The Official Alberbo Zaccheroni Thread (14 Viewers)

[v1rtu4l]

Having a plan, but not having the players to execute it, is little better than not having a plan.

so what was actually your plan with the player we got ?

they are professionals ... players must have the ability to follow simple directions and just fullfill the best they can...

switching things around just because you believe the players would be more suited to do other things is not helping here.

it's like saying "uuuuh, de ceglie does not know how to man mark so we invent a position that does fit his qualities"... but its not about a few players in front not being able to counter, its more about seeing the whole team and if it performs in the first half, i dont think you should change 3 players to make counter attacking possible (keeping in mind we did not have those 3 players that would be perfect for counter attacking).... and i would like to add that there were players on the field able to counter attack, because i have seen many games where we counter attacked by zanetti giving a long pass over the defense to del piero who might not be the fastest but obviously fast enough to play a counter

Juve, with the players on the pitch, should have been looking to hold possession, as a counter attack was never likely.

still we had them ... if some of our stars would not have been such ball-hoggers and played the ball faster . . . but what do you want to demand from a 35 year old ^^

 

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[Red]

All I'm saying is that when the ball was cleared by the defence, the forward players should have been looking to retain the ball and allow the rest of the team to push up, because Del Piero and Trezeguet don't have to pace to play of the counter effectively any more.

As it was, the ball was continually given away cheaply, so Ajax were able to pen Juve back and build pressure.

I'm not blaming the players for their short-comings, but I feel the gameplan relying on the break was doomed to fail.

 

[v1rtu4l]

i agree that del piero and trez did not as good on the counter attack as other strikers would have done ... add to that, the balls played out of your defense where nowhere zanetti-quality, but that was to be expected, when chiellini or legro blast the ball high ...

i am not naming de ceglie here, because he has not the ability to clear the ball high when its on the ground, because somehow he does never blast the ball higher then 3 metres or something and the ball will hit the next opponent standing 10 metres away from him.

which leads me to an interesting theory... are de ceglies crosses only better than molinaros crosses, because he does not know how to play the ball higher then 2 or 3 m ? that was something i had critizised back when de ceglie played left back last season. he is not able to blast it high away when under pressure. his clearings always hit the next opponent instead of fly to the opponents half.

de ceglie defensively played well today (for his standards) ... that does not mean that i like him as our starter, but give credit where its due

i think saying "the gameplan failed" is a bit harsh. the gameplan was to proceed ... this was what we have done ... a bonus would have been a goal/win ... which we did not achieve. failing reads so bad ... but i do not think it was bad

 

[Red]

The gameplan was a success in as much as the target was achieved, but it didn't really function particularly well.

 

[JBF]

i agree that del piero and trez did not as good on the counter attack as other strikers would have done ... add to that, the balls played out of your defense where nowhere zanetti-quality, but that was to be expected, when chiellini or legro blast the ball high ...

i am not naming de ceglie here, because he has not the ability to clear the ball high when its on the ground, because somehow he does never blast the ball higher then 3 metres or something and the ball will hit the next opponent standing 10 metres away from him.

which leads me to an interesting theory... are de ceglies crosses only better than molinaros crosses, because he does not know how to play the ball higher then 2 or 3 m ? that was something i had critizised back when de ceglie played left back last season. he is not able to blast it high away when under pressure. his clearings always hit the next opponent instead of fly to the opponents half.

de ceglie defensively played well today (for his standards) ... that does not mean that i like him as our starter, but give credit where its due

i think saying "the gameplan failed" is a bit harsh. the gameplan was to proceed ... this was what we have done ... a bonus would have been a goal/win ... which we did not achieve. failing reads so bad ... but i do not think it was bad

There's a big difference between a cross and a clearance. DC cant clear the ball that's for sure and it was obvious during this match, but he sure as hell can cross.

And yes, he's much much better LB than Moli was with us.

 

[v1rtu4l]

what i was to say was, de ceglie does not know the correct technique to strike the ball so that it does take a high curve (higher than his crosses) and so he is not able to make a targeted clearing.

and if he does not know how to blast the ball high into the air its just natural that his crosses will not fly high like molinaros, because he does not even know how to do it, if he wanted ...

the think with molinaro is, that he did not cross alot high at the end of his spell with us and you could see it in the barca game too. he does more often pass the ball low which in his case is good, because the chance of anyone reaching the ball is bigger ^^

 

[only-juve]

Zacch's team reminds me of ranieri's team but with different formations. ranieri uses the 4-4-2 and zacch with he's 3-4-3 or 4-3-1-2 in our case but both play hyper-defensive football with almost no movement in the attack. as long as we're grinding out results and ending 4th in the table its fine.

But i just hope he won't be on our bench coming next season. Unless you're a hardcore Juve fan, no one else would want to watch our games and i don't blame them....

 

[nabulio]

well, i don´t agree. getting results is important, and right now the most important thing, but on the long run we will never ever win anything with this mentality.

we are forcing football, not playing it!

 

[Dominic]

If we had guys like Giovinco and Iaquinta, who attack space, upfront in yesterdays formation, the tactic is perfect.

 

[Dominic]

All I'm saying is that when the ball was cleared by the defence, the forward players should have been looking to retain the ball and allow the rest of the team to push up, because Del Piero and Trezeguet don't have to pace to play of the counter effectively any more.

As it was, the ball was continually given away cheaply, so Ajax were able to pen Juve back and build pressure.

I'm not blaming the players for their short-comings, but I feel the gameplan relying on the break was doomed to fail.

We were never under pressure though. ajax was harmless.

 

[Dostoevsky]

That harmless Ajax had a shot in 91' and we could have conceded easily because we were saving our energy and played a relaxed football.

 

[Dominic]

Whoa one shot at the end of the game that wouldn't have made a difference.

 

[Dostoevsky]

It's how you lose points very often. It's how we lost points with Ranieri.

 

[RAMI-N]

It's how you lose points very often. It's how we lost points with Ranieri.

But Dusan, in this game particularly we could afford to lose 1-0 so that shot in 91st min. was harmless...

 

[v1rtu4l]

It's how you lose points very often. It's how we lost points with Ranieri.

no, with ranieri WE were the team that was banging in late goals ... not the opponent ...

the opponent (when he scored) scored much earlier.

 

[JBF]

If we had guys like Giovinco and Iaquinta, who attack space, upfront in yesterdays formation, the tactic is perfect.

 

[JuveJay]

That harmless Ajax had a shot in 91' and we could have conceded easily because we were saving our energy and played a relaxed football.

So they had one shot in 91 minutes, seems like a pretty good return for us. At the start of the game when the game was more in the balance because of the time remaining Juve attacked well enough, although most of it was from set pieces, a header off the post and two off the line. In the second half because Ajax were completely toothless it didn't require for us to even attack to that degree, although I agree with the point about keeping possession better as that is a form of defence in itself, and can also lead to attacks. I'm still confident that better passing will come, our team is not really setup to play possession football tactically.

 

[Red]

We were never under pressure though. ajax was harmless.

The defence was solid, no doubt about that.

I still feel that the forwards could have done more to help them out, though.

It wasn't a problem last night, but controlling a game when defending a lead is something Juve have not done well quite a while and I want to see signs that that aspect of Juve's game is improving.

 

[Dominic]

we succesfully kept the lead, did we not? Also we quite easily kept a clean sheet. So definite improvement.
anyway our gameplan of yesterday was completely justified. We were at home and in the lead. The ball was in ajax' court. They had to show what they were made off and we easily stopped them. Additionaly we were even unlucky not to have scored several times the first half.

 

[Red]

Like you said, Ajax were pretty clueless, so there was never a real danger.

The question is whether Juve didn't keep the ball because they felt it was unnecessary or because they couldn't.

I guess we'll have a better idea next time Juve has a lead to defend against a good team.