Arturo Vidal (86 Viewers)
- Thread starter Azzurri7
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Bayern had won 4 CL titles by 2006. We were and still are on 2. I don't know how having half the number of CL crowns makes you have the richer history.
This argument 
We've won a tougher league more times than Bayern, we've actually won more UEFA trophies overall than Bayern. Our individual players have won more major trophies than Bayern...
SO basically people are putting all the weight in the world on Bayern doing better in CL final. And it's not as if we haven't played in a quite a number of CL finals.
Saying anything other than Juventus and Bayern are on the same tier historically is so incredibly ridiculous. It means you ignore everything but CL titles. Everything else, Juve has the advantage in.
We've won a tougher league more times than Bayern, we've actually won more UEFA trophies overall than Bayern. Our individual players have won more major trophies than Bayern...
SO basically people are putting all the weight in the world on Bayern doing better in CL final. And it's not as if we haven't played in a quite a number of CL finals.
Saying anything other than Juventus and Bayern are on the same tier historically is so incredibly ridiculous. It means you ignore everything but CL titles. Everything else, Juve has the advantage in.
At one point, they were. They had more global recognition because of their success.
Our reliance on Italian core is admirable, but teams with more "global" players and icons obviously have a bigger following.
Are Man United a bigger club than Liverpool and Arsenal? Currently, most definitely yes. Had I asked you this question prior to 93, the answer would have been an emphatic no.
Our reliance on Italian core is admirable, but teams with more "global" players and icons obviously have a bigger following.
Are Man United a bigger club than Liverpool and Arsenal? Currently, most definitely yes. Had I asked you this question prior to 93, the answer would have been an emphatic no.
This argument
We've won a tougher league more times than Bayern, we've actually won more UEFA trophies overall than Bayern. Our individual players have won more major trophies than Bayern...
SO basically people are putting all the weight in the world on Bayern doing better in CL final. And it's not as if we haven't played in a quite a number of CL finals.
Saying anything other than Juventus and Bayern are on the same tier historically is so incredibly ridiculous. It means you ignore everything but CL titles. Everything else, Juve has the advantage in.
We've won a tougher league more times than Bayern, we've actually won more UEFA trophies overall than Bayern. Our individual players have won more major trophies than Bayern...
SO basically people are putting all the weight in the world on Bayern doing better in CL final. And it's not as if we haven't played in a quite a number of CL finals.
Saying anything other than Juventus and Bayern are on the same tier historically is so incredibly ridiculous. It means you ignore everything but CL titles. Everything else, Juve has the advantage in.
Why pick selectively? If you speak about Balon D'or winners, you mention the players who won it with Juve, while playing their at their prime. Not wether if they spent their days there for long time and what kind of legends they were for the club besides being great players. But strictly Balon D'or winners (I dont count Cannavaro), we have alot of football greats who had the honour of wearing our shirt and winning alot of titles, including this individual award. Also majority of them foreign ones besides Baggio (I count Sivori as argie), while for Bayern its all German legends/winners.
And the main and only big legend of theirs I kind envy for not having that type of huge player profile is Beckenbauer (though had icon like Scirea). While the rest, the nr 10s and genius level attacking players we have had more then them for sure.
And the main and only big legend of theirs I kind envy for not having that type of huge player profile is Beckenbauer (though had icon like Scirea). While the rest, the nr 10s and genius level attacking players we have had more then them for sure.
So? We talking football greats/Balon D'Ors. Zizou was great for us and was best in the world while with us. I did not know/forgot Matthäus won the award, yeah he is great, but defenitely would take Baggio over him. Same with Platini and Beckenbauer, simply because a genius all time great ATTACKING player is more useful then a defensive one for sure. Regarding Muller and Sivori, probably right based on numbers, havent seem much of either. Though Sivori was quite different type of all around player instead of the crazy poacher Muller.
Sorry but Vidal is much more of a Juve legend than Zidane ever will be. What did Zidane do for us? He never played to his full potential at Juve, he saved that for France and Real Madrid.
Vidal gave more than any other player on the pitch in 4 seasons. He actually reminded me of Nedved with his tireless running from defence to attack.
Vidal gave more than any other player on the pitch in 4 seasons. He actually reminded me of Nedved with his tireless running from defence to attack.
It's more what you derive from his inability to articulate and lack of tact. He is clearly not the sharpest knife in the drawer. But if you think the club is not big enough for him he wouldn't tattoo all those stars over himself if they meant nothing. I don't think he meant it the way we are interpreting it. That's just my take. Feel free to disagree.
Just straight talk really. Building up the move.
If he doesn't get any major injuries, he's easily got another 5 years at the highest level. With 3 world class ones, yep.
This is interesting, there could well be a third angle. Just playing devils advocate here. Juve and Bayern secretly dealt for Vidsl and closed the deal without his knowledge while he was at the Copa, after which Juve gave Bayern permission to talk to him. Didn't the Chilean press also say at one point that Vidal had been promised to a top European club?
A) Could it be that this is something that upset him and he's gone on to say what he's said, coz up until the Copa he wanted to see out his career at Juve.
B) This move for most part happened overnight, without any back and forth, clearly also goes someway to indicate that most of the negotiations were already done and in place. Think about it, had this happened on a player and agent level, we would've had far more rumours and discussions about this transfer. But that was never the case. Only the power of two big clubs could keep it hushed up.
Just some thoughts worth considering.
True that. Juve and Bayern are definitely closer in pedigree and performance though, than the top 2, Madrid and Barca. Even though I feel Barca are more pretenders than anything else. Most of their true success has been in the last decade but they've always had this persona of the biggest club in the world, sometimes unduly IMO.
Technically that lot would be miles ahead of most players that have played for other big clubs too.
Just straight talk really. Building up the move.
If he doesn't get any major injuries, he's easily got another 5 years at the highest level. With 3 world class ones, yep.
This is interesting, there could well be a third angle. Just playing devils advocate here. Juve and Bayern secretly dealt for Vidsl and closed the deal without his knowledge while he was at the Copa, after which Juve gave Bayern permission to talk to him. Didn't the Chilean press also say at one point that Vidal had been promised to a top European club?
A) Could it be that this is something that upset him and he's gone on to say what he's said, coz up until the Copa he wanted to see out his career at Juve.
B) This move for most part happened overnight, without any back and forth, clearly also goes someway to indicate that most of the negotiations were already done and in place. Think about it, had this happened on a player and agent level, we would've had far more rumours and discussions about this transfer. But that was never the case. Only the power of two big clubs could keep it hushed up.
Just some thoughts worth considering.
This argument
We've won a tougher league more times than Bayern, we've actually won more UEFA trophies overall than Bayern. Our individual players have won more major trophies than Bayern...
SO basically people are putting all the weight in the world on Bayern doing better in CL final. And it's not as if we haven't played in a quite a number of CL finals.
Saying anything other than Juventus and Bayern are on the same tier historically is so incredibly ridiculous. It means you ignore everything but CL titles. Everything else, Juve has the advantage in.
We've won a tougher league more times than Bayern, we've actually won more UEFA trophies overall than Bayern. Our individual players have won more major trophies than Bayern...
SO basically people are putting all the weight in the world on Bayern doing better in CL final. And it's not as if we haven't played in a quite a number of CL finals.
Saying anything other than Juventus and Bayern are on the same tier historically is so incredibly ridiculous. It means you ignore everything but CL titles. Everything else, Juve has the advantage in.
Technically that lot would be miles ahead of most players that have played for other big clubs too.