Spring Cleaning (1 Viewer)

[Bjerknes]

Considering there has been quite a lot of discussion regarding the improvment of this forum, I thought it would be pertinent to create another thread specifically for said cause and eliminate the clutter within another farewell thread.

Many important issues regarding the quality of this forum have been brought to light, and in an attempt to remedy these problems we must have a decent plan or course of action. Over recent months, the quality of posts on this forum have really fallen down the drain, and this is due to a number of reasons, specifically such as: 1) Mass exodus of more established members 2) Creation of vbPlaza and vBookie which takes away from posting 3) Thief option which creates quarrels between members and 4) Arcade which also takes away from posting. Essentially, with people spending more time dealing with betting and arcade games, the one thing that this place was originally built for has taken a hit...namely the actual posts.

To raise the quality of discussion on this forum, many suggestions have been given to Marty, who seems to have his eyes open to this subject. Some of the suggestions are as follows:

1) Temporary/permanent closing of the Arcade, vBookie, and/or vbPlaza function(s) of this forum. As I stated earlier, these options can be very time consuming and thus take away from the true nature this forum was built for.

2) Temporary suspension of the reputation system. There has been far too many posts regarding reputation in recent months, and just as an Arms Race between nations, the race to receive reputation is very detrimental to the state of affairs in this place, especially when rep is given for the most trivial and nonsensical posts. This function has also created quarrels between some members.

3) Implementation of at least two new moderators, perhaps more, to insure the quality and well-being of the forum. The moderation on this forum is sporadic at best, and as Mikhail most recently stated he can only take care of posts that are reported or posts that he and his fellow moderating staff can see. Seeing that there has been quite a few threads that have succumb to fighting between members or turning into nothing more than "msn chit-chat," something needs to be done. NOTE: I personally feel that the selection of new moderators should not be a popularity contest, because we have seen the results of this practice before and it doesn't always turn out too pretty.

4) Possible implementation of a "senior members" subforum to address certain issues in the short run and to develop a greater standard of posting on the forum, as suggested by Tom.

5) Mass-unbanning of the better members despite being banned at least once for banable offenses, however still regarded as good members. There have been a few banned members who, while staying on topic, added a lot to this forum in terms of discussion and football knowledge. Posters such as Claire, Jaecole, and Seven know about football and would improve the quality of discussion on this forum. HOWEVER, it must be made clear that this is indeed their FINAL CHANCE and if they receive their warning and commit one more offense...they will be banned for GOOD. No question. With no chance of a reinstatement. This leads to the next point...

6) Amendments to forum rules. Looking at the rules section of this forum, there seems to be a lot left to be desired when talking about technicalities such as warnings and bans, and this needs to be improved so that a standard is clearly evident.

There have been other minor suggestions, and if I have missed any that you feel are important, please feel free to make a post explaining for your ideas or the ideas of others.

Certain members have also stated time and time again that it's easy to "talk the talk," and most of the time nothing ever comes from the good suggestions. If we really are serious about improving the quality of this place, we need to lobby for the changes before its forgotten, or even more frightening, before the problem becomes worse.

 

Buy on AliExpress.com

[3pac]

Can i stay?

 

[Enron]

Too many big words. Screw this, Im going to make lasagna.

 

[WΏΏdy?]

in response to andy's points...
1. that's natural...senior members at other forum leave all the time too...coz they realise how much time the have been wasting..
2. the betting and bank r cool options....never takes too much time as restricting the members frm posting in the forum..
3. u r right abt this one..but ppl over react...i mean come on its just v-cash..
4. i never visited the arcade before...and now i looked into it and the stats says the most no of members ever in arcade were 18...that's not too much when we have abt 500 activer record members present at the forum....


and tha marty suggestion thingy..
1. errr...no comment..can't say much coz i am a new member and donno how the forum was in "older" days...
2. there is no sence in the rep system...and it should be turned off...
3. can't comment...its for senior members to decide..but seriously a poll to choose new mods will do good and no one can blame the selection...
4. no comment
5. i agree...but those members who were banned for racist or religios remarks should stay banned..
6. true..


these r just my suggestions....but frankly speaking i know why all this problem is occuring...i am the senior most member at the kimi raikkonen official forum and a former mod.....i have seen senior members leave there without a apparent reason,they leave coz of two reasons....1.they realise they have more in=mportant things to do 2.new members..

Now the new hot topic here is the way "some" old members treat the new.....some...well can't really blame them coz i have been in the situation of the ld" members too...they jus c this place where they have been for years with thousnads of posts...and then new members r there posting and making new frnds....the old members think their privacy is invaded...this is clearly evident when some members started posting in the "nick again.."thread...that is but natura reaction frm the old members..

but if they want to improve the form condition there is nothing the change in the mods attitude or introduction of new tech options wil do....believe me nothing will improve with all this proposed things unless and untill these members change their attitude....and i speak this by experience ....no offence to anyone....
and i know i will be getting a lot of criticism for this post...also a few neg reps


peace..

 

[Hambon]

Every thing is cool.....but leave the bookie section.....it adds some excitement plus a refuge for our gambling addicts...hehe

 

[Hambon]

We should write a constituion for this place

i will start....

We the people.....

 

[flieeeekke]

as paul rightly put, there should be more mods installed. if we're going along the stict line, there must always be people online to enforce it. i believe the forum is expanding, and just one or two active mods arent enough. because the existing ones are complaining about the load of work. and maybe we should return to the old skool? when certain mod was responsible for certain subforum. i believe jeeks would make a great hangout mod, while mark would be better football section moderator


what you think
please discuss

 

[Desmond]

1) Temporary/permanent closing of the Arcade, vBookie, and/or vbPlaza function(s) of this forum. As I stated earlier, these options can be very time consuming and thus take away from the true nature this forum was built for.

2) Temporary suspension of the reputation system. There has been far too many posts regarding reputation in recent months, and just as an Arms Race between nations, the race to receive reputation is very detrimental to the state of affairs in this place, especially when rep is given for the most trivial and nonsensical posts. This function has also created quarrels between some members.

3) Implementation of at least two new moderators, perhaps more, to insure the quality and well-being of the forum. The moderation on this forum is sporadic at best, and as Mikhail most recently stated he can only take care of posts that are reported or posts that he and his fellow moderating staff can see. Seeing that there has been quite a few threads that have succumb to fighting between members or turning into nothing more than "msn chit-chat," something needs to be done. NOTE: I personally feel that the selection of new moderators should not be a popularity contest, because we have seen the results of this practice before and it doesn't always turn out too pretty.

4) Possible implementation of a "senior members" subforum to address certain issues in the short run and to develop a greater standard of posting on the forum, as suggested by Tom.

5) Mass-unbanning of the better members despite being banned at least once for banable offenses, however still regarded as good members. There have been a few banned members who, while staying on topic, added a lot to this forum in terms of discussion and football knowledge. Posters such as Claire, Jaecole, and Seven know about football and would improve the quality of discussion on this forum. HOWEVER, it must be made clear that this is indeed their FINAL CHANCE and if they receive their warning and commit one more offense...they will be banned for GOOD. No question. With no chance of a reinstatement. This leads to the next point...

6) Amendments to forum rules. Looking at the rules section of this forum, there seems to be a lot left to be desired when talking about technicalities such as warnings and bans, and this needs to be improved so that a standard is clearly evident.

1) As I stated I'm all for this, these new functions, time consuming or otherwise, add nothing to the forum and there are plenty of avenues out there for people looking for a gambling fix or some good fun. At the end of the day the posting takes precedence over all else and every change we implement should be done with that in mind.

2) While the reputation system does pertain to the actual posting activities it has added nothing of actual value to the forums (IMHO of course). Its degraded several threads into petty squabbles over what I suspect was originally intended to add a little spice to posting and as an incentive (however superficial and insignificant incentive that might be) for posters to up the quality; evidently its failed.

3) The idea of a popularity contest was never really sold on me and I assume its safe to say the outcome has left alot of people with a sour taste in their mouths; as far as I can see moderators have lost their air of authority because certain members feel that they were responsible in putting them "in power", so to speak. Moderator selection IMHO should always be confined to the uppermost authorities in the forum in this case the current standing mods including Marty of course.

4) As elitist as this may sound I actually think its a good idea, most importantly the majority populace must take it in the right spirit and understand that, I'm sure, it is never the intention of any of these "senior members" to marginalise or isolate anyone.

5) Purely the decision of the moderators IMHO. Forum members increasingly having their say in how discipline is implemented has been in a way detrimental to the forum; in particular kudos to mikail for always standing his ground where this is concerned. It was always this way ever since I joined and the events of the past year or so hasn't convinced me that it is better any other way.

6) Again, purely a moderating decision.

 

[Torkel]

If Fli becomes a mod I want some cred for that, I suggest that many moons ago in the mod forum.

The moderators for each sub-forum things was never a big deal. I don't think many of the mods thought about it then, at least I didn't.

I agree that more mods should be appointed, but that's very difficult. Nothing will help "destroy" the forum more than if bad mods are appointed. Imo the primary job of the mods aren't to police the forum, but to be great members, make decisions about the forum and set the the tone. Those members are hard to find. Can't really think of too many. I guess Jeeks would be one.

Needless to say, people wanting a vote about should just go away. That would be absolutely horrible.

The rep needs to go. It hasn't worked out, that's easy to see. Right now it has zero value.

6) Amendments to forum rules. Looking at the rules section of this forum, there seems to be a lot left to be desired when talking about technicalities such as warnings and bans, and this needs to be improved so that a standard is clearly evident.

I don't agree with this, when I was a mod the rules weren't specific, and if you (the moderator) was in doubt you just asked your fellow mods. Judgement calls were made all the time, and imo that worked out perfect. I'm confident that this will work out if all of the moderators are high class. Right now it's probably not working, due to a shortage of moderators.

 

[Mr. Gol]

I've personally never used the rep system, or the arcade, or the vBookie. But only the reputation system has been a flop IMO, in some the threads half the posts consist of something like "haha +rep". I can't imagine that anyone thinks the rep system has been an improvement.

I also agree with Torkel that the rules are fine as they are. I don't like the idea of tons of rules, which leaves zero room for the mods to have their personal interpretation of them.

 

[Desmond]

Imo the primary job of the mods aren't to police the forum, but to be great members, make decisions about the forum and set the the tone. Those members are hard to find.

My sentiments exactly. Back in the day, moderators were known for far more than policing the forums, it was a fair line between maintaining that authority and bringing moderators to a more personal level the general populace could connect with. Having great, suitable posters made that selection process alot easier. Unfortunately its become alot more complicated nowadays.

 

[Azzurri7]

I think It would be better to get back the betting thing that we had before.....and delet the current one, the one before was really simple and only taking our time when It was boring.

 

[un altro alex]

My sentiments exactly. Back in the day, moderators were known for far more than policing the forums, it was a fair line between maintaining that authority and bringing moderators to a more personal level the general populace could connect with. Having great, suitable posters made that selection process alot easier. Unfortunately its become alot more complicated nowadays.

ok fine, i'll do it

 

[Ramin]

..

I dont think the vBookie is the issue here. The main reason for this forum's downfall is the lack of mods (losing graham was a big blow to this place) to clean all the garbage that some are posting.

Threads like "hire me, you have a better chance to win the cl" and other members opening theads saying Juve should sign them, by Footballitalia should be closed right at the spot...but none of the current mods do anything about it. There is like 2 mods at the moment as far as i know Mikhail, who is rarely around these days, and Swag, who doesnt help with those issues as well (nothing against you).

And there are like zillion threads about the same topics, where non of the mods bother to merge them..

Atleast five more mods are needed for the forum to get back to shape.

 

[Hambon]

I am all for what Andy,fli,& desmond have all said above....i know i have no seniority here but this place would be much better off with more quality post like back in the days of the grey forum.....i used to love reading the post game reports and the great discussions here...

as for the rep,arcade,thier,immunity and point system... they gots to go ....


just leave the old vbookie and that would be great....

 

[Snoop]

Good thread, and I hope Marty reads it and take it seriously..

Arcade and Bookies are not harming like Andy mentioned, but if he explains it with more details why would it harm, maybe I will agree with him. But arcade, I can't imagine how it will harm the forums, members rarley play it, and no one discusses about it..

Vbplaza and reputation are harming the forums a lot, remove them forever..

Mods: remove swag from his position, and bring objective mods, and not just populars or figures. Mikhail should stay, and appoint as a mod (if they accept ofcourse) 3 or 4 of the likes of Tom, Fliakis, Respaul, Dominic, Don bes, Nick (yeah, even if he is a Milanista), torkel, cronios.. and alot of members that can do the job prorerly..

Ban/ warn more members if it is required.otherwise remove that rules if no one will use them umpkin:

Any Members who disrespect the other, with insulting, naming childish names, or replying someone's post with "crap" should be warned, and banned in case of repeating.

Also Insulting Juve players, the coach, directros and fans shouldn't be allowed..

This is how it was at Martin's time, and it was much better than now.

and not to forget, unban the banned members, and we should all start from scratch, I care to see this place like it was before, but I hardly think it will be as good as before, who knows anyway..

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

you know what, i think all you people are being drama queens. you are giving too much credit to these so called "older" memebers. i say the people have always left (besides me and some may say 7) and new ones have come up and we never felt the need to start crying.
juventus itself is gowing through a rough patch i mean, who wants to discuss when you see that everything you have to say has already been said. i mean now all we have to do is copy paste the match report from last game (something which vinni has mastered ), every game now is the same poop.

here are some of the changes on the forum that i think could make it better

absolutely no insulting other memebers (unless its a joke)
i dont wanna say absolutely but i mean come on, insluting juve players is getting old, so for the love of a higher supreme being remember the two words "constructive critisism"
do not bring back 7, what for? and the claire shit has been "played out"

the vbookie thing i dont mind. never pay too much attention to it.

as for the rep system, i am all for keeping it, its always nice to check it once in a while and notice that fabi has left a message saying she misses you. I need a life.


promise me this, when i "leave" can i be one of the older memebers whose presence would make the forum better ?

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

Good thread, and I hope Marty reads it and take it seriously..

Arcade and Bookies are not harming like Andy mentioned, but if he explains it with more details why would it harm, maybe I will agree with him. But arcade, I can't imagine how it will harm the forums, members rarley play it, and no one discusses about it..

Vbplaza and reputation are harming the forums a lot, remove them forever..

Mods: remove swag from his position, and bring objective mods, and not just populars or figures. Mikhail should stay, and appoint as a mod (if they accept ofcourse) 3 or 4 of the likes of Tom, Fliakis, Respaul, Dominic, Don bes, Nick (yeah, even if he is a Milanista), torkel, cronios.. and alot of members that can do the job prorerly..

Ban/ warn more members if it is required.otherwise remove that rules if no one will use them umpkin:

Any Members who disrespect the other, with insulting, naming childish names, or replying someone's post with "crap" should be warned, and banned in case of repeating.

Also Insulting Juve players, the coach, directros and fans shouldn't be allowed..

This is how it was at Martin's time, and it was much better than now.

and not to forget, unban the banned members, and we should all start from scratch, I care to see this place like it was before, but I hardly think it will be as good as before, who knows anyway..

snoop, you my dog. thanks for the consideration. so whats wrong with swag ?

 

[Juve_Kosova]

you know what, i think all you people are being drama queens. you are giving too much credit to these so called "older" memebers. i say the people have always left (besides me and some may say 7) and new ones have come up and we never felt the need to start crying.
juventus itself is gowing through a rough patch i mean, who wants to discuss when you see that everything you have to say has already been said. i mean now all we have to do is copy paste the match report from last game (something which vinni has mastered ), every game now is the same poop.

Well Said..!

T'lumt

 

[un altro alex]

Speaking as a member with less than 1000 posts, probably the only one in this thread so far, i'd just like to point out that I don't think the Arcade steals so much of a posters time, but is more like a pastime whilst waiting for a post to be answered to in the lonely/slow hours.
also, the vBookie provides a small sense of exhiliration for those who don't want or can't go an blow all their real money on betting.
finally, i think members should be congratulated for intelligent or amusing posts, and rep is an incentive for some to try to provide such. maybe it could simply be restricted instead of being so easy to give out.
and sure adding new mods is a good idea, but i don't see the necessity for them to be old members, as long as they are devoted and serious about their job.

then again, that's just an opinion.