[CL] Champions League 2015/2016 (15 Viewers)

[Zacheryah]

I am agreeing with the above comment made by il brutto.Barca still has the better midfield overall but lets not underestimate how good Atleti's midfield talents are.

And Turan wasnt their best player last yr or the yr before.Thats a rubbish comment.

Depends how you look at it.


Barcelona's midfield will win more games compared to athletico.
When the two meet, Athletico's midfield will prevail. But the tactics got to be on point.

 

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[il brutto]

So you agree with them that ATM has a better midfield on paper than Barca?

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I was starting to think that I am watching a different sport.

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So would Saul bench Rakitic or Besquets?

I'd play him instead of Rakitic for sure not so sure Luis Enrique would but would get plenty of minutes either way with Rakitic only lasting for 60 minutes each game.

 

[Zacheryah]

Its wrong to look like it with individuals.


Mascherano would bench every single midfielder who's supposed to be supporting. Yet Busquets plays at his spot and Javier is moved to CB. Why ?
Because for Barcelona's system to work, they need a holding mid with playmaker'eque passing capabilities and good technique.
Marchisio is better at everything Busquets does. he'd easely bench him at barcelona.
At juventus, Mascherano would easely bench marchisio.


You cannot just compare players. You need to see how they fit in. But you can compare midfield units.

 

[Hist]

I wonder why is that, considering talented players play better when surrounded by other talented players. Barcas players are as talented as it gets so normally Arda should automatically be better there. or maybe its because he doesent suit their playing style. Lets ask the expert on this, @Cheesio what do you say?

He wasn't brought in to be in an immediate starter their starting midfield 3 are pretty unshakable. He is there to rotate and then one day take over from the aging iniesta. I'd give him more time at Barca to settle in, he wasnt legally allowed to play for a long time because of the ban.

My point wasn't that Turan is ATMs best player and is only good enough for the bench (though thats a good argument too), my point is that Barca's midfield now includes ATMs midfield star.

Its my view that Barca had the better midfield even when turan was beasting at ATM. Now ATM is weakened and turan is added to Barca's midfield. In the same sense Barca has a better midfield than we do but if they buy Pogba from us, then the gap will be even larger.


Whats with underestimating Rakitic? the guy is class. He is great in possession, is very hard working and has a great eye for through passes and assists. I rate him very highly.

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Its wrong to look like it with individuals.


Mascherano would bench every single midfielder who's supposed to be supporting. Yet Busquets plays at his spot and Javier is moved to CB. Why ?
Because for Barcelona's system to work, they need a holding mid with playmaker'eque passing capabilities and good technique.
Marchisio is better at everything Busquets does. he'd easely bench him at barcelona.
At juventus, Mascherano would easely bench marchisio.


You cannot just compare players. You need to see how they fit in. But you can compare midfield units.

And as a unit Barca has had the best unit for a long time now. They are still number one in the possession game (they surrender possession to no one) and they service their insane strike force almost perfectly to great effect.

 

[Vlad]

What a guy this hist

Rakitic is a bit of a spineless. He can't carry his team, but often hides when his team needs him. He also has difficulty enduring 90 minutes. Overrated player.

Arda wasn't Atletico's best mid, that was always Koke. The latter is brilliant player in both phases of the game.

And no, our midfield isn't inferior to Barca. You have to be special kind of deranged to even entertain this thought. Pogba > Rakitić, Marchisio > Busquets, Iniesta > Khedira; 2/3 of our mids easily outclass Barca's.

 

[il brutto]

He wasn't brought in to be in an immediate starter their starting midfield 3 are pretty unshakable. He is there to rotate and then one day take over from the aging iniesta. I'd give him more time at Barca to settle in, he wasnt legally allowed to play for a long time because of the ban.

My point wasn't that Turan is ATMs best player and is only good enough for the bench (though thats a good argument too), my point is that Barca's midfield now includes ATMs midfield star.

Its my view that Barca had the better midfield even when turan was beasting at ATM. Now ATM is weakened and turan is added to Barca's midfield. In the same sense Barca has a better midfield than we do but if they buy Pogba from us, then the gap will be even larger.


Whats with underestimating Rakitic? the guy is class. He is great in possession, is very hard working and has a great eye for through passes and assists. I rate him very highly.

I certainly don't underestimate Rakitic myself. He's a wonderful player but going by form Saul has been the better player this season and he offers different things compared to Rakitic. It's also worth pointing out that Turan at ATM was more of a winger and Koke has been their best mid for at least two seasons now not to mention that Gabi is vastly underrated as well.

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What a guy this hist

Rakitic is a bit of a spineless. He can't carry his team, but often hides when his team needs him. He also has difficulty enduring 90 minutes. Overrated player.

Arda wasn't Atletico's best mid, that was always Koke. The latter is brilliant player in both phases of the game.

And no, our midfield isn't inferior to Barca. You have to be special kind of deranged to even entertain this thought. Pogba > Rakitić, Marchisio > Busquets, Iniesta > Khedira; 2/3 of our mids easily outclass Barca's.

To be fair it should be:

Pogba vs Iniesta
Khedira vs Rakitic
Marchisio vs Bisciut

That's a difficult comparison to make individually as some of them are very different but Barca's mid just works better as a unit maybe we'll get there some day again. I'd say our Pogba/Marchisio Pirlo Vidal midfield at their peak was possibly better or at least on par.

 

[Hist]

I certainly don't underestimate Rakitic myself. He's a wonderful player but going by form Saul has been the better player this season and he offers different things compared to Rakitic. It's also worth pointing out that Turan at ATM was more of a winger and Koke has been their best mid for at least two seasons now not to mention that Gabi is vastly underrated as well.

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To be fair it should be:

Pogba vs Iniesta
Khedira vs Rakitic
Marchisio vs Bisciut

That's a difficult comparison to make individually as some of them are very different but Barca's mid just works better as a unit maybe we'll get there some day again. I'd say our Pogba/Marchisio Pirlo Vidal midfield at their peak was possibly better or at least on par.

I agree.

 

[Vlad]

To be fair it should be:

Pogba vs Iniesta
Khedira vs Rakitic
Marchisio vs Bisciut

That's a difficult comparison to make individually as some of them are very different but Barca's mid just works better as a unit maybe we'll get there some day again. I'd say our Pogba/Marchisio Pirlo Vidal midfield at their peak was possibly better or at least on par.

Messi tends to drop back a lot and helps with build up. And their strikers are very involved in general and also well capable of putting an extra pressure on opponent's defenders and midfielders. Their midfield alone is nothing extraordinary. I consider both Juve's and Bayern's midfield superior and more balanced.

 

[Zacheryah]

And as a unit Barca has had the best unit for a long time now. They are still number one in the possession game (they surrender possession to no one) and they service their insane strike force almost perfectly to great effect.

Thats really far to much sucking catelonian cock.

They have had the best unit for a while, yes. Untill Xavi slowed down quickly and Iniesta took a step back.
They changed with the Neymar+Suarez addition. That strike force is quite something, but their unit is well below what it has been.

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Pogba vs Iniesta
Khedira vs Rakitic
Marchisio vs Bisciut

That's a difficult comparison to make individually as some of them are very different but Barca's mid just works better as a unit maybe we'll get there some day again. I'd say our Pogba/Marchisio Pirlo Vidal midfield at their peak was possibly better or at least on par.

Change Khedira with the best Vidal, and its superior

 

[DAiDEViL]

@all if you'd have all the barca and all the juve players - how would your starting 11 look like?

 

[il brutto]

Change Khedira with the best Vidal, and its superior

Agree. I wrote the same thing in my post.

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@all if you'd have all the barca and all the juve players - how would your starting 11 look like?

-------------Neymar Messi
Alex Sandro Iniesta Pogba Cuadrado
----------------Marchisio
------Chiellini Mascherano Barzagli
......................Buffon

I would never pick Mascherano over Bonucci to be honest but had to fit some Barca players in there so I won't be called a deluded Juve fan.

 

[zizinho]

@all if you'd have all the barca and all the juve players - how would your starting 11 look like?

Buffon
Alves Bonucci Chiellini/Barzagli Sandro
Pogba Mascherano Iniesta
Messi Suarez Neymar

If Messi runs 7km per game bench him for Dybi

 

[Cerval]

I saw a few members say that we're better than Atletico. On what basis? It's borderline delusional to think that. The only reason I can think of is that Atletico is not as relevant in the grand scheme of things (mainly history and popularity). Most people rate us similarly though and for the others, they edge us out.

As long as we don't play them again, we won't know for sure but they do have better results against the big three going for them.

 

[Vlad]

Agree. I wrote the same thing in my post.

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-------------Neymar Messi
Alex Sandro Iniesta Pogba Cuadrado
----------------Marchisio
------Chiellini Mascherano Barzagli
......................Buffon

I would never pick Mascherano over Bonucci to be honest but had to fit some Barca players in there so I won't be called a deluded Juve fan.

Now that would be trully outstanding team. Damn.

 

[il brutto]

Buffon
Alves Bonucci Chiellini/Barzagli Sandro
Pogba Mascherano Iniesta
Messi Suarez Neymar

If Messi runs 7km per game bench him for Dybi

I just couldn't play that formation as the sight of Alves made me sick. He's so past it nowadays I'd pick Lichtsteiner over him any time.

 

[DAiDEViL]

-------------Neymar Messi
Alex Sandro Iniesta Pogba Cuadrado
----------------Marchisio
------Chiellini Mascherano Barzagli
......................Buffon

Alves----Bonucci---Chiello---A.Sandro
-----------------Masch
----------Iniesta------Pogba
-----Messi
----------------Suarez-------Neymar



edit: @zizinho beat me to it.

 

[zizinho]

I just couldn't play that formation as the sight of Alves made me sick. He's so past it nowadays I'd pick Lichtsteiner over him any time.

I haven't seen him much but figured that he still is at a decent level since hes still starter for them and they didn't go for a starter caliber player neither in summer or this winter. Or just go full offense and put Cuadrado there

 

[il brutto]

Now that would be trully outstanding team. Damn.

We only need to sign Neymar and someone similar to Iniesta and we are pretty much there.

 

[zizinho]

Alves----Bonucci---Chiello---A.Sandro
-----------------Masch
----------Iniesta------Pogba
-----Messi
----------------Suarez-------Neymar

Thats the same as me then, unless you have Marc Andre in goal

 

[il brutto]

I haven't seen him much but figured that he still is at a decent level since hes still starter for them and they didn't go for a starter caliber player neither in summer or this winter. Or just go full offense and put Cuadrado there

They have Aleix Vidal and Sergi Roberto who can play there. I think most Barca fans would prefer Roberto starting already.