Charlie Hebdo massacre - 2015-Jan-07 (17 Viewers)

[Seven]

The two parisian murders grew up without their parents (both died young) in a shithole of a suburb and with crime around them and a bleak future. They were clearly lost and looking for identity and the feeling of 'belonging' (look it up it's an interesting psychology theory) somewhere which led them to radical Islam. They could have been gangsters, hooligans or free masons as well.

So what's the likelihood of them committing an act of terror if they were gangsters, hooligans or free masons?

The problem is radical Islam.

 

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[chester]

Seems like they almost got the two guys who did the shootings.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/09/europe/charlie-hebdo-paris-shooting/index.html

 

[Maddy]

So what's the likelihood of them committing an act of terror if they were gangsters, hooligans or free masons?

The problem is radical Islam.

No, it's not. Political Islam is a legitimate stance in a democracy, by your logic Liberal Democracy is the (a) problem.

The problem is people using Islam for a political agenda to ensure power, just liek Christianity, Stalinism and so on. Terrorism wasn't invented by Islam and isn't be default an Islamic thing. You can multiple peaceful Salafists they don't commit terror despite their disgust with the Liberal Democracy.

IRA, Breivik, Oklahoma?

 

[Seven]

No, it's not. Political Islam is a legitimate stance in a democracy, by your logic Liberal Democracy is the (a) problem.

The problem is people using Islam for a political agenda to ensure power, just liek Christianity, Stalinism and so on. Terrorism wasn't invented by Islam and isn't be default an Islamic thing. You can multiple peaceful Salafists they don't commit terror despite their disgust with the Liberal Democracy.

IRA, Breivik, Oklahoma?

Breivik? Oklahoma? Really.. I am asking you about terrorist attacks on a regular basis and this is what you come up with? IRA I can swallow, although the situation is vastly different, but that's about it.

I'm also not saying that terrorism is an Islamic thing. Again, you put words in my mouth. I am saying that it is now linked with Islam on a regular basis.

Also, political Islam achieved with violence is not a legitimate stance in any way.

 

[Maddy]

Seems like they almost got the two guys who did the shootings.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/09/europe/charlie-hebdo-paris-shooting/index.html

I sincerely hope they get caught alive. Let them get the democratic treatment of a fair trial and a long sad life in prison.

The only way to defend democracy is by being democrats.

 

[Seven]

And to be frank, I don't think political islam is legitimate either. Even if it isn't achieved by violence. Yes, you could come to that result democratically. But we know how dangerous it is to mix church and state. I can't fathom why you'd want to allow it.

 

[Maddy]

And to be frank, I don't think political islam is legitimate either. Even if it isn't achieved by violence. Yes, you could come to that result democratically. But we know how dangerous it is to mix church and state. I can't fathom why you'd want to allow it.

Slippery slope. What's next? Banning Communism? Socialism? Anarchism? Fascism? All ideologies that have been killed in the name of.

Freedom of thought, speech and religion. Not in Seven's "democracy".

So saddening to see people defend democracy but limiting democracy. Right Wing of Europe

 

[Seven]

Slippery slope. What's next? Banning Communism? Socialism? Anarchism? Fascism? All ideologies that have been killed in the name of.

Freedom of thought, speech and religion. Not in Seven's "democracy".

So saddening to see people defend democracy but limiting democracy. Right Wing of Europe

There are limits to democracy yes. Is this the first time you ever heard about this?

Democracy does not merely mean the voice of the majority. Democratic states also need to protect minorities and must accommodate religious liberty and cultural diversity.

I must also say I do not like your constant playing of the race card. It shows a feeble mind.

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Then again you seem to believe that you can have religious freedom without seperation of church and state. If you're that delusional, you're lost for all reasonable debate anyway.

 

[Maddy]

There are limits to democracy yes. Is this the first time you ever heard about this?

Democracy does not merely mean the voice of the majority. Democratic states also need to protect minorities and must accommodate religious liberty and cultural diversity.

I must also say I do not like your constant playing of the race card. It shows a feeble mind.

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Then again you seem to believe that you can have religious freedom without seperation of church and state. If you're that delusional, you're lost for all reasonable debate anyway.

The race card? Hmm..

But you're right let's stop here.

 

[Seven]

The race card? Hmm..

But you're right let's stop here.

I'm glad you can acknowledge that your last point was a bit.. wrong .

 

[GordoDeCentral]

id love to hear what constitutes a terror attack

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see you in 3 months turk

 

[Seven]

id love to hear what constitutes a terror attack

I'd say the intent is what matters most. And the intent has to go beyond the attack itself.

Turk is an idiot obviously, and I'm not a fan of huge and complicated conspiracy theories, but you know.. it has been done before.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

for the last time turk was not banned for his views, he was givne an infraction for his disrespectful post towards JJ and banned from the thread because hes a troll who cant voice his views like everyone else. he was banned after he was given multiple warning to drop it in the mod thread.

 

[Seven]

for the last time turk was not banned for his views, he was givne an infraction for his disrespectful post towards JJ and banned from the thread because hes a troll who cant voice his views like everyone else. he was banned after he was given multiple warning to drop it in the mod thread.

I'm not saying he was. God knows I don't want to defend him. Thing is though I had this "You so Turk" thing going on.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

I'd say the intent is what matters most. And the intent has to go beyond the attack itself.

Turk is an idiot obviously, and I'm not a fan of huge and complicated conspiracy theories, but you know.. it has been done before.

sorry i dont understand your definition intent to what? when a mexican drug lord kills a whole bus of students to possibly kill a rival or when he burns victims alive to send messages are those terror acts?

 

[Seven]

sorry i dont understand your definition intent to what? when a mexican drug lord kills a whole bus of students to possibly kill a rival or when he burns victims alive to send messages are those terror acts?

The intent to cause fear. And yes, they are. They are also pretty random though.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

The intent to cause fear. And yes, they are. They are also pretty random though.

it cant be random if theres a clear distinct intent, also ever wonder why people love reality tv?

 

[Seven]

it cant be random if theres a clear distinct intent, also ever wonder why people love reality tv?

They are random because they do not happen on a planned, regular basis. They also rarely happen on a global basis and are almost never used to change political situations.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

They are random because they do not happen on a planned, regular basis. They also rarely happen on a global basis and are almost never used to change political situations.

you are adding new elements to the definition, but fine i'll roll with that, except for iran no country has had islam changed its political situations, on the other hand theres countless example of israle/us/uk engaging in regular, global, overt and covert(terrorist) operations to topple governments and change political spectrum in a country.

I dont think you are approaching this in an academic manner, had you said i dont think the 2 cultures(west and islam) are not compatible, i could accept that point of view but to say that terrorism is in inherent in islam is simply ignorant imo

 

[j0ker]

Seems like they almost got the two guys who did the shootings.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/09/europe/charlie-hebdo-paris-shooting/index.html

Gotta be said that French intellegence, police or whoever is responsible for these matters failed majorly. They knew they were connected / part of Al Qaida, why weren't they monitored?

Hopefully there are no more victims and the kidnapped girl gets out safe.