Charlie Hebdo massacre - 2015-Jan-07 (9 Viewers)

Valerio.

Senior Member
Jul 5, 2014
5,685
Hmm.. I can think of a few. But they're countries which lack central authority and in which local, religious rule is dictated by what one can only call criminal gangs. Not really what Valerio meant I suppose.
just asking but does it matter if those things are forced by a central gov or para-military groups? to me they all look the same.
But if the gov is in charge of those stuff is worse but then if they don't do anything against groups forcing this religious laws it's not any better imo

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You. Definitely you. Anyway, I thought it was quite clear, but not to a troll I suppose.
oh cool and if i'm not a double account and simply share a different opinion? aka not liking muslims extremists and so on?
 

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Snoop

Sabet is a nasty virgin
Oct 2, 2001
28,186
We have over 30 muslim countries in the world, please list the countries where the bolded is applied. I'm gonna venture and guess you can mention 2, maybe 3, but you know what, I'll humor you, maybe you'll surprise me.
Iran
Saudi Arabia
Iraq
Pakistan
Afghanistan
 

Raz

Senior Member
Nov 20, 2005
12,218
Russia, you can get killed if you're gay in russia too. But that doesn't really count as a muslim country I guess.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
38,203
just asking but does it matter if those things are forced by a central gov or para-military groups? to me they all look the same.
But if the gov is in charge of those stuff is worse but then if they don't do anything against groups forcing this religious laws it's not any better imo
There is a difference between being unable to control fundamentalist organisations and actively persecuting your own civilians. So yes, it does matter.
 

Snoop

Sabet is a nasty virgin
Oct 2, 2001
28,186
The three in bold can hardly be even considered states these days. There is no central authority whatsoever.
Either that or "They don't represent Islam"! Otherwise all of them are gay friendly countries!


Lebanon is one of the most civilized (majority Muslim populated) countries, along with Turkey! If this http://english.al-akhbar.com/node/21131 is happening in Lebanon, imagine what happens in the rest of Muslim countries..
 

swag

L'autista
Administrator
Sep 23, 2003
83,474
The most ironic thing about the terrorist is that they create more sympathy towards Israel thru their actions.
Worse: it helps justify Israel's cruelty to a lot of people.

Journalist on Lebanese channel last night said something about Hebdo also mocking Christianity and Jews on many occasions. Don't know how true this is.
Wow. That this isn't known in some parts of the world suggests how information gets filtered, skewed, and manipulated elsewhere.


By the way todays cover of Charlie Hebdo is a beauty.

"All is Forgiven" :heart:

For the sensitive I put a spoiler on

It's the message of forgiveness that's almost as much of a shocker as the image of the prophet himself (peace be upon him).

Not a beauty at all Maddy :D

I wanted to ask u a question, how would u feel if someone ridiculed your mother, sister wife or daughter, or the dearest person to your heat. For the Majority of Muslims, the sanity of the prophet is hold much bigger than their mothers, it will be ok if u curse his mother but not the prophet. It's not about freedom of speech but it's about morality and human values, why u need to provek 1.6 billion people just so you can produce a weak humour. We keep reminded by the West that now we live in a small world when everyone is connected, maybe some need to be reminded by this fact and that respect of others is more important than trying to be funny.
By the way i don't accept what happend by any means.
There's an English idiom called the "sacred cow". It is those things which are given mystical importance in one context, but are typically rather mundane and no reason for alarm or concern in other contexts. Like the cow in Hinduism: some may see the incarnation of the divine, and yet many others see, well, a cow.

Charlie Hebdo made its existence out of lampooning sacred cows the world over. Some are political cows, some are religious, some are social taboos that don't seem taboo-like at all from a different perspective.

To non-Muslims, the image of Muhammed is, well, like the cow to non-Hindus. Not a cow as in insulting someone, calling them a cow. But it registers nothing of significance as would, say, you seeing a bicycle. That something as mundane as an image of a bicycle could incite men to kill over it is a complete mind-fuck to much of the world. They don't get it, and to be honest they will never get it.

I do my best as a non-Muslim to understand why just a visual rendering of Muhammed is so insulting. I don't think I will ever understand it either unless I become a devout Muslim -- and even then it might not be the same because I wasn't born with that nor raised in that cultural environment where that was considered the norm. Something in my brain registers that this is something that might be perceived as hurtful by others, so don't forget that, but it's purely on an intellectual level -- a sort of need to enforce my own awareness of it, because for me it just doesn't register. I could walk past a poster on a wall of Muhammed and I simply wouldn't even notice it.

That might explain things just a little: it requires mindful effort for non-Muslims to sensitize ourselves, let alone even notice these things. Much as if you meet someone from El Salvador at a party, you mention the word "latino" as the word you always use in casual conversation, and he goes all ballistic on you every time you say "latino" because he's offended that you don't say "hispanic" instead. There's a lot to be said about cultural sensitivity and making others feel accepted. But how much do you tolerate from each and every person and each and every culture before that gets out of hand?

Now there's clearly a massive leap (and stick to the eye) from that to when you get to Charlie Hebdo. There are a lot of people who are (somewhat justifiably) fatigued with laundry lists of cultural sensitivities when no insult is even intended, like walking through a minefield. "Why am I such a horrible person just because I say the word 'latino'?" That sort of thing. So what you get with Charlie Hebdo are sophomoric pranksters who basically underscore these social absurdities by exaggerating them to the extreme. Partially in the hope that presenting them that way will make us less overly sensitive, though in their case they are also having a bit of fun at the expense of others who they see in power.

That last part is important: power. Many Muslims will lament they have no "power". But to feel rules that (from one cultural perspective) seem absurd, there is power in forcing people to change their behaviors for reasons that are essentially invisible to them. It's almost the power to intimidate. That's true about politicians, that's true about Jews and Israel, that's true about Christian figures, and that's true about Muslim extremists who kill if you disagree.

So Charlie Hebdo fights back with what it can against that power. The unfortunate part of that fight back is that Charlie Hebdo's actions are really directed at Muslim extremists -- the ones who would storm their doors and shoot them -- but that there's also collateral damage to every moderate and liberal Muslim as well. I can assure you, as much as you take offense as one is insulting your mother, you are not the primary intended target of their message or insults. Even though you feel offended as if it were personal.

Who do you think is colonizing Africa these days? I'll give you a hint: not the West, but the ...
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We have over 30 muslim countries in the world, please list the countries where the bolded is applied. I'm gonna venture and guess you can mention 2, maybe 3, but you know what, I'll humor you, maybe you'll surprise me.
And Muslim extremists being ones who think those 2 or maybe 3 are too soft and liberal.

How many ISIS members we have here? Did you guys make a poll?
:lol2:

Snoop! You're alive! Not that I ever would have doubted you, but glad to see you've managed to peek up out of all that horrendous shit going down in Syria.
 

Hust

Senior Member
Hustini
May 29, 2005
93,357
"All is Forgiven" :heart:
Trying not to step too far into the shit basket here, but to me, that's one of the biggest differences in the religions.

Let me rephrase that :)D), as someone who is trying to read both holy books to learn similarities and differences, one makes it a point to forgive your enemies as God will be the ultimate judge.
 
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Maddy

Maddy

Oracle of Copenhagen
Jul 10, 2009
16,541
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #999
    Trying not to step too far into the shit basket here, but to me, that's one of the biggest differences in the religions.

    Let me rephrase that :)D), as someone who is trying to read both holy books to learn similarities and differences, one makes it a point to forgive your enemies as God will be the ultimate judge.
    Ironically Charlie Hebdo are a bunch of leftist atheist :D HOLD ON! My team win ;) :D
    @swag Brilliant! what you wrote to Cheesio!
     

    Hust

    Senior Member
    Hustini
    May 29, 2005
    93,357
    Ironically Charlie Hebdo are a bunch of leftist atheist :D HOLD ON! My team win ;) :D
    @swag Brilliant! what you wrote to Cheesio!
    What does that have to do with forgiveness between the two religions? :D

    To your point about Hebdo, you didn't see extreme Christians kill 12 and 4 hostages, you saw the other side. That's the point I'm trying to make :p
     

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