Zlatan Ibrahimovic (4 Viewers)

Ibra to Juve again, yes or no?

  • YES

  • NO


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Fake Melo

Ghost Division
Sep 3, 2010
37,077
With the last sentence i will let you go off the hook ;)

So define what have they both didn't do in europe, meaning not winning a CL or not scoring against big teams?
Because Football is still a team sport and both of them scored plenty in europe. So was it them who choked or the whole team?
It's really unfair to call game changing player's chokers. They're playing a phenomenal level of football all year round and I think we should respect that. These guys play under pressure all year round. You can brand a team chokers, but in an eleven man game, it's very unfair to blame one guy for a collective failure. Irrespective of Zlatan and RvP, I don't think Robben or DP for that matter are chokers either. It's a silly term. Any guy playing at this level deserves to be there and you can have nothing but respect for the discipline of an athlete.
:tup:
 

Azzurri7

Pinturicchio
Moderator
Dec 16, 2003
72,692
Rab I know you and i have different opinions on the matter but as alen said im looking at it from an objective point of view as to what would take us nearer to our goals
And what are Juve's goals?

Win the Serie A? Check.
Go far in Coppa play and play the final? Check.
Win the CL? With Zingaro? :lol2:
 

Bianconero_Aus

Beppe Marotta Is My God
May 26, 2009
76,972
Turk too :D

I love those two. They always go with what they think is the best for Juve. No other emotions involved. You and I are badly biased in Zlatan's case. Some others are seriously biased about some other players. But for Turk and Badass it's very simple. It's only about what they think is the best for Juve, and in this particular case they know Zlatan will upgrade our attack like no other attacker will do. That's enough for them to put aside their former hatred for the player.
Badass is by far the most hardcore Juventino there is.
 

Azzurri7

Pinturicchio
Moderator
Dec 16, 2003
72,692
well as i said it is an improvement and whether you like him or not he is a leap in quality for our attacking line which is most certainly going to help us in the CL
If Conte stick to his tactics like in the previous 2seasons, no he's not an improvement. Conte wants his strikers to run back the midfield, close down the gap and open up spaces for wingers/flanks. The camel can and will never run back for the ball unless Conte changes his tactics and approach.
 

baggio

Senior Member
Jun 3, 2003
19,250
Basketball reference here, Tracy Mcgrady was the best scorer in the NBA, great player but he never made it out of the first round of the playoffs, oltough he was great player and troughtout his carrer he played in mostly bad teams, he's labelled as a choker because he couldn't make in the biggest stages ( playoffs ), same for Zingaro, he never made it in the biggest stages, he always goes missing in big games and wait for his teammates to save him. That's a choker for you.
Would be an unfair analogy if you compare the sport itself. You're talking about footie, the most spectated sport in the world. You're playing with double the variables in team size alone, making the individual even less significant. Can you imagine the kind of pressure it would take to be at your best all the time withh so much expectation? And for a large part all of these guys are at their best. It's unfair because they have e discipline to earn the salaries they're paid, they sacrifice and play with their hearts. Even a mercenary like Ibra if you like, when on the football pitch looks to bring his best game forward because he may not be loyal to the team he plays for, but he has pride in his ability. Tracy McGrady cannot be blamed, because his teams largely were shite. He was expected to carry the teams all the time, and it's almost impossible to do that on a consistent basis no matter how good or bad you are. Even Jordan couldn't have done it without Scotty. People call Sachin Tendulkar a choker, but 99.9% of the people who question him wouldn't be able to do half of what he's done on the pitch. He's playing at the age of fourty, in a high pressure sport and being asked to deliver. Sure, he is going to fail a bit more today but his body is older. Even earlier, he probably failed on big finals, but he did more than enough to get the team all the way there. The expectation was consistent in every game leading up to the final. That's not choking. It's having an off day. You can be temperamentally weak or strong, but if you're playing at this level, that in itself is an achievement.


Golf reference, Greg Norman was number one for so many years but he only won 2 majors, he lost in play-offs so many times, he is labelled a choker.
I love Norman. Always preferred him to Faldo. Although ive got to say you can call an individual a choker if you like even though it takes quite a bit to be number one and hold that position becaus you're constantly under pressure to deliver. But it's very hard for one man to choke a team of ten other players. The entire team can be chokers.
 

Badass J Elkann

It's time to go!!
Feb 12, 2006
65,685
If Conte stick to his tactics like in the previous 2seasons, no he's not an improvement. Conte wants his strikers to run back the midfield, close down the gap and open up spaces for wingers/flanks. The camel can and will never run back for the ball unless Conte changes his tactics and approach.
thats what we thought about vucinic as well who is arguably as lazy if not more
 

Raz

Senior Member
Nov 20, 2005
12,218
It's really unfair to call game changing player's chokers. They're playing a phenomenal level of football all year round and I think we should respect that. These guys play under pressure all year round. You can brand a team chokers, but in an eleven man game, it's very unfair to blame one guy for a collective failure. Irrespective of Zlatan and RvP, I don't think Robben or DP for that matter are chokers either. It's a silly term. Any guy playing at this level deserves to be there and you can have nothing but respect for the discipline of an athlete.
Exactly :top:
 

V

Senior Member
Jun 8, 2005
20,110
  • V

    V

The attempts to undermine Zlatan's quality, or better yet, usefulness for Juventus are nothing short of ridiculous. :howler:
 

Mr Chocolate

Rubba Band Business
Dec 23, 2012
6,676
I love Norman. Always preferred him to Faldo. Although ive got to say you can call an individual a choker if you like even though it takes quite a bit to be number one and hold that position becaus you're constantly under pressure to deliver. But it's very hard for one man to choke a team of ten other players. The entire team can be chokers.
yeah, its easier to label an individual as a choker because he doesn't have to rely on a team than labelling a person who is in a team as a choker. and yeah to play at the top level of any sport you must be an elite athlete.
 

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