'Murica! (247 Viewers)

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L'autista
Administrator
Sep 23, 2003
84,749
It really isn't. It is to gain support from the marginalized middle class (and of course what you wrote). Dude, we're in a time where nationality, traditions and the existing economy are dissolving. Neither Europe or North America have come up with a pragmatic solution to this. From an economic point of view, Europe is in a ot of trouble and Trump is aware of this.
Traditions is a red herring, IMO. I mean, if we want to talk about traditions then Italy would not have any tomato sauce nor pasta for that matter, since both were imported from other cultures. And traditions have been changing since the beginning of time. Ever since humanity came "Out of Africa". To try to put a cork on that and say "not in my lifetime" is living in denial of the endless change around them: socially, technically, economically, etc.

It's not just traditions either. It's that the younger generation is particularly stuck with unemployment and hand-to-mouth menial jobs with limited skill requirements that places them in direct competition with immigrants.
 

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Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,318
It really isn't. It is to gain support from the marginalized middle class (and of course what you wrote). Dude, we're in a time where nationality, traditions and the existing economy are dissolving. Neither Europe or North America have come up with a pragmatic solution to this. From an economic point of view, Europe is in a lot trouble and Trump is aware of this.
We're in trouble because we keep saying we're in trouble. Truth is it is easier now to produce food, shelter and healthcare than it has ever been. There is no logical reason for us to encounter economic problems. It's all just fear.
Traditions is a red herring, IMO. I mean, if we want to talk about traditions then Italy would not have any tomato sauce nor pasta for that matter, since both were imported from other cultures. And traditions have been changing since the beginning of time. Ever since humanity came "Out of Africa". To try to put a cork on that and say "not in my lifetime" is living in denial of the endless change around them: socially, technically, economically, etc.

It's not just traditions either. It's that the younger generation is particularly stuck with unemployment and hand-to-mouth menial jobs with limited skill requirements that places them in direct competition with immigrants.
I think the time of experimenting with basic income has come.
 

Hængebøffer

Senior Member
Jun 4, 2009
25,185
Traditions is a red herring, IMO. I mean, if we want to talk about traditions then Italy would not have any tomato sauce nor pasta for that matter, since both were imported from other cultures. And traditions have been changing since the beginning of time. Ever since humanity came "Out of Africa". To try to put a cork on that and say "not in my lifetime" is living in denial of the endless change around them: socially, technically, economically, etc.

It's not just traditions either. It's that the younger generation is particularly stuck with unemployment and hand-to-mouth menial jobs with limited skill requirements that places them in direct competition with immigrants.
Please don't get stuck in that I wrote traditions. I don't necessarily agree on what I wrote. I wrote about the people who we shrugged away as racists or conservative idiots earlier. They weren't right (imo), but they had some points whick we're obviously having problems with now (I'm thinking globalization and economy here and not different cultures). No one listened to these people and I do understand why they feel butt fucked from the cultural elite, who, let's be honest, have controlled the public oppionion for many years (at least here in Scandinavia).

- - - Updated - - -

We're in trouble because we keep saying we're in trouble. Truth is it is easier now to produce food, shelter and healthcare than it has ever been. There is no logical reason for us to encounter economic problems. It's all just fear.

I think the time of experimenting with basic income has come.
I agree, but that's not what we're doing.
 

ZoSo

Senior Member
Jul 11, 2011
41,656
Trump's just a lot of hot air. Don't see how people think he is actually racist, it's just marketing really. I don't think even he knows what he would do if he actually got into office.

Sanders is probably the best candidate but far from perfect.
 

Maddy

Oracle of Copenhagen
Jul 10, 2009
16,545
Trump's just a lot of hot air. Don't see how people think he is actually racist, it's just marketing really. I don't think even he knows what he would do if he actually got into office.
If you can win an election by marketing yourself as a bigot and a racist then somethings really rotten. Both among the established and the voters.

Oh, wait. Welcome to 'Murica.

Btw., in Europe we have very similar phenomena to Trump. Front National (Le Pen), Fidesz (Orban), Law and Justice (Kachingy), UKIP (Farage) and so on. In a complex and globalized world; simple answers appeal to the simple minds.

Not a coincidence that working class 'muricans are attracted to Trump and his post factual beliefs. Climate change? No way. Too many illegal immigrants? Build a wall. Terrorist threat? Waterboarding!
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,318
If you can win an election by marketing yourself as a bigot and a racist then somethings really rotten. Both among the established and the voters.

Oh, wait. Welcome to 'Murica.

Btw., in Europe we have very similar phenomena to Trump. Front National (Le Pen), Fidesz (Orban), Law and Justice (Kachingy), UKIP (Farage) and so on. In a complex and globalized world; simple answers appeal to the simple minds.

Not a coincidence that working class 'muricans are attracted to Trump and his post factual beliefs. Climate change? No way. Too many illegal immigrants? Build a wall. Terrorist threat? Waterboarding!
If it weren't for a different and more cautious culture we'd probably elect our own Trump. I guess we've done so much warfare over the centuries, even involving everyone else on the globe, that we have finally installed safety mechanisms. But the ungrounded fears and idiocy are just as much present in Europe as in the US.
 

ZoSo

Senior Member
Jul 11, 2011
41,656
If you can win an election by marketing yourself as a bigot and a racist then somethings really rotten. Both among the established and the voters.

Oh, wait. Welcome to 'Murica.

Btw., in Europe we have very similar phenomena to Trump. Front National (Le Pen), Fidesz (Orban), Law and Justice (Kachingy), UKIP (Farage) and so on. In a complex and globalized world; simple answers appeal to the simple minds.

Not a coincidence that working class 'muricans are attracted to Trump and his post factual beliefs. Climate change? No way. Too many illegal immigrants? Build a wall. Terrorist threat? Waterboarding!
Trump knows how to market himself to that crowd, it's simply Us and Them.
 

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