Divorces? (3 Viewers)

Martin

Martin

Senior Member
#21
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
#21
++ [ originally posted by Black Mamba ] ++
Because I said I find divorces to be way more important than getting plastic surgery. If God was able to give humankind the tools to improve his life then why cant I use science to improve my body? Its not like Im blaming God and saying its His Fault that I got small breasts?

Marriage is a sacred union, and yes, the Church and God say that you should be married forever. When the priest pronounces a man and a woman husband and wife he says that they shall remain married until death does them part.

And Im not using one argument for one thing and opposed to another, I was raised as a Catholic and I like my religion so I wish to be married forever. Also as I said marriage is a sacred thing and it wouldnt make sense if you got married five times, it loses its sacredness
Honestly I have no idea if the Catholic faith is for or against plastic surgery, but like I said before divorce is something more important and relevant than surgery
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But you could twist this any way you want. Is it not God's will to not do any changes to your body because he created you?

Conversely, if it's alright to "improve your life" by getting surgery, one could say it's alright to improve your life by walking out on a marriage that isn't working and into a better one, no?
 

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Dragon

Dragon

Senior Member
#22
Apr 24, 2003
27,407
#22
++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


But you could twist this any way you want. Is it not God's will to not do any changes to your body because he created you?

Conversely, if it's alright to "improve your life" by getting surgery, one could say it's alright to improve your life by walking out on a marriage that isn't working and into a better one, no?
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True, but remember that when you get married the Priest says you should be married in times of good and in times of bad until death does you part, not until you find a better partner if things arent working.

If things dont work youre supposed to pray and ask God to give you the strenght to make things work
 
Tifoso

Tifoso

Sempre e solo Juve
#23
Aug 12, 2005
5,162
#23
++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


I didn't see this coming but I have to say very fair point.
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Agreed.

We're unhappy with our looks/wealth/power, etc. Why? If someone, who has used the brilliant tactic in the 20th century of convincing many that he doesn't even exist, wanted to screw people up and make them as unhappy as possible, leading to despair, he couldn't have done a better job. It's a brilliant (you might say diabolical) tactic...

1.Convince people that a higher power does not exist
2. Convince people that even if a higher power does exist, he doesn't matter
3. Convince people that they are the only thing that matters (ie, me first) and, finally
4. Drive the knife in when everyone suddenly realizes that they are mortal, miserable, and ALONE
 
Tifoso

Tifoso

Sempre e solo Juve
#24
Aug 12, 2005
5,162
#24
++ [ originally posted by Black Mamba ] ++


True, but remember that when you get married the Priest says you should be married in times of good and in times of bad until death does you part, not until you find a better partner if things arent working.

If things dont work youre supposed to pray and ask God to give you the strenght to make things work
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Yup. Errr...were you someone else before here...all these name changes and I've lost track
 
Martin

Martin

Senior Member
#25
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
#25
++ [ originally posted by Black Mamba ] ++


True, but remember that when you get married the Priest says you should be married in times of good and in times of bad until death does you part, not until you find a better partner if things arent working.

If things dont work youre supposed to pray and ask God to give you the strenght to make things work
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I still don't see how you fit the surgery into this. Knowing the church to be fairly conservative (without having done the leg work), I don't imagine John Paul II (or the new one) to openly approve that kind of surgery, I'm pretty sure the church is opposed.
 
Dragon

Dragon

Senior Member
#26
Apr 24, 2003
27,407
#26
++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


I still don't see how you fit the surgery into this. Knowing the church to be fairly conservative (without having done the leg work), I don't imagine John Paul II (or the new one) to openly approve that kind of surgery.
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I really have no idea whats the stand of the Church in this particular issue, Ill have to ask.


But back to getting married by the Church, I just want to add something. Its not a requisite to get married by a Church to all Catholics, when the Catholic wedding ceremony starts the priest says that "this man and woman came today to show God their love and to ask for his approval." If youre not sure youre not going to last married then just dont ask God to marry you. But IMO you should also reconsider if you really want to get married to that person.
 
Tifoso

Tifoso

Sempre e solo Juve
#28
Aug 12, 2005
5,162
#28
++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


I still don't see how you fit the surgery into this. Knowing the church to be fairly conservative (without having done the leg work), I don't imagine John Paul II (or the new one) to openly approve that kind of surgery, I'm pretty sure the church is opposed.
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You're mistaken, Martin, amico mio.....at least on the surface. Have seen nothing officially condemning this type of surgery (after all where would it stop? Is dying your hair OK? Liposuction? etc)

The Church, contrary to most public opinion, does not condemn sexuality. Read some of JP2's writings on the subject. Brilliant---and beautiful. :)
 
Rami

Rami

The Linuxologist
#29
Dec 24, 2004
8,065
#29
++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


But you could twist this any way you want. Is it not God's will to not do any changes to your body because he created you?

Conversely, if it's alright to "improve your life" by getting surgery, one could say it's alright to improve your life by walking out on a marriage that isn't working and into a better one, no?
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This is the Islamic view on the first statement, unless it is a disfigurement, and the tools to fix a disfigurement are available, then it is ok, otherwise it would be tampering with creation.

As for marriage, it is a sacared bond, but divorce also is a tool. If life seems unbearable with a partner, and all other solutions deemed unsuccessful, then it is ok to resort to it. Divorce is considered the "worst" Halal.
 
Martin

Martin

Senior Member
#30
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
#30
++ [ originally posted by Black Mamba ] ++
But back to getting married by the Church, I just want to add something. Its not a requisite to get married by a Church to all Catholics, when the Catholic wedding ceremony starts the priest says that "this man and woman came today to show God their love and to ask for his approval." If youre not sure youre not going to last married then just dont ask God to marry you. But IMO you should also reconsider if you really want to get married to that person.
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Wait a minute, are you saying that it's common for Catholics to get married outside of church? Cause that would be news to me..
 
Dragon

Dragon

Senior Member
#31
Apr 24, 2003
27,407
#31
++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


Wait a minute, are you saying that it's common for Catholics to get married outside of church? Cause that would be news to me..
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No, its not. But thats something that just occured to me :D


What religion are you?
 
Dragon

Dragon

Senior Member
#32
Apr 24, 2003
27,407
#32
++ [ originally posted by Tifoso Lou ] ++


You're mistaken, Martin, amico mio.....at least on the surface. Have seen nothing officially condemning this type of surgery (after all where would it stop? Is dying your hair OK? Liposuction? etc)

The Church, contrary to most public opinion, does not condemn sexuality. Read some of JP2's writings on the subject. Brilliant---and beautiful. :)
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So whats the Church's stand on plastic surgery?
 
Tifoso

Tifoso

Sempre e solo Juve
#33
Aug 12, 2005
5,162
#33
++ [ originally posted by Black Mamba ] ++


So whats the Church's stand on plastic surgery?
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To my knowledge, it has none. Individuals within the Church may be against it, of course (religious and lay---pardon the expression---people)
 
Tifoso

Tifoso

Sempre e solo Juve
#34
Aug 12, 2005
5,162
#34
Again, it would be almost impossible to make a distinction between breast augmentation surgery "for the heck of it" and such surgery used, say, after breast cancer.
 
Martin

Martin

Senior Member
#35
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
#35
++ [ originally posted by Black Mamba ] ++


No, its not. But thats something that just occured to me :D


What religion are you?
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Won't go into detail here but basically I was brought up to be Catholic, parents always said choose for yourself. After Confirmation I asked myself one day if I believe in god. Well I don't. I've taken a lot from all those years participating in the church and without it I would be quite different I think. But since that realization, I don't have anything to do with the church, except I respect religion in general.
 
Tifoso

Tifoso

Sempre e solo Juve
#39
Aug 12, 2005
5,162
#39
++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


What's that now?
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Thomas Aquinas gives a logical proof for the existance of God (among other things). It is brilliant. Please give it a read (again, the abridged version---the unabridged one goes to multiple volumes)
 
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