissoko for two years now has been an absolutely liability; clumsily bounding about the pitch, losing the ball at every half-step, recklessly crashing into people (remember that crazy diving tackle in the box near the end of one match this season?), all sorts of nonsense.
Yes.
Melo's action can't really be justified, but, shouldn't the guy you're championing (and ironically the weaker player we've chosen to keep this season) been able to deputize faithfully? In his "natural central position" no less?
If he's on Melo's level, Melo shouldn't have been missed, at all, minus depth purposes.
By putting so much blame on Melo's suspension for conditioning our campaign negatively you inadvertently highlight his importance as a key player.
Was that your intent? Lol...
I believe he was responding to unwarranted criticism when he stated that he, personally, had a good season, and people should get off his back. Quite right, in my opinion.
Oh, your boy's taken to whining on facebook a couple of times too, so...you know...whatever.
