[CL] JUVENTUS 2-2 Bayern [23rd February, 2016] (25 Viewers)
- Thread starter Marc
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How about Bonucci (iirc) pulling down Lewa in the box within the 1st few minutes?
Could (should?) have been a penalty for them.
Some of the reasons you come up with are valid, obviously. But it was still because of decisions we made, wasn't it?
Mandzukic strolling around? Maybe / probaly not really match fit => don't start him, but go for Morata or Zaza.
Same for Khedira. Would it have been that much worse if Sturaro had started the game?
Chiellini out does mess things up, but how about fielding Rugani? Sure, he might not be ready, but at least you'd have cover for Evra & at the same time you don't mess about with Pogba's impact / position.
Could (should?) have been a penalty for them.
Some of the reasons you come up with are valid, obviously. But it was still because of decisions we made, wasn't it?
Mandzukic strolling around? Maybe / probaly not really match fit => don't start him, but go for Morata or Zaza.
Same for Khedira. Would it have been that much worse if Sturaro had started the game?
Chiellini out does mess things up, but how about fielding Rugani? Sure, he might not be ready, but at least you'd have cover for Evra & at the same time you don't mess about with Pogba's impact / position.
Good comeback. Our plan in the first half wasn't so bad, we're great at soaking pressure like that, we did it against Real last year and it worked. It's more of a tactic rather than "respecting the opponent" too much. But this time we've made a lot of mistakes. Marchisio looked tired from the beginning, Khedira I guess wasn't fully fit. Even Bonucci - Barzagli was a bit shaky. And Evra should have done a bit better I reckon. Also we suck at 4-4-2 so there's also that but I think we employed it just to handle their wing play.
Great subs from Allegri though. I really think getting Hernanes on for Claudio was a tactical decision and it worked. Can't believe Hernanes can deliver performances like that against the likes of City and Bayern but can't do it in Serie A when no one's pressuring him. Sturaro and Morata did great too, we could have won with some luck but oh well.
The thing that bothers me the most is that Pogba has the potential to stand out from the rest when our ass is on the line, like in the first half. He's got all the right tools to turn a performance around, but sometimes he only does it when the others start playing well. He needs to start delivering even when the team doesn't. I remember back when we had Nedved, when we were up against better opposition, we'd get outplayed until Pavel had enough of it and start taking the game upon himself and basically carry us. That's what Paul needs to be for us.
Great subs from Allegri though. I really think getting Hernanes on for Claudio was a tactical decision and it worked. Can't believe Hernanes can deliver performances like that against the likes of City and Bayern but can't do it in Serie A when no one's pressuring him. Sturaro and Morata did great too, we could have won with some luck but oh well.
The thing that bothers me the most is that Pogba has the potential to stand out from the rest when our ass is on the line, like in the first half. He's got all the right tools to turn a performance around, but sometimes he only does it when the others start playing well. He needs to start delivering even when the team doesn't. I remember back when we had Nedved, when we were up against better opposition, we'd get outplayed until Pavel had enough of it and start taking the game upon himself and basically carry us. That's what Paul needs to be for us.
This is a bit of a fallacy, and also amusing, as the same people who use this argument here, in this case, also use it in reverse.
They say here, it shouldn't have been a penalty and if it was against us, we'd be crying...
But then, when these type of questionable penalties go against us, they say it should be a penalty because we'd crying if it wasn't awarded to us...
It's #TeamObjectivity, and they basically say all questionable decisions should go against us... for objectivity's sake. Because we'd cry if the calls went against us.
They say here, it shouldn't have been a penalty and if it was against us, we'd be crying...
But then, when these type of questionable penalties go against us, they say it should be a penalty because we'd crying if it wasn't awarded to us...
It's #TeamObjectivity, and they basically say all questionable decisions should go against us... for objectivity's sake. Because we'd cry if the calls went against us.
I think both should've been a goal for sure, and both were.
Yes but Allegri is going to go with the experienced options for such a game. I'm not criticising his choices because of that, rather giving reasons why we weren't able to compete.
I can't imagine most would have been happy starting Rugani, Sturaro and Zaza for such a game. Turns out Allegri saved himself and the team with the subs, but he would have expected more from even half fit players. If not surely they wouldn't have started.
I can't imagine most would have been happy starting Rugani, Sturaro and Zaza for such a game. Turns out Allegri saved himself and the team with the subs, but he would have expected more from even half fit players. If not surely they wouldn't have started.
For real. Stop blaming the ref. It's pathetic. Yes, there were some arbitrary decisions, but nothing so scandalous. BM outplayed us for an hour and they deservedly were 2 goals up. After that we showed some balls and deservedly made the scoreline 2-2. A great display of character and we should be proud. Let's stop this pathetic, butthurt, victim mentality bitching about the referee. We are not inter, Roma or Napoli after all.
The dream is still on
The dream is still on
Yeah, it's not as if I was looking forward to Rugani starting such a game, but a decision had to be made: either fielding inexperienced guys but keeping your usual formation / approach or fielding the experienced guys knowing full well that it requires a lot of small-ish changes.
For some reason, as soon as I saw our confirmed line up I had the feeling that we were going to struggle immensely. Five minutes into the game this feeling was confirmed.
Hell, 0-3 would have probably been a fair halftime result.
Also, I'm not quite sure who or what saved us. This comeback was as odd as it's going to get
For some reason, as soon as I saw our confirmed line up I had the feeling that we were going to struggle immensely. Five minutes into the game this feeling was confirmed.
Hell, 0-3 would have probably been a fair halftime result.
Also, I'm not quite sure who or what saved us. This comeback was as odd as it's going to get
Now that things have cooled of a bit I'd like to offer my view on the game.
First of all I don't think our tactical approach from the start was wrong I totally understand that especially at home when away goals might have a big effect on the tie it's good to start the game carefully and build on that. What went wrong was the mental aspect of the game we didn't believe in our tactics like we usually do we looked scared in defense and made so many technical errors on the ball that it's almost impossible to string any decent attacking moves together regardless of tactics.
When looking at possession I think it's important to understand that we are not solely a possession based team whereas for Pep teams possession is a religion. In this game possession stats were 64% to 34% for Bayern their average in the CL before this game was 66,7% and ours 47% so I'd say that the game went as expected when it comes to dominating the possession. The one game Bayern have lost in this years CL was against Arsenal at the Emirates when Bayern had 69% of the possession against a team that likes to keep the ball themselves.
I'm pretty sure Allegri has watched that game more than once and thought that if Arsenal with their defenders can keep them out that way it will be more than possible for us too. If we would have played a better first half on a technical level I think we could have snatched the game and in the end the goals they scored came from our mistakes and both of the goals were avoidable, okay Muller somehow managed to waste an open goal chance and they had some other chances too but all in all we didn't concede too many chances against them even while we couldn't keep the ball for over ten seconds ourselves.
Going to the next game I think our main goal has to be to score two goals and see how far that takes us and I wouldn't be surprised to see Bayern absolutely dominate the possession again at the start so those with the mental strength of an five year old stay away from the TV come the 16th of March.
First of all I don't think our tactical approach from the start was wrong I totally understand that especially at home when away goals might have a big effect on the tie it's good to start the game carefully and build on that. What went wrong was the mental aspect of the game we didn't believe in our tactics like we usually do we looked scared in defense and made so many technical errors on the ball that it's almost impossible to string any decent attacking moves together regardless of tactics.
When looking at possession I think it's important to understand that we are not solely a possession based team whereas for Pep teams possession is a religion. In this game possession stats were 64% to 34% for Bayern their average in the CL before this game was 66,7% and ours 47% so I'd say that the game went as expected when it comes to dominating the possession. The one game Bayern have lost in this years CL was against Arsenal at the Emirates when Bayern had 69% of the possession against a team that likes to keep the ball themselves.
I'm pretty sure Allegri has watched that game more than once and thought that if Arsenal with their defenders can keep them out that way it will be more than possible for us too. If we would have played a better first half on a technical level I think we could have snatched the game and in the end the goals they scored came from our mistakes and both of the goals were avoidable, okay Muller somehow managed to waste an open goal chance and they had some other chances too but all in all we didn't concede too many chances against them even while we couldn't keep the ball for over ten seconds ourselves.
Going to the next game I think our main goal has to be to score two goals and see how far that takes us and I wouldn't be surprised to see Bayern absolutely dominate the possession again at the start so those with the mental strength of an five year old stay away from the TV come the 16th of March.
For real. Stop blaming the ref. It's pathetic. Yes, there were some arbitrary decisions, but nothing so scandalous. BM outplayed us for an hour and they deservedly were 2 goals up. After that we showed some balls and deservedly made the scoreline 2-2. A great display of character and we should be proud. Let's stop this pathetic, butthurt, victim mentality bitching about the referee. We are not inter, Roma or Napoli after all.
The dream is still on
The dream is still on
