Agnelli To Blame. (4 Viewers)

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
111,514
#21
Juventus would be nothing without the Agnellis, and despite Luciano Moggi being nothing short of a criminal, nobody knew he would actually cheat on behalf our club. Without the Agnellis this club would be no more than Crotone, so to blame them for where Juventus is now is absolutely preposterous. Show some more respect to the people who built our club, please.
 

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sateeh

Day Walker
Jul 28, 2003
8,020
#22
Batigol said:
i understand what are you saying guys. However, we are not in la liga, where the teams depend on themselves for financial power, like Real and Barca.

in italy it is different, we are fighting to financial powers, Moratti whoes check book is always open, and Berliscuni who also use money, media and politics.
while Agnelli hand the power of presense and paying some money for the club, which in my opinion wasn't enough.
i know that during the times of the late great Giovanni Agnelli, neither Moratti nor Berluscuni could open his mouth, PM on not. Giovanni will distroy him.

what i want to say here is the lack of money drove Moggi to his acts.
i am sure that most of you remeber the news before the begining of the last season, where Fiat officials and Agnelli members said they will not pay money fo finance any transfer. our former president Stevens, siad if we want to buy a new player we have to burn the wood we have. i believe all that drove Moggi to what did all those year, and i believe that is the disadvantage that he was talking about.
but saying that there was not any money for transfers , was the fact for years.Not just recently, i really want to know why moggi did this...The club always made smart transfers, that was something we were proud of.We didnt need the big finances to win the scudetto or even the champions league.
 
Jan 24, 2004
2,179
#23
the answers for the question why Agnelli didn't spend big during our transfers are:

1.) They don't have the financial power to invest in high-risk soccer transfers. No time for gambling on players as FIAT is very deeply in debt. And FIAT is prior to Juventus, economically spoken.

2.) The history had shown that we didn't need to take billions in our hands to lure players to Juventus. Juventus was a story of success and therefor a popular club for players without contracts. That has evidently changed as our own players try to find exit.
 

- vOnAm -

Senior Member
Jul 22, 2004
3,779
#26
Batigol said:
i understand what are you saying guys. However, we are not in la liga, where the teams depend on themselves for financial power, like Real and Barca.

in italy it is different, we are fighting to financial powers, Moratti whoes check book is always open, and Berliscuni who also use money, media and politics.
while Agnelli hand the power of presense and paying some money for the club, which in my opinion wasn't enough.
i know that during the times of the late great Giovanni Agnelli, neither Moratti nor Berluscuni could open his mouth, PM on not. Giovanni will distroy him.

what i want to say here is the lack of money drove Moggi to his acts.
i am sure that most of you remeber the news before the begining of the last season, where Fiat officials and Agnelli members said they will not pay money fo finance any transfer. our former president Stevens, siad if we want to buy a new player we have to burn the wood we have. i believe all that drove Moggi to what did all those year, and i believe that is the disadvantage that he was talking about.
Since when is Barcelona and Real Madrid independant? If Im not mistaken they are supported financially by their respected Cities, so they are not totally independant financially.

Juventus never had that much money, that is clear. But IMO, Juventus are among the most self sustained clubs in the world (thinking a sec, making sure, ehm to my knowledge and memory, yes)...This is an advantage because we don't rely on anybody like some here already mentioned.

If you're trying to link together Agnelli's death and Moggi's exposure then perhaps it is so, there is no one to protect Moggi since Agnelli's death, but although I wish Juve had more money for transfers, I am very proud of how Juve manages its financial and business side of things.
 

Sianconero

Junior Member
Dec 13, 2005
441
#27
Agnelli family is much more respective that Moratti or Berlusconi.
They did for us. They have a logical spending in the club cause they have other things to think about. Juve is not their only capital.
 

Geof

Senior Member
May 14, 2004
6,740
#28
Batigol said:
i understand what are you saying guys. However, we are not in la liga, where the teams depend on themselves for financial power, like Real and Barca.

in italy it is different, we are fighting to financial powers, Moratti whoes check book is always open, and Berliscuni who also use money, media and politics.
while Agnelli hand the power of presense and paying some money for the club, which in my opinion wasn't enough.
i know that during the times of the late great Giovanni Agnelli, neither Moratti nor Berluscuni could open his mouth, PM on not. Giovanni will distroy him.

what i want to say here is the lack of money drove Moggi to his acts.
i am sure that most of you remeber the news before the begining of the last season, where Fiat officials and Agnelli members said they will not pay money fo finance any transfer. our former president Stevens, siad if we want to buy a new player we have to burn the wood we have. i believe all that drove Moggi to what did all those year, and i believe that is the disadvantage that he was talking about.
You do have a point by saying that the Agnelli's power has faded in recent years. True that. The economic wonder of FIAT got back to reality, people were fired, and FIAT became a regular European industrial group, struggling like the others against the cheap competition of Japan, Korea, and now China. Money doesn't grow anymore, and thus can't be spent for fun.

The death of Gianni also played a role in that decline. The man basically ruled Italy from his office, even with the difficulties of FIAT, his morale influence was still as high as ever.
After his death, Lapo Elkann ridiculised himself in scandals, but today John Elkann seems ready to step up. Of course he's young, and he doesn't scare other big men in the Italian Calcio/politics like Berlusca, Della Valle or Moratti.

Even if they aren't the symbols they used to be in the 60's anymore, you must realise that the name Agnelli still means a lot for every Italian, from big industrials to the working class.
You said earlier that they are like the Royal family of Italy, but I'd rather compare them to the Kennedy's of Italy. Beautiful, intelligent, rich, influential, yet touched by sudden deaths of several family members... That's everything you need to make them a legend.

Honestly, I prefer to be a club with a good yet limited transfer budget that is used very decently, instead of buying players by the dozen, hoping that one of them will be good.

All this writing made me nostalgic of a real hero for all Italians and Juventini... Gianni Agnelli




Oh and btw, I still don't understand how you can blame the Agnelli. That's a shame


For a quick overview of who Gianni Agnelli was see (in English) http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/2690547.stm
 

Martin

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
#30
Batigol, I can agree with you that it might have been careless to let the Triade have those kinds of freedoms, frankly I don't think we're able to tell to what extent the Agnelli's knew what Moggi was up to.

But to say they should have pumped more money into the club is a whole other matter. I don't think it's entirely fair to say that, you spend money if you have it and you want to spend it, otherwise you don't. Moratti apparently does and so he's invested more than he could ever get out of Inter. The Agnelli's however, provide a backbone for our financial stability, just now they bailed us out of the stock market. But I don't think you can demand that they invest in the club at a loss, not everyone is willing to flush money down the toilet. Clubs today are businesses and a business is supposed to be self-sufficient.
 
OP
Batigol

Batigol

Senior Member
Mar 5, 2006
904
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #31
    There are a lot of good comments here, however, i can't reply now, i have a test adn then another to study for. so i will com back. i will leave you with this news from yahoo.
     
    OP
    Batigol

    Batigol

    Senior Member
    Mar 5, 2006
    904
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #32
    Cash boost required to save Juventus

    July 17, 2006
    ROME (Ticker) - Juventus is heading for "financial meltdown" unless it receives a huge cash injection from private investors over the next two or three years, according to a soccer finance expert.

    The Turin club on Friday was ordered by a sports court in Rome to play in Serie B next season, after being exposed as having a central involvement in arguably the biggest corruption case in Italian soccer history.

    It is questionable whether Juventus - which also has been stripped of its league titles in 2005 and this year - will escape another relegation at the end of next season, as it will kick off the new campaign with a 30-point deduction.



    Fiorentina and Lazio also have been relegated to Serie B and will start next season with 12- and seven-point deficits, respectively.

    AC Milan will start the 2006-07 campaign in Serie A with a 15-point deficit and has had 44 points deducted from its total last season - meaning it won't compete in the lucrative Champions League.

    Of the four clubs, Juventus certainly has been hit the hardest, and relegation will take a severe toll on the club's finances.

    "Around 80 percent of Juventus' revenue is from sponsorship and television rights deals, and I would expect the vast majority of that to disappear," Stuart Whitwell, a joint managing director of brand consultancy Intangible Business, told PA Sport's Football Insider.

    "There is a triple hit, really. Juventus can expect a loss of at least 50 percent of its income overnight. Under the circumstances sponsors could drop out, and I expect many to do so. There will also be a major loss of players, and thirdly the image of the club is tarnished."

    Whitwell believes there is a decent chance the club may go bankrupt.

    "Unless there is private investment from the Agnelli family (who own the club) or another source, Juventus will go out of business. They could suffer financial meltdown," he said. "I think Juventus will need private investments of around 125 million euros ($158 million) a year for perhaps the next two or three years to keep going. Juventus' ticket revenue is incredibly small for a club of its size and many sponsors will not want to be associated with the club. With the loss of income, Juventus will not be able to command a premium.

    "I do think the Juve image will recover over time, because of the history of the club. Juve does have a bit of magic about it, and I expect that to help carry it through, but it will take years."

    It remains to be seen whether Libyan company Tamoil will pull out of its current partnership with Juventus, which is reportedly worth around 21 million euros ($26.5 million) per year. The agreement represents the most lucrative shirt sponsorship deal in world soccer.

    Although Juventus has around 15 million fans in Italy alone, the club's local support has dwindled in recent years as supporters have become reluctant to visit the unpopular Stadio Delle Alpi.

    Juve attracted average crowds of just 26,390 to its 67,000-capacity home last season, and plans to move to a new ground will be put on hold until the club's finances are stabilized.

    Despite the lack of substantial gate revenue, the Agnelli family, which also owns car manufacturer Fiat, has been able to establish Juventus as one of the most financially stable clubs in Italy for several years.

    The value and status of the club also has been supported by the presence of top internationals in the squad, but following the announcement the likes of goalkeeper Gianluigi Buffon, midfielders Pavel Nedved and Patrick Vieira and striker Zlatan Ibrahimovic all could leave.

    "They have been kings but now they are going to be paupers for a while," Whitwell added. "Many of the players will not want to play in the lower divisions, and will ask to leave, and even if players want to stay, the club might not be able to afford to keep them on their contracts.

    "The club is not going to be able to afford to keep the high-earning players, so there will be some cut-price deals on the transfer market. It's difficult to say what sort of decrease in player value we are talking about, but it could be 50 percent and it could be as much as 75 percent."

    All four clubs will appeal, but the hearings will have to take place before July 25 - UEFA's deadline for receiving the list of teams ready to participate in its competitions next season.
     

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